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Former GH5 videographers, what did you upgrade to afterwards?


billem16
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Guys, I literally can't decide and it's stressing me out so bad. I film mostly weddings, but also starting to do more commercial gigs. The whole reason I'm leaving my line of 3 beloved GH5 is the low light limitations. I would love to simply add a GH5S to my lineup, but I depend on IBIS. I'm just not a gimbal, monopod guy. I prayed the GH6 would have dual native ISO but it doesn't, so I'm basically only looking at full frame now - to get better low light, dynamic range, etc... most options I'm considering also have dual native ISO which is cool. I was very set on saving for the A7Siii / FX3, but they're hard to get ahold of and the price is very high... but also I heard their IBIS is bad if you come from GH5. I really depend on my IBIS. I'm strongly considering the Panasonic S5 / S1 / S1H. Perhaps 1 S5, 2 S1 (or 2 S1H)... idk. My main problem with these S1/S5/S1H options is their 4k60 1.5x crop. I just don't want to deal with crop factors anymore. But right now my front runner is the S1 with paid firmware upgrade.

But what did any of you former GH5 users go to? I know a lot will say Black Magic, but they don't offer IBIS 😞 Any other options I'm not considering that can give me good low light and good IBIS and preferrably full frame?  

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EOSHD Pro Color 5 for Sony cameras EOSHD Z LOG for Nikon CamerasEOSHD C-LOG and Film Profiles for All Canon DSLRs

I went for S1 and then S5 and most recently A7sIII with an fx6 ordered. 

 

I think image-wise the s1/s5 (same image) wins and I love having waveform on the press of a button. But the killer feature which made me go Sony is the autofocus. 

 

I just shot a spot for an electric scooter company and used the autofocus for all the shots, doing dolly shots, tracking the scooter in movement etc and it is phenomenal. Being able to do those shots as a solo operator får outweighs the marginally better image that I get out of the Panasonic. 120/4K is also a nice bonus. 

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S1H, I tried S1 but sent i back after moire issues in testing, the S1H has an OLPF.

The crop factor isn't too much of an issue. Red has it, a few other cameras do. It's only cropping to Super 35 which is still bigger than a GH5 without a speed booster.

That said I recently bought a Sony B-cam for the autofocus which is near flawless and way better than any real person I've ever seen pull.

When it comes to upgrade time I'm going to switch to Sony if Panasonic AF hasn't improved, that's despite the image quality being better on the S1H. In the end I'd rather the easier more practical life.

The A7S3 has a fair few downsides compared to S1H. But that AF makes me jealous.

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On 3/11/2022 at 7:23 AM, jgharding said:

S1H, I tried S1 but sent i back after moire issues in testing, the S1H has an OLPF.

The crop factor isn't too much of an issue. Red has it, a few other cameras do. It's only cropping to Super 35 which is still bigger than a GH5 without a speed booster.

That said I recently bought a Sony B-cam for the autofocus which is near flawless and way better than any real person I've ever seen pull.

When it comes to upgrade time I'm going to switch to Sony if Panasonic AF hasn't improved, that's despite the image quality being better on the S1H. In the end I'd rather the easier more practical life.

The A7S3 has a fair few downsides compared to S1H. But that AF makes me jealous.

I've been a big fan of the S1H since it's release (I've never used one) but in those Slashcam comparison frames @kye posted on the GH6 thread, the S1H was my least favorite, by a lot, and I thought the FX3 was in the top 3 after the Komodo and Canoj R3.

Obviously, it isn't a "scientific" comparison, but it's a comparison nonetheless. I assume the FX3 footage was in the Cinetone profile and I liked the look a lot.

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On 3/10/2022 at 3:39 PM, billem16 said:

Guys, I literally can't decide and it's stressing me out so bad. I film mostly weddings, but also starting to do more commercial gigs. The whole reason I'm leaving my line of 3 beloved GH5 is the low light limitations. I would love to simply add a GH5S to my lineup, but I depend on IBIS. I'm just not a gimbal, monopod guy. I prayed the GH6 would have dual native ISO but it doesn't, so I'm basically only looking at full frame now - to get better low light, dynamic range, etc... most options I'm considering also have dual native ISO which is cool. I was very set on saving for the A7Siii / FX3, but they're hard to get ahold of and the price is very high... but also I heard their IBIS is bad if you come from GH5. I really depend on my IBIS. I'm strongly considering the Panasonic S5 / S1 / S1H. Perhaps 1 S5, 2 S1 (or 2 S1H)... idk. My main problem with these S1/S5/S1H options is their 4k60 1.5x crop. I just don't want to deal with crop factors anymore. But right now my front runner is the S1 with paid firmware upgrade.

