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Andrew Reid

Dynamic range test - EOS R / X-T3 / Z7 / A7 III / GH5S / who has the best LOG?

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5 hours ago, Shirozina said:

There is a basic error in the article regarding 8bit in video - it's not RGB it's YCbCr which means the tonal graduation is much more than 256 steps and the gamut is not 16million colours.  

What’s with the RGB Luma range in the menus of the NX1 then? That’s 0-255 :)

I think YCbCr is just an HDMI thing and it’s really an RGB image at the core

Also betting some so called 10bit cameras do an 8bit sensor readout like with the GH4 10bit HDMI, there was no advantage to be had.

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EOSHD Pro Color for Sony cameras EOSHD Pro LOG for Sony CamerasEOSHD C-LOG and Film Profiles for All Canon DSLRs
1 hour ago, Andrew Reid said:

Maybe I can :)

Well, after finally putting a card in it and doing some shooting, my advice would be that if you venture outdoors with it, take an EVF or run the risk of having to buy a neck brace on the way home.

On the upside if you get caught it in a downpour, put the camera in record for 5 minutes and you will have a very functional hand warmer and hairdryer combo.

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2 hours ago, Andrew Reid said:

Maybe I can :)

DqcAl6UXQAIi3ud.jpg-large.jpeg

Awesome stuff! Looking forward to hear your impressions mate, unfortunately i haven't had enough time to play with mine but I love it so far! (just make sure you have enough batteries with you!) 😛

ps. FilmConvert also just released the camera pack for the BBMPCC4K, result!

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The slight catch is that the camera is at my girlfriend's in Berlin! I won't get it until Tuesday or Wednesday next week. That gives me at least 4 days to stitch a nice rain jacket for it. Or maybe a small umbrella that attaches to the hotshoe?

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2 minutes ago, Andrew Reid said:

The slight catch is that the camera is at my girlfriend's in Berlin! I won't get it until Tuesday or Wednesday next week. That gives me at least 4 days to stitch a nice rain jacket for it. Or maybe a small umbrella that attaches to the hotshoe?

Ahah, the hotshoe umbrella it's quite a cool idea! 🤣

Kidding aside you should be fine covering the camera as the two top exhausts are only passive and doesn't seem to give out a lot of heat, the active is the one at the bottom (and that one gets quite warm!)

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1 hour ago, Andrew Reid said:

What’s with the RGB Luma range in the menus of the NX1 then? That’s 0-255 :)

I think YCbCr is just an HDMI thing and it’s really an RGB image at the core

Also betting some so called 10bit cameras do an 8bit sensor readout like with the GH4 10bit HDMI, there was no advantage to be had.

It's RGB from the sensor but then it's processed into YCbCr for the codec but don't take my word for it -  do some research on video camera output formats ;) 

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8 hours ago, Deadcode said:

Probably there IS a difference between N-Log and Flat, just like with the Sonys. Cine 4 has 2 stops narrower dynamic range compared to SLOG2

I think middle grey should be exposed to the same level. If we expose for the highlights it's much harder match the shots in post.

For sure about middle gray, but as in this test it wasn't at least the highlight can be use in reference because as said before the z7 10 bit log file shadaows are completely crushed. As I said before at least compared to the A73 the z7 is completely underexposed, you can clearly see it in the bulb or any other highlight like the piano keys. I finally dwas able to download the vimeo high bitrate one and tried to match highlight in light-room as it is only software I know which has ev slider (If someone knows how to do it in Davinci). As I presume before, it was clearly at least a stop more underexposed. I don't know what it would do for the shadows, how much would be able to recover but it won't be as crushed as now. I would hope Andres Reid would at least do this one for the test because their is no blame from me as it is a completely new camera and its optimum exposure/settings etc will take a little time.

 

 

Sony Nikon z7 dynamic range.jpg

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The Nikon and Canon seemed to have less highlight retention then the A73, XT3, and GH5S. The A73 definitely held highlights best though by a small margin. 

It seems like the best way to see how much 10 bit makes a difference is to do a dramatic color grade across all cameras and see if the XT3 and GH5S come out on top. I have already seen comparison's between a GH5 and A7S2 with a heavy color grade and the GH5 held together significantly better. 

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3 hours ago, Mark Romero 2 said:

I thought you weren't going to get one...

its all good, if the girlfriend gets one. who can say if it was her idea or not to purchase one, finally andrew gets his hands on a camera that he was dead set against , albeit in a round about way. personally i'm a bit jealous, i'm still waiting for mine 😓

the positive thing to take away from this is that the girlfriend has excellent taste in cinema cameras  😀

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Sorry yes it's 256 levels but in Y'CbCr most of the bitrate is used for the Luma (Y) channel so for any situation where the bitrate is limited it's better than RGB as our eyes are least sensitive to missing color information vs missing tonal information. 8 bit is not 'that' bad as long as it's stored in a low compression codec. 

8bit RGB can support 16million colours but 8bit Y'CbCr can't as explained above - the colour info is dramatically cut esp with 4.2.0 codecs so even though it may have a large gamut ( the size of the colour space) there are missing or interpolated areas within it. Likley why we have so much bother with skin tones which our eyes are very sensitive to. With RAW which is RGB you do get the full colour data from the sensor and this is one advantage over 4.2.2 and 4.2.0 Y'CbCr codecs which should be evident in any P4k ProRes vs RAW tests.

 

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