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I inserted myself into the discussion last night when I probably shouldn’t have, but I do stand by my opinion that Andrew should have been invited to the Manchester event. I, for one, never felt that John Brawley was to blame for this and feel that most people on this site have been very thankful for his contributions, not just about info on the upcoming camera but his openness about the inner workings of a Hollywood set and his methods of shooting. But the disdain displayed to Andrew in this thread is mind boggling. I don’t always agree with him, but the man has wholeheartedly opened his craft and home to a countless amount of strangers for free. There is not one other site in the video community that is completely ad free and he rarely asks for a thank you. I can only imagine the cost it is to upkeep this site. I’d be a liar if I didn’t admit that I find him infuriating at times, but I would never question his devotion to his craft and his readers. With that being said, I feel JB’s reply to the events was unnecessarily rude. Perhaps there was a breakdown in communication as Andrew has already stated but for every person that felt Andrew could have handled the snub differently, they should equally admit that JB could have handled his response differently as well. BM was born on the backs of hobbyists and enthusiasts. We paid for the R&D of the Ursa Pro with every Pocket or Micro we bought. As much as we appreciate their inexpensive cinema cameras, they are only available because we decide to purchase them... it’s like a television show, it only exists at the behest of its viewers. But in the end, they are both artists and artists are passionate, honest and sensitive people... they must be to put themselves and their work out into the world for scrutiny.

Thanks Karim And Dan, yes webrunner is right. It's a cultish following around the Pocket camera. For example, I understand that Facebook targets each post to a subset of my followers on the EOSHD Facebook Page, depending on the subject. It's automatic, I don't have any control over it. But a lot of pitchforks came out for me today on Facebook which confused me because EOSHD supporters, followers and friends don't usually behave like that.... I know why this time was different, because Facebook had targeted a Blackmagic article at the Blackmagic hardcore fanatics and they didn't like what I had to say. As for typical BM roll out, yes it is. Trade shows have less meaning to everybody outside the bubble. Most customers don't want to be teased for half a year or even more before they can get the damn camera in their hands. Blackmagic should stop syncing their announcements to NAB and instead put the announcement out a week before they start shipping. The irony is, here I am feeling upset about being passed over for a camera in my hands... with a hardcore of Blackmagic users saying "what a crybaby EOSHD is" when at the last few camera launches, those very same people were moaning about not having a camera in their hands, because it's late or whatever. At the end of the day, I reflect on the course this thread just took and I regret it. I stand by my hurt over the camera and snub, but I regret what's happened. Take what you read from everyone on forums with a pinch of salt including even yourself whilst saying it! And including me. I am not myself on the internet sometimes, nobody is. The internet is a weird simulation which is causing issues in real society across the globe all the time. It's not real life, it's a machine-assisted facsimile of it. John Brawley and I would not have behaved the same in real life. The internet is an argument generator and a distorted mirror and I might indeed have to shortly go to the pub and have a stiff drink.

Hey Everyone, Here’s a bunch of stuff I’ve shot, graded and edited for music videos between 2012-2018. The shots in the reel not done by me are the drone shots. For you camera nerds, I used...... Sony FS700, FS5, FS7, F55, A7SII, A6500. Panasonic GH3, GH5. DJI X3, X5R.

Andrew, the comments about grading weren’t intended for you specifically. Read the post. I was talking in generalities about recent facebook groups I’d left and a similar entitled tone here. It was not a personal attack but you chose to take it that way. Cmon, I shoot these shots for BMD for exactly this purpose. To be downloaded and graded. If I was truly precious about it I wouldn’t do it again and again would I ? You’re throwing a tantrum, publicly, because you dind’t get an invite to a BMD event that is seems like few even knew about. Somehow you think that’s got something to do with me so you went and wrote a post about me. A really lovely piece too. I’ve said it already a thousand times. I don’t work for them. I don’t have that much to do with them day to day. Last contact I had with anyone at BMD was weeks ago. It’s not my job to make sure YOU get some attention from them. That’s on you to make that case. And by the way, this kind of childish unprofessional behaviour is exactly the kind of reason any company would think twice about working with you. Instead, you launch a highly personal assasination blog post as well as numerous personal attacks because I dared to try and explain that to you in a way that you thought wasn’t deferential enough ? You don’t do this for free. You sell something. I don’t but you actually do. Having traffic come to this site means you have a greater chance of selling something. You sell LUT’s and you sell guides and you use the traffic here to do so. So don’t pretend all this free traffic is somehow a favour to BMD and free publicity. I didn’t even see the post you made about the BMD footage till your personal attack on me, but I noticed when I read your BMD post you’re mixing in a bunch of references to LUT’s you’re trying to flog. How about this... Delete every single post of mine. All the IP that I’ve posted and shared on this forum? All those posts where I’ve shared my knowledge and experience. Go ahead and put your money where your mouth is. JB