But what did any of you former GH5 users go to? I know a lot will say Black Magic, but they don't offer IBIS 😞 Any other options I'm not considering that can give me good low light and good IBIS and preferrably full frame?  

I personally upgraded to the S5, you can read about my S5 User Experience here. But in the end the AF was finally its downfall for me. I have a large collection of Canon EF lenses and CAF is not an option when using the EF adapter; buying L mount lenses was not an option to me due to their cost and the fact no other mainstream camera system uses them (ignoring Sigma and Leica here).

The one time I tried to shoot a project with one of the native lenses I got for free (the Sigma 45mm), the performance was absolutely terrible; pulsing, missed focus, etc. completely unusable.

I, like you, absolutely depended on IBIS, to me it was a lifesaver since I shoot 90% handheld, with that being said I never try to walk without a gimbal, all of my handheld work was using only body movement or completely stationary. Due to shooting handheld, I skipped the GH5S, the C70, and eliminated the R5C as possible upgrade options. 

This year I absolutely had to do something about the AF, so I took the plunge and picked up the C70. So far it has been absolutely incredible; those internal ND filters, DPAF, and CLOG2 are truly game changing for me. You can read about my C70 User Experience here. I still shoot 90% handheld but I have discovered with Lens IS and some post stabilization in DR is almost as good if not as good as IBIS.  I also outfitted the C70 with a cage and handles, and worked on my handheld technique a bit more. The C70 is also heavier which further helps with stability.  Even with all of that, it is still more difficult to get IBIS like stability but it is possible.

For your scenario where you are shooting weddings, a lot of wedding footage is slowed down in post anyway so that would add even more stability to your shots. I am shooting and delivering in real time and it still looks as stable as IBIS shots when I use proper technique. I will admit it is also kind of nice not having to worry about IBIS wobble with wide angle lenses.

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Dual ISO is not the only way to achieve low-light advantage.  The GH6 looks like it will be a good solution for low-light and dynamic range.

Even the GH5ii was a genuine improvement in low-light by the looks of things.

DR Boost on the GH6 starts at 2000 ISO, so most of the time low-light is not going to be a problem.  It's not miles away from the GH5S really.

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As a fellow wedding pro my take on it is, providing you can, is to wait a couple of months.

Why?

The OM-1 and GH6 will have been properly out in the wild for a while and we will have a much better idea what these 4/3 flagships are capable of.

In APSC land, the XH2 should at least have been announced.

Also, I’d give old Panny Boy a chance to see if anything to succeed the S1 line is on it’s way.

S5 possibly too soon but the S1 is either going to get replaced or junked.

Personally, if they can get the AF sorted, they have the basis for arguably the ‘best’ system.

Current S5, S1H and S1R user.

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XT4
Punches above its weight with noise control in low light (x-trans noise is always nicer)
Not full frame but focal reducers are there (and excellent Fringer non-reducer adapters)
Only thing is that the IBIS behaves slightly differently on different fuji lenses. Some it's slightly jerky, some it's great.
Manual lenses you can kind of tune it yourself by inputting a different focal lenght setting
Much more useable AF (okay, depends...)

Having full bit depth h.265 and good bitrates in all resolutions and framerates and all capture modes felt amazing after GH5 which had a lot of gotchas in certain modes like VFR only being 8 bit

Size and looks beat the gh5 too though I can't say 'ergos' are superior necessarily for practical use

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On 3/13/2022 at 2:11 AM, mercer said:

I've been a big fan of the S1H since it's release (I've never used one) but in those Slashcam comparison frames @kye posted on the GH6 thread, the S1H was my least favorite, by a lot, and I thought the FX3 was in the top 3 after the Komodo and Canoj R3.

