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Blackmagic Pocket Cinema Camera 4K

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1 minute ago, Snowfun said:

How long had you been saving the Century caption? A good job it was an Englishman who reached it first!

Only about a week ;) 

Been trying to position myself to have strike so I could've hit it myself but I'd miscalculated a no ball or a wide somewhere along the line.

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2 minutes ago, BTM_Pix said:

Only about a week ;) 

Been trying to position myself to have strike so I could've hit it myself but I'd miscalculated a no ball or a wide somewhere along the line.

It’s back to the nets for you!

I only got there with an unplanned edge which third man fumbled. 

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On ‎2018‎-‎05‎-‎07 at 12:37 PM, Django said:

nope it got dropped just like on the UM4.6K. here are some numbers i found pulled from bmd forum:

URSA Mini 4.6k:
4.6k – 15.17ms
4k/2160p – 12.64ms
2k/1080p – 6.32ms
Micro Studio: 9.9ms
Micro Cinema: 13.3ms
Pocket: 17.74ms
BMCC: 23.62ms

 

60p can't be worse than 16.7ms, otherwise it is not 60p. Likewise, 240p, 120p, 30p and 24p can't be worse than 4.2 ms, 8.3 ms, 33.3 ms and 41.7 ms respectively. Rolling shutter for any particular sensor can't be worse than the refresh rate for its highest frequency full sensor read.

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5 hours ago, Mokara said:

60p can't be worse than 16.7ms, otherwise it is not 60p. Likewise, 240p, 120p, 30p and 24p can't be worse than 4.2 ms, 8.3 ms, 33.3 ms and 41.7 ms respectively. Rolling shutter for any particular sensor can't be worse than the refresh rate for its highest frequency full sensor read.

Not exactly.  Sensors tend to heat up when you scan them faster, so cameras will often run them slower.  Not sure if it saves power too but that could also be another reason.  They run them at the fastest acceptable speed that they can manage even though a lot of sensors can run much faster.

On "The Resident" the micro shots are easy to spot. I don't know if it's just a wider FOV, but someting about them does look off at times. Micro shots match better in color than any other small camera would, but something about them makes them easy to spot.  Ursa Mini Pro not so much unless there's an extreme highlight or something that clips a little harder than the Alexa would.  But even then it's not like it's offensively clipping or anything, it's just maybe a little more.  The strong halo/lightwrap around bright light sources might be a sign of the SLR magic APO primes, and the usage of the camera for me is another clue as to which camera is which.  Overall though the look is maintained well across all cams.

 

For the limited uses of aerial footage, if that's all from the DJI x7 then those shots are very impressive.  That camera holds up well.

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1 hour ago, Savannah Miller said:

Not exactly.  Sensors tend to heat up when you scan them faster, so cameras will often run them slower.  Not sure if it saves power too but that could also be another reason.  They run them at the fastest acceptable speed that they can manage even though a lot of sensors can run much faster.

I think @Mokara was just pointing out that if you're shooting 60p then the camera only has 1000ms/60 = 16.7ms to capture a frame before the next frame needs to have started, otherwise the camera won't be keeping up with 60 fps.

Your point about sensor temperature is well made though, as I would imagine it has to do with the clock speeds that the processors need to run at, and faster clock speeds often mean running chips at higher voltages, which means more heat, more overheating issues, reliability issues, and power consumption.  Considering the battery requirements there's no wonder the RS on the Sony a6300 etc is so bad!

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Sony already has problems with overheating so that's probably why they can't run their sensors any faster.  Even the latest RED cameras are fairly slow sensor readout even compared to Blackmagic.  That's one of the compromises when you build a larger, higher resolution sensor.

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17 hours ago, Savannah Miller said:

Not exactly.  Sensors tend to heat up when you scan them faster, so cameras will often run them slower.  Not sure if it saves power too but that could also be another reason.  They run them at the fastest acceptable speed that they can manage even though a lot of sensors can run much faster.

On "The Resident" the micro shots are easy to spot. I don't know if it's just a wider FOV, but someting about them does look off at times. Micro shots match better in color than any other small camera would, but something about them makes them easy to spot.  Ursa Mini Pro not so much unless there's an extreme highlight or something that clips a little harder than the Alexa would.  But even then it's not like it's offensively clipping or anything, it's just maybe a little more.  The strong halo/lightwrap around bright light sources might be a sign of the SLR magic APO primes, and the usage of the camera for me is another clue as to which camera is which.  Overall though the look is maintained well across all cams.