The SHEER number of Fake Profiles by supposedly new members (banned members with fake new IDs), and International Trolls from places as far away as Egypt and other places seems to have terribly swelled of late. There should a Rule in Place, making it mandatory for new members to have a cooling off period, from the time of registration to the time of first posting (maybe a week), and then another 24 hours before each of the next 3 posts. There are just too many trolls and IDs by a handful of lurking members whose raison d'être is solely to troll across all communities where open and free debates are encouraged and allowed. While their contributions to tech and filmmaking is bland or non-existent, their trolling is way too much.

In order to put this unfolding drama to an end, I'd propose we use the youtuber's way to end these disputes: a boxing match btw Andrew Reid vs. John Brawley (or a BM rep chosen in this forum). The venue might be the same Manchester's gin distillery where the BM event was held. The match has to be streamed live on vimeo, still to be decided whether to use a BMPCC 4k OR a Olympus E-M10 III.

waaaa happened? drama! I miss the days of ebrahim and his quest to use a stolen slr rangefinder from the eos marketplace forum to buy a ps4

Not missing anything, no. Just hear to talk cameras.

They say it will be on the site soon for pre-orders.

bmcuser forum

I must admit I was kind of shocked to read Andrew’s latest blog entry and it’s conclusion.. especially only days after decrying said press junkets and praising JB. But I understand this must have hit too close from home and to add insult to injury I’m sure BMD (a smaller word of mouth company) has sold a shit ton of cameras thanks to this site and could have made the effort to reach out. JB's reply visibly felt like a stab in the back. I think both parties are blowing this out of proportion. I do find it disheartening to see such feud amongst a host and one of it’s most popular contributors and sincerely hope they can work things out. In any case, I value this site and I’m sure right now is a tense time to manage and review gear ahead of what is announcing itself like an explosive photokina edition and hence would like to show my support to Mr.Reid, even if I don't always share his views. This is his planet. The guy has done a pretty amazing job with this site imo and deserves to be cut a little slack, wether you agree or not with his latest article and/or handling of the situation. We're all human beings and have our good/bad days. Let's not jump to any hurtful conslusions. I do feel an overall tense vibe here and beyond lately. Surely the recent announcements by all the big players has had a dramatic & divisive effect on the photo/video community. We should all relax a bit over the current state of gear announcements, our excitement/ disappointments, frustrations, etc.. in the end we all share a common passion and this is all beneficial to us as consumers. So many options out there and at unprecedented price levels. What a time to be alive!

Sooooo judging from the 50 or so clips I’ve managed find showcasing the Nikon Z7 in video all I can see is a great image with brilliant autofocus, especially the face detection. And if you expose it correctly it almost looks like Kodachrome in motion. Nikon USA has also confirmed the 4K internal bitrate to 144mbps, not 100 as previously reported.

I could answer that, but still haven't tried one

I am finding this thread terribly juvenile and just an overreaction by all parties concerned. It was fine till we were discussing the camera. Let's stick to the camera and keep other things out of it.

2 minute basic grade. Looks good to me

I still want to believe goodwill and good sense can always save the grace. The trouble is when people forget to listen the other side. You Andrew have spoken. Let's now hope for a better insight. Without a little help of a friendly hand is harder to arrive there, that's for sure : -) You'll only have one of those options: 1) internal recording; 2) externally via USB Type-C connector.

Just trying to keep the thread on topic, captain.

Next we'll be finding out VK was at Manchester too!

Cinema5D were at the Manchester event https://***URL not allowed***/blackmagic-pocket-cinema-camera-4k-dual-iso-explained-and-lowlight-footage/ My nemesis.

Isn't that what just happened?

