Mark Romero 2 Posted May 17, 2020 Share Posted May 17, 2020 3 hours ago, Video Hummus said: The Panasonic lenses are expensive because they are extremely well built and feature-full. Even the 24-105 F4 is a beast with everything you mentioned and semi-macro ability. Imagine if it had PDAF...it would have sold much, much better. Yeah, almost forgot about the 1:2 macro. It's a very durable lens, too. Don't ask me how I know I got the S1 and 24-105 f/4 as a kit to save money, and I was 95% sure I would turn around and sell the 24-105, but I just couldn't do it. Again, not the sexiest lens, but it is just so versatile. Lux Shots 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mark Romero 2 Posted May 17, 2020 Share Posted May 17, 2020 17 hours ago, PannySVHS said: Putting a Unitor branded Soligor 35-70mm 2.5-3.5 zoom on there and cinema heaven is at your palms. From what I saw on youtube, the Soligor 35-70 seems to have very little contrast. Am I missing something here???? I mean, I tend to like an image that is not "clinical" but the Soligor seems to have VVVEEERRRYYYY low contrast. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mark Romero 2 Posted May 17, 2020 Share Posted May 17, 2020 13 hours ago, sanveer said: IMHO Panasonic invested too much on the EVF and LCD. They should have left that high quality of both solely for the S1H. And priced the S1 at $2000 to compete with the A7iii (which has way superior autofocus and much faster shooting rate). Also the S1 should have had Dual SD card slots, instead of one SD and one XQD. Pricing it at $2000 would have ensured it sold way more than it did. You are probably right about that. I think Panasonic really envisioned the S1 as a fast-shooting stills camera as well as a video camera, hence the non-sd card slot. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheBoogieKnight Posted May 17, 2020 Share Posted May 17, 2020 13 hours ago, PannySVHS said: S1 has some crazy tricks up its sleeves. Shooting at ISO 4000 in super low light and pushing it to 12800 eq. I would rate it four stops above a GH5. Is this only certain photo styles? Just I tried this last night and the results were identical at every ISO from 4,000 to 51,200.This was on the standard profile. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Simon Young Posted May 17, 2020 Share Posted May 17, 2020 4 hours ago, Super8 said: Don't they share the same sensor as the Z6 and A73 ? Looking at this comparison (side by side 0 I like the A73 better. Stop trolling and leave Ebrahim. You think that is even remotely relevant as an image quality comparison? Full VLOG 10bit internal is something the 8bit Sonys with their shitty s-log won’t even come close to regarding color and dr. PannySVHS 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sanveer Posted May 17, 2020 Share Posted May 17, 2020 2 hours ago, Mark Romero 2 said: I think Panasonic really envisioned the S1 as a fast-shooting stills camera as well as a video camera, hence the non-sd card slot. You're right. But a V90 or V60 card could easily have handled the necessary bandh width for both 4k at high bitrates, and well as RAW photo buffer (as one would notice from the Sony A7iii, which had 2 SD card slots, one of which is strangely UHS-I). The quality difference between the 150mbps and 400mbps is so minor, that most people prefer using the 150mbps codec. Panasonic can still re-release the S1, with a lower resolution EVF (this one with the higher resolution and refresh rate was probably also nesting into the battery) and LCD, and price it at $,2000 (or better still, at $1899), and it will outsell many other full frame cameras. Panasonic also needs to ensure that its lenses are smaller and lower priced for the L-mount. Sigma is obviously at it, it probably just needs to hurry up. After the A7iii, most full frame cameras are finding it difficult to price themselves above $2000 and sell well enough. Especially if they can't match the autofocus, shooting speeds, and battery life, among other things. Panasonic will really have to make some seriously tough decisions for the GH6. It has to be Below the $2000 Price, and thus not have any unnecessary hardware features that would increase its price. Because it becomes even more difficult to justify a M43 camera costing more than a Full Frame Camera. Plus, it would have to add some features that even full frame video shooters don't have (limitless recording, maybe audio bit depth, much higher video and photo shooting speeds, more high res photo options, maybe smartphone-like HDR, multi-frame video HDR, superb dual ISO etc). Video Hummus and Super8 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