Obviously, it isn't a "scientific" comparison, but it's a comparison nonetheless. I assume the FX3 footage was in the Cinetone profile and I liked the look a lot.

yeah i guess it's all preference. I now have an S1H and ZVE10 and you can match em nearly perfectly. Trouble with comparisons is everyone has a different post pipeline.

The default Pana LUT is a bit rubbish, everything goes pink.

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7 hours ago, jgharding said:

yeah i guess it's all preference. I now have an S1H and ZVE10 and you can match em nearly perfectly. Trouble with comparisons is everyone has a different post pipeline.

What picture profile are you shooting in on the ZV E10???

I have an a6500 and shooting in S-LOG2 with pretty much any color gamut is an act of futility.

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7 hours ago, jgharding said:

yeah i guess it's all preference. I now have an S1H and ZVE10 and you can match em nearly perfectly. Trouble with comparisons is everyone has a different post pipeline.

The default Pana LUT is a bit rubbish, everything goes pink.

Sorry, I probably should have been clearer with my  comment. My point was that as much as I like the output from the S1H, it seems that the FX3/a7siii are highly capable of creating amazing images, especially with that Cinetone profile, so if you really like the AF, I wouldn't necessarily say that the S1H has a highly superior image. 

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9 hours ago, mercer said:

Sorry, I probably should have been clearer with my  comment. My point was that as much as I like the output from the S1H, it seems that the FX3/a7siii are highly capable of creating amazing images, especially with that Cinetone profile, so if you really like the AF, I wouldn't necessarily say that the S1H has a highly superior image. 

yeah you're right I think, it's all very small differences now and most can be close to matched with another.

I do prefer the S1H generally but as I say I'll switch come the next Pana body if AF doesn't improve.

9 hours ago, Mark Romero 2 said:

What picture profile are you shooting in on the ZV E10???

I have an a6500 and shooting in S-LOG2 with pretty much any color gamut is an act of futility.

I use either Sgamut3.cine with Slog2, or HLG with Rec2020, I spent a few days playing with both and although the road to get there is different you can make them near identical.

HLG is preferable to me cos you can expose normally, Slog2 still requires over exposure per the meters in order to look right which i find really annoying

They do seem to have exactly the same DR once you post piepline them properly though, which says to me that DR is (logically) limited by the sensor really, not which flat gamme curve you slap on it.

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I went to an S1 from my GH5s, actually I still use both. The S1 has been amazing image and low light wise, although the slow motion is a bit aggravating. The GH5 could do really good down sampled HD, meaning the 1080p60 was really good. The S1 doesn't do HD very well, so you are kind of stuck with the cropped 4k60, which isn't as bad as I thought it would be, just have to be selective with what lenses I use. Other than that I don't have any complaints, the image is a huge step up from the GH5 for sure!

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I bought an S1 and a7siii then decided to sell S1 and get a7iv to match with A7siii 

I love the s1 footage tho but not the clunky weight. The sony's all use same batteries with the great autofocus small size  just made more sense to go sony from here on out.

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10 hours ago, jgharding said:

yeah you're right I think, it's all very small differences now and most can be close to matched with another.

I do prefer the S1H generally but as I say I'll switch come the next Pana body if AF doesn't improve.

I use either Sgamut3.cine with Slog2, or HLG with Rec2020, I spent a few days playing with both and although the road to get there is different you can make them near identical.

HLG is preferable to me cos you can expose normally, Slog2 still requires over exposure per the meters in order to look right which i find really annoying

They do seem to have exactly the same DR once you post piepline them properly though, which says to me that DR is (logically) limited by the sensor really, not which flat gamme curve you slap on it.

Thanks for the explanation. Much appreciated.

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I have an S1, an S1H, and I still have a GH5 as a loaner for other filmmakers I work with, and because I have been working on the same project for a few years - so I haven't had a chance to shoot something in 4:3 yet! I had an S5 briefly but found it hard to hit critical focus.

One thing that I love about the S line is the Fotodiox ND Throttle adapter, which essentially gives me an EF mount with a built in variable ND behind the lens. I have the L mount 24-105 but I never really use it. My Contax kit has been a thrill to use with this, and for a zoom I just piked up and am testing a Tokina 28-70mm 2.8.

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