I don't agree with you. There is no risk inviting me to a simple hands-on gathering with a camera and I have been to many before. If you want to read a blog of watered-down PR-lead opinion pieces, there are plenty out there for you to follow instead. Even the risk (of negative publicity) that comes from not inviting me to a hands-on is very low but here it has added up. It rises if the blog has 1 million views since 1 month ago and a 5 year track record of supporting Blackmagic, yet still gets passed over for a simple demo unit. Do you realize, it is a lot of hard work to keep EOSHD going? Then the risk of having your main camera tester / closest DP advisor use the forum for 2 years without acknowledging the site owner A SINGLE TIME adds a little bit as well (just shows a lack of appreciation). Giving demo units to much less known bloggers with much less expertise increases the risk of a frustrated outburst even more, on top of the above and being teased with a camera that won't ship for months. After all that, having an event in Manchester and then John's insults were the straw that broke the camel's back. So Blackmagic really only have themselves to blame if I don't like them very much as a company any more. Best tool for the job is not the Pocket 4K for me. I'll wait for RAW from something else. I don't have an urgent need for it. ProRes is nice. But as certain pros will tell you, it's not enough to just look at the specs sheet and choose a camera, the support from the company is important too as is reliability and whether or not you actually like how the company treats you. A big reason I bought a Leica SL was because they were supportive of EOSHD. It counts for a lot. Doesn't mean to say I not going to be critical about it though, because I spent my hard earned own money on it. When I met the Leica product manager in Berlin, he was very helpful and demoed the new firmware with improved LOG. That meeting came from being critical and basically pointing out that their LOG profile was broken. The same thing applies to Sony, I have been critical of technical aspects of their camera and they listened directly. See below... Yes there is an element of PR about all of this, to try and offer a rebuttal to critical articles and to show they are listening. But there is also an element of truth in it, that they are listening to users and representatives of users, actual shooters, not just "camera reviewers" as John Brawley puts it. There are people out there at the camera companies that value my feedback and I am not going to stop being critical or pointing out bugs, just to please some fanboys.

one more thing andrew! Don't forget that all PR execs have an eye on who will spruik their camera regardless of its faults or failings. I had a mate that used to get invited to weekend freebies by a major manufacturer because he wrote for a national photo mag. Were his reviews 100% impartial? 100% no. How could they be. He's only human. You get schmoozed and fed and watered, are you going to turn round and say their gizmo is a pile of shite? And then lose advertising revenue and potential for future invites? That's why I think we appreciate this site and the few like it - because you can be totally sure that there's none of that malarky. And I'm afraid that if we know that, that BM and Panasonic and all do too. Which means that if you do get invited to a press junket it'll be because whoever invited you is 100% sure you're going to be bedazalled .

I find it hilariously ironic that a couple of days after writing a post on "Why the camera press need to grow a pair of balls" decrying freebies & junkets that Andrew throws his toys out of the pram because BM didn't invite him to one of their junkets. Then Andrew declares that he is so pissed off with being snubbed that he is going cancel his pre-order of their camera. This all comes over as unbelievably petulant & childish behaviour. Andrew then goes on to compound this by posting a ranting blog insulting John Bawley who is one of the rare professional cinematographers who posts on this forum. JB has nothing to do with whether Andrew got invited to the junket or not but that seems irrelevant as he just gets caught in the blowback of Andrew's rage.

I don't think he was asking for a freebie, given he had the camera pre-ordered, he was asking to be invited to check out the camera during a gathering in his hometown. You're comparing apples to oranges anyway. Camera manufacturers depend a lot on blogs, forums, YouTubers, etc. to grow and inform their customers. BMD themselves have benefited from the coverage given on EOSHD, one of the first sites to seriously look at their camera offerings. I don't agree with the blog post he made going after JB, I think he could've handled this differently (I think Andrew conceded that himself) but he was absolutely within his right to feel insulted and to voice that.

Who cares. Freebies and review copies are always a privilege, not a right. I'm a professional in a different field and based on your criteria I'm 'snubbed' by 95% of all the gear makers in my field.

When I first read EOSHD I had no idea what people were talking about. People going on about this 4:2:2 and other confusing stuff. It’s a more animated forum than elsewhere. It’s more diverse. More honest. Everyone seems happy to help.

Yep. To me the ineptness that they have shown is a troubling trend. Yeah they make pretty killer products at a really fair price. But what good is it all if no coordination to amount to crap seems to be the outcome of it. True specs wise in a lot of areas are scare as hens teeth. When the hell it is Really going to ship? This thing could be the best thing since sliced bread, but we don't know when the delivery man is going to show up, or what the hell bread we are getting, let alone how it is going to be sliced. Strange goings on.