omega1978 Posted May 17, 2020 Share Posted May 17, 2020 3 hours ago, Mark Romero 2 said: From what I saw on youtube, the Soligor 35-70 seems to have very little contrast. Am I missing something here???? I mean, I tend to like an image that is not "clinical" but the Soligor seems to have VVVEEERRRYYYY low contrast. The guy here has written after, that with a lenshood und close to F4 get sharper and footage with more contrast and fewer haziness Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Super8 Posted May 17, 2020 Share Posted May 17, 2020 The S1 seems like the better camera in it's class for sure. If anyone has a good link that showcases the S1 please post it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thebrothersthre3 Posted May 17, 2020 Share Posted May 17, 2020 53 minutes ago, Super8 said: The S1 seems like the better camera in it's class for sure. If anyone has a good link that showcases the S1 please post it. Gerald Undone did some good tests against the A73. Though I think the A7 is a fine camera though plagued by really heavy noise reduction. The z6, s1, and a73 do share the same sensor or a variant. There is quite a bit of S1H footage online, same image. Not so much the S1 but the image is the same mostly other then the higher bitrate option on the S1H and anti aliasing filter. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Super8 Posted May 17, 2020 Share Posted May 17, 2020 5 minutes ago, thebrothersthre3 said: Gerald Undone did some good tests against the A73. Though I think the A7 is a fine camera though plagued by really heavy noise reduction. The z6, s1, and a73 do share the same sensor or a variant. There is quite a bit of S1H footage online, same image. Not so much the S1 but the image is the same mostly other then the higher bitrate option on the S1H and anti aliasing filter. I didn't really have the S1 on my radar but this threads go my attention. Not to be out of line but how dose the S1 compare to the S1H in terms of data rate and dynamic range? How close is the S1 to the S1H in terms of image quality? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thebrothersthre3 Posted May 17, 2020 Share Posted May 17, 2020 17 minutes ago, Super8 said: I didn't really have the S1 on my radar but this threads go my attention. Not to be out of line but how dose the S1 compare to the S1H in terms of data rate and dynamic range? How close is the S1 to the S1H in terms of image quality? Cinema 5d measured the S1H having more dynamic range in 6k. Overall they seem to be the same sensor and same performance. The S1 is limited to 150mbps Long gop while the S1H can do 400mbps all-i. I personally never noticed a difference between 150 and 400 on the GH5 but can’t comment on the S1 vs S1H. If you want to get the S1H for the 6k keep in mind you can’t monitor externally when shooting 6k. Super8, Emanuel and Mark Romero 2 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mark Romero 2 Posted May 17, 2020 Share Posted May 17, 2020 22 minutes ago, thebrothersthre3 said: Gerald Undone did some good tests against the A73. Though I think the A7 is a fine camera though plagued by really heavy noise reduction. The z6, s1, and a73 do share the same sensor or a variant. There is quite a bit of S1H footage online, same image. Not so much the S1 but the image is the same mostly other then the higher bitrate option on the S1H and anti aliasing filter. The a7 III is a good camera, I am sure. I much prefer the 10-bit vlog 150Mbs codec out of the S1 compared to the 8-bit 100Mbs SLOG 2 codec out of my a6500 (which although different size sensor, has the same codec). In particular, if I am using the various curves in resolve like hue vs hue, hue vs sat, hue vs luminence, I can get much better results from the S1 footage. Plus the noise is much better controlled in the shadows (although this probably has a lot to do with the S1 being a full frame sensor vs the a6500 aps-c frame sensor). With the a6500, I really was having to keep the exposure up around +1.5 stops or so to keep the noise at bay in the shadows. With the S1, I don't find I have to overexpose much (if at all, really). And the IBIS on the S1 is pretty spectacular. Emanuel 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mark Romero 2 Posted May 17, 2020 Share Posted May 17, 2020 26 minutes ago, Super8 said: I didn't really have the S1 on my radar but this threads go my attention. Not to be out of line but how dose the S1 compare to the S1H in terms of data rate and dynamic range? How close is the S1 to the S1H in terms of image quality? As @thebrothersthre3 pointed out, shooting the S1 in 6K and then down-resing in post to 4K or 1080p will give you less noise, hence giving you more dynamic range (since with the 4K image of the S1, you might have to crush the shadows a bit to get rid of the noise, although i find the noise pattern of the S1 to be minor and more film like than my Sony or Nikon cameras). Super8 and Emanuel 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Video Hummus Posted May 17, 2020 Share Posted May 17, 2020 6 hours ago, sanveer said: The quality difference between the 150mbps and 400mbps is so minor, that most people prefer using the 150mbps codec. I’m one of them. I only use the 400 All-I if there is a lot of moving water (water fall) or other random motion (trees branches in the wind, etc...) but even then the 150Mbps LongGOP still does amazingly well with motion. The differences are so minor, especially if it’s going to be compressed to YouTube or other web platform with h.264 anyway... All-I is much easier on the machine with editing however...and I do use it for that. 6 hours ago, sanveer said: Panasonic will really have to make some seriously tough decisions for the GH6. I agree. It’s becoming increasingly competitive in the FF market with exciting features like 6K from the S1H and the rumored