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Andrew Reid

Will Canon recall the EOS R5? Small first shipments

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He mentions the overheating issues he experienced and even admits the R5 is not a useable 8K camera due to the overheating unless there is a firmware/hardware fix.

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EOSHD Pro Color for Sony cameras EOSHD Pro LOG for Sony CamerasEOSHD C-LOG and Film Profiles for All Canon DSLRs

I think Canon might have rushed this camera to market with the release of Sony's A7s3. It's all about keeping some of the users from switching to the Sony system. It looks like the Sony has some issues with overheating too, albeit seemingly not as bad. I guess nothing replaces that cinema camera that both of these companies sell. It would seem real advancement from small bodies, cinema specs and value will have to come from companies like Nikon, Pentax, and Olympus that are not invested in the big body, high-end cinema market.

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Call me paranoid if you want, but I think the overheating of the r5 and r6 is quite a marketing trap. I have already seen several videos where it is mentioned that heating occurs at very different times and several times they have said that the camera is cold to the touch (or at room temperature).
In my view, I believe that overheating is a limit set by Canon through software, I do not think it is a real hardware problem. Canon blocked the camera with a false heat alarm to generate all this debate and controversy on the matter. Then in a few months they will fix it with a simple firmware, because the problem is that, only software. In this way Cannon earns a couple more months of free advertising for his latest product.
If the camera can only be fixed by firmware, I would be very inclined to this theory (in my opinion) and would stop believing Canon. It is all very strange.

But hey, it's just my theory.

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One thing is for sure, it’s a FUCKING SHITSHOW.

What do Canon do?

Are they actually even doing anything or is there more hype over this controversy on this particular forum bubble than there is in the rest of the inter-world?

I would respect Canon enormously if they put up their hand and said, “yup, we fucked up here. Stick with us and it may not be until 2021, but both the R5 and R6 are going to get some heat management updates”.

OK, the Sonyloverboys will be all over that as will a lot of others, but so what, sometimes you just have to hold your hand up, take the flak and come out the other side stronger because really it’s ‘just’ the heat issue here that is the only problem with these cameras otherwise you’d have at least one of them would’ve you?

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From others photo forums it seems an assault to try to get a R5..... here is so video centric that people think that canon only cares about video..... they only care about selling and if they are selling much more than expected then why you would do a recall..... you could create in 6 months a body with fan for video and stick the same internals for video people and actually that should be the best move.....

People here are obsessed that canon would recall it to better compete with the A7S III, but I'm ready to bet that for every 10 R5 there will be 1 A7S III sold so not sure is canon priority to compete with A7S is more to compete with A7 and Z photo camera line. 

Still R5 overheat situation is a mess. I fine with limits but if they are predictable and not affected by simply having the camera on...... if not the video part is just a toy. The issue is that is an amazing photo camera so it will sell in big quantity and canon will get away with the overheating issue

Affaire a suivre....

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Why there is no heatsink in the first place is a huge clusterfuckup by itself. NO HEATSINK! Who did design that camera?! I can understand Sony, who put in the effort to mitigate overheating - efficient heatsink, 12 mp sensor, etc. They could not make the camera bigger and put a fan, cos of their philosphy OK, thats not perfect. But I dont see any excuse for Canon. 

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7 minutes ago, Amazeballs said:

Why there is no heat think in the first place is a huge clusterfuckup by itself. NO HEAT THINK! Who did design that camera?! I can understand Sony, who put in the effort to mitigate overheating - efficient heat think, 12 mp sensor, etc. They could not make the camera bigger and put a fan, cos of their philosphy OK, thats not perfect. But I dont see any excuse for Canon. 

Maybe it was designed to do some line-skipping 4K at 30fps and management suddenly told it should also do 8K, 4K HQ, RAW and slomo?
Maybe they thought they could get away with the overheating as Sony always did in the past?
Maybe the heatsinks where out of stock due to Covid-19?
Maybe they just want to sell you the upcoming EF-RF cooling adapter for an aditional $499?

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I think it is possible Canon had several prototypes with slight differences, one of which had overheating problem mitigated. If so – this solution can theoretically be applied in 2-3 months, to have new units shipping with less overheating.

It is also possible that the problem is not as bad as the overheating safety feature is. A couple of reviewers pointed out that R5 doesn't get too hot to the touch, as well as a7SIII feeling hotter. Of course that may be attributed to better insulation.

In any case they have to address this if they want to sell more cameras to hybrid shooters. They don't risk loosing sales of their cinema cameras after all of this anyway XD

On the other hand, I've read on canonrumors that they're planning to release RF cinema camera this year ... R5C ? 😄

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4 hours ago, wolf33d said:

Could also say Canon puts Sony to shame with an IBIS so much better it looks like 5y technology difference, with much better body and ergonomics, no crop in 4K120, an more importantly actual stills capability (VS 12mpx, it’s not 1990).

Everything is relative. We all have different needs. Neither products are bad in this case. Except the overheating if indeed the R5 can’t record a video after 30 stills (I still have a hard time believing that) and that Canon doesn’t do anything about it. 

