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Panasonic GH5 - all is revealed!


Andrew Reid
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50 minutes ago, stefanocps said:

My doubt is not referred to the final quality of the image, but to the moment i am using the camera for work.that means facilities, confortable, confident, quick of use, reliability, something that would let me forget about the tecnological tool in fabour of the creative tool

The GH5 is a proven workhorse.  I'm not sure about the XT3 but knowing Fuji it's likely it's also a well-built product like that.

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6 hours ago, stefanocps said:

there is something i notice. In  many of the videomakers forums, fuji looks like being mostly ignored, i don t see iscussions, excitment, ecc about this fuji, and i wonder why. They keep talking panasonic, sony, new nikon ecc..but very little xt3

Panasonic has a long reputation now of being a camera for video, since the GH2 days. Fuji kind of just jumped into the game with the XT3. It just doesn't have the following Canon, Sony and Panasonic have yet.

You can't go wrong with either camera man. Pretty much the Panasonic will win in terms of having no record limit and IBIS. Fuji wins in terms of ISO performance, auto focus, color, resolution, and higher frame rates(better quality higher frame rates). It also comes down to if you have a preference towards M43 or APSC(maybe you have a lot of m43 lenses or simply like the versatility of them).

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21 hours ago, kye said:

Buy a camera that is "good enough" and learn to colour grade.

Seriously.  I used to be like you, but then I worked out what I wanted in an image and bought the right camera and lenses, and now when I hear that there's a new 12K RAW 16-bit pocket camera with built-in gimbal and AI drone I don't even care.  It happens that the camera I bought was a GH5, but if you have different needs then it will be a different camera.

The other part is learning to colour grade.  I was "done" with other cameras when I pulled the GH5 files into Resolve and it looked and felt like when the pros grade cinema camera footage - they pull in a shot and it looks flat because it's log, and then they push and pull it around almost mercilessly and it just does it and looks great, and the GH5 files did that too.  With all my previous cameras the file was fragile and would break given half a chance.

I'm not getting spectacular images out of the GH5 yet, but that's because I just need to learn to grade better.  I know the GH5 is great and it's about my ability to grade, not its limitations.  Specifically I think that's because it's 10-bit and the colour science doesn't have problems, so I know I can work with it.  Your results and preferences might be different, but when you're wishing you had something else it's because you're not happy with what you have.  There are always better cameras and we all wish we had an Alexa but many of us are satisfied even if the Alexa has a better image.

I recommend buying an old BMPCC for a few dollars and learn shooting and coloring.

I've had GH5 for over two years,  and I bought an old BMPCC and BMMCC six months ago and that was the best decision I ever made, color and DR is excellent ! 

it will do much more work but it's worth it.

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1 hour ago, tonysss said:

I recommend buying an old BMPCC for a few dollars and learn shooting and coloring.

I've had GH5 for over two years,  and I bought an old BMPCC and BMMCC six months ago and that was the best decision I ever made, color and DR is excellent ! 

it will do much more work but it's worth it.

buying bmpcc is nearly impossibile right now, so better go elsewhere

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  • 5 weeks later...
On 8/29/2018 at 7:18 AM, jonpais said:

Here’s a beta test of Leeming LUT One v801. It has greater dynamic range than earlier versions.

 

Color looks good if that's what you're skin looks like. Most older guys don't have that much pink going on. Did you sharpen the footage or is that the GH5 magic?

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On 10/8/2018 at 12:06 PM, webrunner5 said:

Really other than the new PK4, none of the new FF cameras, and the Fuji have added Anything to talk about over what a GH5 has had 2 years ago. And most of them have a Hell of a lot less features. And now you can buy a used GH5 cheaper than any of the new cameras, even the PF4. Interesting. We really haven't gained crap other than some pretty nice options on the PK4, Raw in particular, the the C port, and the mini XLR is nice also. Oh and the menus are damn nice also on the screen.