R5. They need to sell M43 as a whole system: lighter, fast readout, smaller fast aperture lenses, 6K 24/24/30p with limitless recording and 4K120p with sound would be a step up. Pair it with a smaller body But very capable GX10 for a b-cam. Would be quite nice. Maybe some RAW video special sauce (doubtful), some updated varicam color science and full vlog to really kick it over the fences. Would be a compelling second system along side their full frame. Emanuel and sanveer 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PannySVHS Posted May 17, 2020 Share Posted May 17, 2020 GH6, S35 sensor with mft mount like LS300, still with IBIS. Full 3 to 2 sensor readout at 60p and 4K at 120p. Internal Prores plus h264 and h265 flavours. Timecode In and out. Battery grip with SDI. Full VLOG with true zero sharpening and noise reduction. Flawless HD like GH5, which S1 and S1H don´t provide that unfortunately. 10 bit in high frame rates. 2000 EU. Deal! 12 hours ago, Mark Romero 2 said: From what I saw on youtube, the Soligor 35-70 seems to have very little contrast. Am I missing something here???? I mean, I tend to like an image that is not "clinical" but the Soligor seems to have VVVEEERRRYYYY low contrast. I enjoy mine. Have only tested it inside and was surpised by its image quality on speedboosted mft. Simon Young, sanveer and IronFilm 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Administrators Andrew Reid Posted May 18, 2020 Author Administrators Share Posted May 18, 2020 Just ordered the Hanimex 35-70 from eBay @PannySVHS Looking forward to seeing if it takes the edge off digital I can also recommend the Minolta 35-70mm MD (F3.5) It's got a nice 3D rendering, and very compact. PannySVHS 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Super Members BTM_Pix Posted May 18, 2020 Super Members Share Posted May 18, 2020 6 hours ago, Andrew Reid said: I can also recommend the Minolta 35-70mm MD (F3.5) It's got a nice 3D rendering, and very compact. I very nearly bought the Leica housed version of it but then came across the Minolta one for under £30 if I remember rightly. Using it here with the Leica T and its a very nice compact setup. Andrew Reid and PannySVHS 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bjohn Posted May 18, 2020 Share Posted May 18, 2020 18 hours ago, Super8 said: The S1 seems like the better camera in it's class for sure. If anyone has a good link that showcases the S1 please post it. A few of the recent videos from this person in Japan use the S1 to great effect: https://vimeo.com/yasunariarai Here's one for example; If you explore this person's videos you'll also fine some really excellent work (best I've seen) using the Sigma FP. Super8 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PannySVHS Posted May 18, 2020 Share Posted May 18, 2020 11 hours ago, Andrew Reid said: Just ordered the Hanimex 35-70 from eBay @PannySVHS Looking forward to seeing if it takes the edge off digital I can also recommend the Minolta 35-70mm MD (F3.5) It's got a nice 3D rendering, and very compact. Cool! Cannot wait to hear how you like it! I got the Unitor labeled version. The Soligor version was pretty well received back then by photomagazines. If you look at the original magazine ad, you can see, Soligor was selling it as a pro lens. I bought mine as a poor mans Minolta 35 - 70:) The Minolta in version III is supposed to be one of the best 2x zooms. So it is a bit adventerous that you bought that Hanimex since you own the Minolta, Andrew.:) @BTM_Pix That´s a steal! 2x zooms are something to check out, as often written on this forum. My Tokina 25 to 50 is really cool, giving cinematic quality to light by an instant. Mine is even parfocal at 25 and 50mm! One thing from other testers about this lens, wide open it is very sensitive to reflections and backlight but otherwise still nicely resolving on sensors. Back to the S1. If Panasonic can give us perfect HD on both the S1 and S1H up to 60p I would feel spoiled! Until now it seems worse to than G6 regarding mushiness of textures and aliasing. There is one thing I wanna share with you. I hope it´s only an exception. My camera shut off with 25% power left on the display. I was using the original battery. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Justforfun Posted May 18, 2020 Share Posted May 18, 2020 I decided to stick with my S1 instead of upgrading to the S1H or switching over to pocket 6k or zcam f6. The S1 for web delivery is basically identical to the S1H minus the 6k. Again, one has to factor the devices for most people viewing your content. Most dont even have 4k monitors and limited to 1080 on their phones. Second, for paid gig, a Ninja V is almost required anyway for monitoring plus ease of editing of prores /dnx files. The AF is not great, but for its usable for certain shots. The 24-105 kit lens is also the most versatile kit lens with the macro capability and being parfocal. I was thinking of getting the XT4 but as I go back to my f log XT3 files vs vlog S1 files I just get reminded how great the S1 image quality is. I use a black pro mist to soften some of the sharpness IronFilm, PannySVHS and austinchimp 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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