 

The reasons you listed and then some (plasticky feel, color science, proprietary lens mount, proprietary accessories, etc) is why I am still not considering the A7SIII. So yes I agree that the A7SIII is far from perfect.  When it comes to IBIS....IMO my GoPro has better software stabilization than all of these $4K bodies put together. Hypersmooth 2.0 is nothing short of incredible and it really makes me wonder why the camera makers do not invest more in software stabilization; maybe due to sensor size it is more complex.

 

 

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3 hours ago, Wild Ranger said:

Call me paranoid if you want, but I think the overheating of the r5 and r6 is quite a marketing trap. I have already seen several videos where it is mentioned that heating occurs at very different times and several times they have said that the camera is cold to the touch (or at room temperature).
In my view, I believe that overheating is a limit set by Canon through software, I do not think it is a real hardware problem. Canon blocked the camera with a false heat alarm to generate all this debate and controversy on the matter. Then in a few months they will fix it with a simple firmware, because the problem is that, only software. In this way Cannon earns a couple more months of free advertising for his latest product.
If the camera can only be fixed by firmware, I would be very inclined to this theory (in my opinion) and would stop believing Canon. It is all very strange.

But hey, it's just my theory.

I love a good conspiracy theory but even I don't believe any company would deliberately do this. Overheating is a horrible problem to have and a marketing nightmare, Canon could have easily crippled it in the more traditional ways like severe 8K and 4K120 recording limits (i.e. 60s or 120s max) and made the other modes work flawlessly which is pretty much what was expected by the market. 

What I think happened is a combination of the pandemic disrupting their normal feedback process, fewer bodies in fewer hands around the world possibly meant less feedback to begin with, a spec war with Sony making them too aggressive in their technology push, the retirement of several more traditionally minded executives within Canon leadership, and the addition of IBIS into such a small body which moves the sensor away from a place where it can more easily be cooled.

And maybe it is just me, but if this camera is so close to overheating at all times, I have a hard time believing that it will never overheat just taking pictures. I know there haven't been any reports of this yet, but if 20-30 pictures pushed this camera to report 0min for video....that sounds like it may not make it through a 12hr wedding in Florida on a 95F day with 100% humidity.

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2 minutes ago, herein2020 said:

I love a good conspiracy theory but even I don't believe any company would deliberately do this. Overheating is a horrible problem to have and a marketing nightmare, Canon could have easily crippled it in the more traditional ways like severe 8K and 4K120 recording limits (i.e. 60s or 120s max) and made the other modes work flawlessly which is pretty much what was expected by the market. 

What I think happened is a combination of the pandemic disrupting their normal feedback process, fewer bodies in fewer hands around the world possibly meant less feedback to begin with, a spec war with Sony making them too aggressive in their technology push, the retirement of several more traditionally minded executives within Canon leadership, and the addition of IBIS into such a small body which moves the sensor away from a place where it can more easily be cooled.

And maybe it is just me, but if this camera is so close to overheating at all times, I have a hard time believing that it will never overheat just taking pictures. I know there haven't been any reports of this yet, but if 20-30 pictures pushed this camera to report 0min for video....that sounds like it may not make it through a 12hr wedding in Florida on a 95F day with 100% humidity.

First reports on photo forum seems good in this regards some went 2 batteries and more than 1200 pictures without issue but more real reports are needed.

video is a big issue...

 

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The best thing they can do is use a more modern and efficient CPU. Maybe buy from apple or Samsung their previous generation smartphone architecture.

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For me I need to see 2 major things from a canon recall/firmware update

1) no overheating.

2) better c-log with 15 stops of dynamic range. 

I prefer the canon body feel over the sony and the ND les adapter is a nice touch.

I also own all canon glass and am not sure how the autofocus will be on the sony with canon glass.

 

Maybe canon can move to pharma like kodak 😅

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15 minutes ago, Andrew Reid said:

Haha, just registered. Your language and articles are great, your camera journalism is unheard of. You and camera conspiracies make a great team.

 

nice , are you the next canon CEO ? 
 

Cheers

chris

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9 hours ago, Wild Ranger said:

Call me paranoid if you want, but I think the overheating of the r5 and r6 is quite a marketing trap. I have already seen several videos where it is mentioned that heating occurs at very different times and several times they have said that the camera is cold to the touch (or at room temperature).
In my view, I believe that overheating is a limit set by Canon through software, I do not think it is a real hardware problem. Canon blocked the camera with a false heat alarm to generate all this debate and controversy on the matter. Then in a few months they will fix it with a simple firmware, because the problem is that, only software. In this way Cannon earns a couple more months of free advertising for his latest product.
If the camera can only be fixed by firmware, I would be very inclined to this theory (in my opinion) and would stop believing Canon. It is all very strange.

But hey, it's just my theory.

They wanted bad press? Wouldn't a camera with no major issues and 8k be way better press? I can't see them doing this intentionally. 

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50 minutes ago, gt3rs said:

NFS has a fairly detailed overheat test in various modes. No link as their are not Andrew's friends. 

I saw a NFS video where they went through the modes, showing short clips but hadn't seen an overheating test.  I'll check it out.

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Ha, Canon deliberately released a camera in order to garner negative publicity??

Yeah right. Only people that say, “bad publicity is better than no publicity” ever believe that sentiment to be true.

There’s a saying, “mud sticks”, but there is an even more pertinent one, “there’s no smoke without fire”.

Of course Canon didn’t intentionally release a camera they will probably have to recall. Only in a tin foil hat world would anyone do that.

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