Other than the Fuji X-T3 for photos I don't see hardly Any edge for film making on the Canon, or Nikon, Fuji offerings over the GH5, GH5s.

I changed my mind about the GH5 by revisiting footage again. In the right hands it does very well. 

My main issues are:

- It adds sharpness to the image

- Color is still off most of the time and this also has to do with how it handles mid shadow skin areas. It tends to get dirty in these areas and this can be a problem

- The m4/3 field of view or what it presents to us is always wide open wide shots, and this creates the same as same as framing for GH5 owners. It must be impossible to get a mid cowboys shot with that camera.

- The GH5 shares technology came from the GH4 and G7 and some of the same issues carried over. I used the own the G7 and it was great camera for the price. 

- Again color is off on this camera and it's almost a color shift that happens. 

- Shadow and low light areas. It's know that the Gh5 is not great in low light and don't mention the speed booster and toaster that can fix this issue. The tech guys and guys that try and break this down scientifically miss the point. If you have the darkest value before crushed blacks that show noise and unresolved detail (detail that the camera doesn't show or can't show but these areas are not just one value) then that's an issue you can't just blame on low light. Almost every clip will have areas like this and it depends if it's on the wall in the shadows or the shadow side of a persons long hair. Most of the time the Gh5 almost fills in these areas with darker shadow then what we see. It almost or does have less range in the mid to darker values. Instead of 7 the GH5 gives us 4 values on the grey scale. 

- Hybrid cameras should have good video and photo abilities because they share the same sensor and processor. We all know the GH5 doesn't do photo's well and there's a reason for that. The Lumix S1 and S1R seems to have pushed photo and video to the next level. So in the same family you have the Gh5 and S1 it's clear from the S1 how far back the GH5 is in image quality. The C100 has atone of cine feature and controls but no one is replacing the GH5 with the C200.

8 minutes ago, AlexTrinder96 said:

He's no longer active on this forum...

Why not? He seemed to bring a lot to the discussion. 

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6 hours ago, Skip77 said:

I changed my mind about the GH5 by revisiting footage again. In the right hands it does very well. 

My main issues are:

- It adds sharpness to the image

- Color is still off most of the time and this also has to do with how it handles mid shadow skin areas. It tends to get dirty in these areas and this can be a problem

- The m4/3 field of view or what it presents to us is always wide open wide shots, and this creates the same as same as framing for GH5 owners. It must be impossible to get a mid cowboys shot with that camera.

- The GH5 shares technology came from the GH4 and G7 and some of the same issues carried over. I used the own the G7 and it was great camera for the price. 

- Again color is off on this camera and it's almost a color shift that happens. 

- Shadow and low light areas. It's know that the Gh5 is not great in low light and don't mention the speed booster and toaster that can fix this issue. The tech guys and guys that try and break this down scientifically miss the point. If you have the darkest value before crushed blacks that show noise and unresolved detail (detail that the camera doesn't show or can't show but these areas are not just one value) then that's an issue you can't just blame on low light. Almost every clip will have areas like this and it depends if it's on the wall in the shadows or the shadow side of a persons long hair. Most of the time the Gh5 almost fills in these areas with darker shadow then what we see. It almost or does have less range in the mid to darker values. Instead of 7 the GH5 gives us 4 values on the grey scale. 

- Hybrid cameras should have good video and photo abilities because they share the same sensor and processor. We all know the GH5 doesn't do photo's well and there's a reason for that. The Lumix S1 and S1R seems to have pushed photo and video to the next level. So in the same family you have the Gh5 and S1 it's clear from the S1 how far back the GH5 is in image quality. The C100 has atone of cine feature and controls but no one is replacing the GH5 with the C200.

If you haven't tried it already, maybe the 6K anamorphic mode might work better for you?  It uses h265 instead of h264, and has way less sharpening (or maybe none? not sure).  