Sometimes the most interesting and useful insights (like this one from Andrew) require traversing some difficult ground to get there. With this sort of reflection the preceding discomfort is almost always worth the effort. To explore Andrew's thoughts here a little further: perhaps in addition to being a rather poor 'facsimile' of life, it seems to me the internet becomes at times a powerful and distorting "amplifier" of people's emotional states, but mostly only of those frequencies that deal with anger, fear, rejection, resentment etc. I don't think anyone is immune from this effect, and I suspect the more invested in a community or issue, the more pronounced the effect. I agree that the internet's amplifying effects can have far reaching ramifications, especially when taking into account that the responses are preserved in writing, and when multiplied across thousands and perhaps millions of people on any given issue. This must at least be part of the reason for the recent exacerbation in polarisation that we see in politics (uh oh - sorry to mention the "P" word). But more to the point, perhaps it can help us to simply understand the sometimes difficult dynamics of communication from a human perspective, and especially of online communication where our brains lack the important cues given by real face-to-face interaction. Perhaps the lesson is that in understanding what is happening, it is easier not to put too much importance on the details of what is said, and to recognise that we are all basically the same in this regard. In acknowledging our nature as fragile humans it is far easier to be forgiving on ourselves and others for apparent transgressions, to allow some breathing space for reflection, and then to get back to the task at hand. So Andrew, in regards to the camera in question, I think that if there are matters about its quality and usefulness you would like resolved, it would not surprise me at all if you do get your hands on it one way or another. And if and when you do, I'll look forwards to your insightful review of it.

Well said Mercer, I hope in some days/weeks after the emotional break out settle down, @Andrew Reid and @John Brawley will talk to each other and resolve this unfortunate exchange of rude words in the best way possible.....lossing JB comments will certainly be missed.

They say: Never meet your heroes, because they're sure to disappoint you.... I think it's more like: Never meet your heroes, because they're really human just like you and everyone else on the forum. I hope this forum is big enough for both Andrew and John or John and Andrew, whichever, because I will miss hearing from both of them on a regular basis. Maybe a vitural hand share over PM could happen and we could get back to obsessing over a camera that most of us have yet to hold in our hands.

Still can't stop liking Oly. It's just...man, the things you can do easily with their stuff is just fun. The enjoyment factor compensates for the slightly-behind-the-curve IQ specs. Cant wait to see the Em5III.

@Andrew Reid I visit 3 sites at least once a day. EOSHD, Personal-view and Gearsultz. EOSHD is unique in that it is not only a forum, but a blog foremost that gives ideas and insights that are not being put together in the same way by anybody else. Your perspective gives me confidents about my buying decisions. I bought the NX1 and the a6300 because of you and this site. The way you see things and write about them is a valuable contribution to the community. Keep doing what you love despite what you view as a slight against you, in the end you are defined by your writing not what is written about you. I look forward to you doing more of your excellent blogging in the future.

Mr. Reid, I don't know you and I won't pretend to understand what you are going through, so please do not take this statement the wrong way. However, when you say you are 'feeling really quite down', do you think that your current mental wellbeing is served by continuing to have this discussion? By arguing (no matter how justified) with people on these forums, your blog and Facebook page (all three of which you seem to hold very dear and personal, something which I understand). In my opinion you absolutely did the right thing by locking up this thread temporarily, and my advice to you would be to do it again. Why revel in this energy-consuming discussion? I get that you're dissapointed and feel sleighted by Blackmagic's decision no to hand you the camera for early review, something only exacerbated by the fact that the event was in your own home-time. That must have honestly felt like shit. Nonetheless, scratching the wound left by this event (by returning to the discussion over and over again on these forums) might feel satisfying in the short-term, but it is absolutely not conducive to it healing. I suspect you are not gaining any longterm insight or satisfaction by having this discussion in this manner, and even worse, you might be worsening you're already crummy mood because you are now infecting this website with a discussion that 1) will make it harder to take back anything you say in anger because it is now done in a very public way, and 2) taints your very personal project with a negativity that you probably don't want in your life. Finally, in your anger you might end up taking actions or saying things that will end up doing damage to this project (eoshd.com) which you obviously hold so dear to you. My advice (but hey, who am I) to you would be to give yourself a break - delete the blogpost you made, lock this thread and go for a walk/watch a movie/have a nice dinner with friends. Seriously do anything else for a while instead of having this situation drag you down. When you come back, delete this entire tangent and have this thread be about the Pocket 4K again. If you find Blackmagic's answer to your emails not satisfactory in the future, just don't cover them anymore if it makes you feel better. I just don't believe it is conducive to your wellbeing by dragging the argument into the public (and very ill-informed) sphere. Hope that all makes sense. Thank you for your passion and thanks for hosting this site.