 

For the limited uses of aerial footage, if that's all from the DJI x7 then those shots are very impressive.  That camera holds up well.

Sensors can run in spec at whatever their fastest frame rate is otherwise it would not be part of their spec. Heat generation in a sensor (or any memory for that matter) does not come so much from reading the sensor, it comes from write operations, which are going to be fairly constant irrespective of what the sensor is being used for. Even if you are only using portions of the sensor for your image, the entire sensor is being written to constantly, and it has to be capable of sustaining the highest operation frame rate in order to do that.

Overheating in cameras is processor overheating, not sensor overheating.

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5 hours ago, Mokara said:

Sensors can run in spec at whatever their fastest frame rate is otherwise it would not be part of their spec. Heat generation in a sensor (or any memory for that matter) does not come so much from reading the sensor, it comes from write operations, which are going to be fairly constant irrespective of what the sensor is being used for. Even if you are only using portions of the sensor for your image, the entire sensor is being written to constantly, and it has to be capable of sustaining the highest operation frame rate in order to do that.

Overheating in cameras is processor overheating, not sensor overheating.

Are you sure?  The ursa mini 4.6K sensor (at least the one on the Fairchild website) claims it can run at 240fps full sensor readout.  Then why does Blackmagic only run it at 15ms?  Also, the pocket camera was 17ms and they improved it to around 13 with the micro.

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On 5/2/2018 at 12:43 PM, BTM_Pix said:

Look, I've found a right angle USB C adapter.

So I'm not going to waste that bit of research and I'm all for getting another couple of pages out of discussing it now ;)

 

31kwZB8TlnL._SL500_AC_SS350_.jpg

I thought you would be interested...

 

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I read (or heard) somewhere that the BMPCC4k will have HLG. I am curious what codec that would be (H.264?). Anyone have answers?

Also, does anyone know what the FINAL price of the BMPCC 4k would be after all the taxes added to the $1295 price tag? 

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BMPCC4K does not have HLG.  It has an HLG lut for monitoring.  I could be entirely wrong on this but I believe that the cameras internal REC 709 output is not exactly as simple as applying a LUT because ISO and color temperature play a huge role in how the cameras internal colors are processed.  So the Wide DR setting is more complex and takes all of these things into account when you adjust color temperature/iso to deliver the best colors.

 

Depends on where you order from.  If you order in the USA from B&H there are no taxes but your state might charge you some at the end of the year or not.  Whether you want to risk not paying them is up to you.

Kristian Lam from Blackmagic was  using the manfrotto smartphone mount ($10) to secure an SSD to the camera.

https://www.manfrotto.us/product/MCLAMP?gdffi=d4782d53a7a849ef83b3597b37ed37ac&gdfms=7A2335F3F7774B6FB20C16EA4002F5F2&gclid=Cj0KCQjw28_XBRDhARIsAEk21Fiz7d3ju_NtRSlNDk1DD09rEFkMiuNHmgSJXTma9e8xJV4LRSklwE4aAnNyEALw_wcB

 

or this: 

https://www.amazon.com/Ulanzi-Tripod-Mount-Smartphone-Adapter/dp/B01EYFV6FY

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2 hours ago, Savannah Miller said:

BMPCC4K does not have HLG.  It has an HLG lut for monitoring.  I could be entirely wrong on this but I believe that the cameras internal REC 709 output is not exactly as simple as applying a LUT because ISO and color temperature play a huge role in how the cameras internal colors are processed.  So the Wide DR setting is more complex and takes all of these things into account when you adjust color temperature/iso to deliver the best colors.

 

Depends on where you order from.  If you order in the USA from B&H there are no taxes but your state might charge you some at the end of the year or not.  Whether you want to risk not paying them is up to you.

Interesting. Thanks for the reply. I am not completely sure about your HLG explanation though.

 I am noticed that they made a price correction to bring it closer to the $1295 price range. Has abyone else also noticed a price (drop), bringing it closer to $1295 in their country?

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