I don't know what you mean about it giving us "wide open wide shots" or that it can't give "mid cowboy" shots.  There doesn't seem to be anything magical about sensor size - it's just about using the right lenses.

You're right about it not being a low-light king, but I've found the answer to that to be using fast lenses.  I know that by using large aperture settings makes focusing more difficult, but with my 17.5mm at f0.95 or my 40mm at f1.8 the camera can see about the same as I can at its base ISO.

The GH5 isn't actually so far back, it's more that we're spoiled, but also you have to take the cost into account, comparing a GH5 to S1 without taking price into account is like comparing the S1 to an Alexa - an academic but not-so-useful exercise.

6 hours ago, Skip77 said:

Why not? He seemed to bring a lot to the discussion. 

He did.  Unfortunately he also brought a lot of conflict and animosity into the conversation as well.

My personal opinion of Jon is that deep down he's a good guy - he helped me out with lots of info via PMs in the past.  I'd encourage you to get in touch with him if you feel so inclined.

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39 minutes ago, kye said:

If you haven't tried it already, maybe the 6K anamorphic mode might work better for you?  It uses h265 instead of h264, and has way less sharpening (or maybe none? not sure).  

I don't know what you mean about it giving us "wide open wide shots" or that it can't give "mid cowboy" shots.  There doesn't seem to be anything magical about sensor size - it's just about using the right lenses.

You're right about it not being a low-light king, but I've found the answer to that to be using fast lenses.  I know that by using large aperture settings makes focusing more difficult, but with my 17.5mm at f0.95 or my 40mm at f1.8 the camera can see about the same as I can at its base ISO.

The GH5 isn't actually so far back, it's more that we're spoiled, but also you have to take the cost into account, comparing a GH5 to S1 without taking price into account is like comparing the S1 to an Alexa - an academic but not-so-useful exercise.

He did.  Unfortunately he also brought a lot of conflict and animosity into the conversation as well.

My personal opinion of Jon is that deep down he's a good guy - he helped me out with lots of info via PMs in the past.  I'd encourage you to get in touch with him if you feel so inclined.

The S1 is not far off from the original GH5 price. 

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6 hours ago, Skip77 said:

The S1 is not far off from the original GH5 price. 

But the original price isn't what people are paying these days.

Tech always devalues, otherwise people who are talking about laptop computers would be comparing them to the original computers with valves in them that took up entire floors of buildings and cost millions of dollars in money from back then, which is obviously a stupid comparison because the tech has advanced and gotten cheaper.   

 

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11 hours ago, kye said:

But the original price isn't what people are paying these days.

Tech always devalues, otherwise people who are talking about laptop computers would be comparing them to the original computers with valves in them that took up entire floors of buildings and cost millions of dollars in money from back then, which is obviously a stupid comparison because the tech has advanced and gotten cheaper.   

 

People had no issue comparing the GH5 to the A6500 when it came out and sayin the GH5 was better which it is. So price points are the same each year and have been sine camera / cine gear hit the market. Prices won't go down except we will get more for the money now. You're still paying $2,000 for the GH6 and the S1 is comparable. To say the price is the reason the S1 is better is GH5 owners looking for an out. 

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2 minutes ago, Skip77 said:

People had no issue comparing the GH5 to the A6500 when it came out and sayin the GH5 was better which it is. So price points are the same each year and have been sine camera / cine gear hit the market. Prices won't go down except we will get more for the money now. You're still paying $2,000 for the GH6 and the S1 is comparable. To say the price is the reason the S1 is better is GH5 owners looking for an out. 

I once saw someone give a mobile flip-phone a 1-star rating because they didn't like the ringtones it came with.  Just because people do something doesn't make it sensible.  You can go on comparing the past with the future all you like, but I fail to see how its relevant or even useful.  If you're looking to answer the question "Should I buy an S1 or get in my time machine and go back to when the GH5 was launched and buy one of those?  They were the same price at launch" then I think you've missed the point of what the potential of a time machine is :) 

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