"when" More like "if" it ships? I wouldn't hold your breath of that. Is a very very tough task to develop a camera, Apertus has been working on this a long time. They'll be outgunned by those companies which have a faster development cycle. I view this as a kinda good thing, I hope all companies are striving to make their products "obsolete"! (but remember, you can still keep on shooting with "obsolete" products! I still even use my ancient Panasonic GH1 cameras a few times a year)

Not seeing why this camera would have any banding or moire issues beyond the normal 8-bit problems almost all cameras have. It only makes sense that 10 bit footage will hold up better then any 8 bit codec on the market. Plus no one has mentioned any issues with it including Cinema 5d which are usually harsh on things. I am not a fanboy but this camera is just a big deal to me. 10 bit up to 120fps in HD and 60 in 4k, with an APSC sensor, and solid auto focus, at $1500... that's insane IMO. Another amazing thing is Cinema 5d measured it as having more then a stop more dynamic range then the GH5S or A7SII.

highlight roll off is poor on most sony cams imo and let's not even talk skin tones or overall color science.. it's what sony tried to fix on FS5 mk2. as for broadcast standards let's not forget they are still 720p/1080i. so the 4k crop isn't even a concern for that. shoot externally on a C200/EOS R and you've got your ProRes 10-bit 4:2:2. internally only Canon & Panasonic (and soon Fuji) offer high bitrate ALL-I codecs inside their MILCs which is also nice, especially when shooting water etc. motion artifacts will get your footage rejected by broadcast QC. Sony seem to be the only ones keeping their ALL-I (XAVC-I) codec for their FS7 and 10-bit options for FS5/FS7. If anything, i'd say Sony are the ones crippling their MILCs..

@Andrew Reid I really hope you keep the site going. It bummed me out when previously took a hiatus. I know it's selfish of me to ask for something without paying for it, though I believe I purchased one of your guides at one time. Anyways, it would be hard to believe Blackmagic does not have eye balls on this tread and I hope they will reach out to you with a review unit ASAP. I always look forward to your insights and perspective and hope I have the opportunity to read about your hands on experience with and options about the Pocket 4k.

Andrew, you are cutting off your nose to spite your face. Blackmagic really don't owe you anything for any 'free publicity'. Their Pocket 4k has started a frenzy among the camera world stirring up conversation and leading people to discuss it on forums, maybe you owe Blackmagic for making your site and this thread so popular? Maybe you owe all of your forum members here for contributing all their content here and making this site popular. Maybe you owe John Brawley for his contributions, I know I read this thread mainly because of his input and presence here...... Silly, I know, but the tantrum you seem to be throwing could also be seen as a bit silly too. Seems like nothing really new came from the event and maybe BM didn't think you would want to do an unboxing video...? Your reaction here only serves to diminish your character and reputation and by snubbing the camera based on you not receiving a pre prod version for testing or not being invited to one event. It might also suggest that you can be easily bought which is not what most people want out of an online reviewer. Who knows, maybe a marketing person at BM didn't think it appropriate to invite someone who seems brand focused by being call EOSHD? There are so many reasons why you may have not received an invite.... Just my 2c.

The problem with going with the EF mount is that it'd be positive short term but a negative long term. Canon will continue with DSLRs for as long as possible, and there will be a ton of old lenses to use, but the time will come when the EF mount will become obsolete as mirrorless takes over for Canon. Do you really want your entrance into the full frame game to be based on a mount that will likely decline greatly over the next 10 years? It kind of has to be a new mount. One thing that they could possibly do, which could be interesting, it's bring VSM as seen on the LS300 to the camera, allowing the use of m43, APS-C and pretty much every other type of lense to be used with an adapter without vignetting. This is an option, honestly, that I'm surprised more camera makers haven't done. Being able to punch in exactly what sensor size your lens covers is such a powerful feature imo.