Django

The commercial has the iPad pro directly connected to a 5D3 (without even a dongle ?) which of course is BS:

EOS-R, A73, Z6/Z7 etc however do have USB-C so it woud be interesting to see what could be done there. I'm assuming it's just JPG transfer, but hopefully also DNG/MOV/MP4.

External monitoring would be a dream (Atomos should maybe look into an app) but I'm sure that isn't going to be the case yet.

Sony fanboys getting triggered.. Let it go mate..

Calling Andrew biased towards Canon is the joke of the year. I don't think anyone has been as hard on Canon than Andrew in the past half-decade..

1 hour ago, Kisaha said:

This is exactly what I mean, but in the opposite.

You were expecting everyone to admire your very shallow DoF (why?), while now everyone, and their mobile phones, trying to mimic that technique because it seems "more professional". 

I guess (no offense) you are an example of what I described above. You probably started working at, or just after the 5DmkII "revolution".

It is just a tool, and a technique.

When I started working is irrelevant.

I don’t think I’m alone here who indeed started  experimenting with ultra shallow DoF thanks to the FF DSLR revolution and  access to fast primes for video use.

..or super slo motion with affordable HFR camera options.

Always been aware though that these are obviously just tools, techniques.

Never expected anyone to admire anything either. Just thought it was interesting some people would marvel over bokeh while others just found the footage overly blurry.

Beauty is in beholders eyes. One mans junk.. you know the story.

Anyways my point was that shallow DoF, super slomo etc has become over used and a bit of a crutch. I’m honest enough to admit I’ve been a victim of it myself and tend to try and avoid them in favor of other techniques and working with cameras that don’t offer those specs/features has certainly helped resist that urge..

Which brings me to my other point: chasing camera specs / bashing cameras over specs is a little bit futile in the grand scheme of things. All the latest mirrorless cameras are capable of spectacular results in the right hands.

Yeah the average joe associates blur as a negative. they want sharp everything in their images. probably victims of point & shoot / phone cameras. 

I remember when showing my first full frame video projects (shot wide open naturally) to non photo/video enthusiasts, they use to say: "why is there so much blur around everything?" and i was like "SMH they don't get it" while connaisseurs would be more like "OMG sweet bo-keh".

But i think we as creators also tend to abuse & rely a bit too much on shallow DoF, Super slo-mo etc..

Going back to S35 or even bigger crop factors like on XT2 (or now EOS R 4K) with greater DoF & no HFR options has got me thinking more about composition, interesting angles etc again. I guess I'd argue limitations spark creativity.. even though I'm still a sucker for shallow DoF & HFR shooting.

Max should call these guys to clear up that mushy garbage 400% EOS R footage:

@Robert Collins even better:  it does object tracking in continuous, so you can select the eye (given you are close enough) and it'll track it. YMMV, but it's pretty dope feature.

FWIW here is a SOOC EOS R 4K screen grab shot wide open (RF 50mm), plenty of detail & sharpness as far as i'm concerned.

Also I'd like to see another camera's AF track the eye like that at F1.2 ... 

lol at pixel peeping license plates from a mile away. these kinda tests always crack me up.. do a skin tone test in mixed lighting and we'll see who comes up on top!

I strongly advise the vertical grip if you're having trouble with ergos, as your right hand sits lower and your thumb rests exactly where it should in between AF-On & touch bar.

Grip also comes with a USB-C PCU.

54 minutes ago, mercer said:

Gotta love Canon colors... it’s like a moving photograph.

Damn right.. and while the naysayers are out there moaning about so & so spec limitations.. it's nice to see actual shooters (and viewers ) out there appreciating the rich colors, rendering & skin tones this latest Canon produces. and quite effortlessly at that may i add!

Again wasn't asking at all for an ETA, i fully realize the nature of the project and limited dev resources.

Just curious what the next steps are towards porting ML. I know they've made recent progress with the 5D4 (and Digic 7/8 models), succesfully extracting 4K DNGs etc. 

EOS R + Vari ND adapter = mini C100/200 imo.

So how far are we to an actual ML port? (i know they don't provide ETAs, just curious how many steps/hurdles are still in the way)

18 hours ago, webrunner5 said:

Heck the 1080p on the M50 is using DPAF and is as sharp as a Canon C100. And has a Flippy screen. I don't see why a person would pay the money for a EOS-R to be honest.

 

15 hours ago, Mattias Burling said:

It's a full frame stills camera. The m50 is not. Easy to forget on a video forum. But stills cameras are stills cameras and it will always need to be taken into consideration when asking "why".

Correct.

EOS R is also a FF video camera, which neither M50 or C100 are.

EOS R internal ALL-I codecs are also superior to both. 

C-Log which isn't available on M50. 10-bit 4:2:2 external, which isn't even possible on C100.

4K which isn't available on C100 (and with less crop/RS then on M50). DPAF in 4K.

Etc etc..

EOS R is closer to a mini C200 / 5D4 hybrid. 

I'm actually considering using EOS R as the A-cam to an upcoming project after doing test shots alongside the C100.

Looks like crop mode has another advantage:

Depending on the reading surface, the readout time of the rolling shutter also changes. Unfortunately, our measurement results are still not as accurate as we would like it to be, but we are getting closer and closer to our requirements: At DX readings, we estimate the readout time of the Nikon Z7 to be around 19ms, with FX readout at about 25ms. 

These are good values, but very good 4K cameras now create read times of 15ms or even less.

DPreview (Jordan Drake aside), Kai (without Lok), Tony & Chelsea, Fro etc.. are all general photography based channels. They don't really know/care about video stuff , beyond the basics.. 

The few video channels that exist are either biased to a system, or sponsored by camera stores / manufacturers (ie shills).

Not many independant, cross platform reviewers out there..aside from Andrew. 

I thought his review of EOS R was rather balanced, was expecting him to just rip it to shreds honestly. But he gave it some credit where it was due.

..and indeed pointed out it's giant flaws for video, rightfully so. i wanna hear the good & the bad in a review. not just one side & not just the obvious stuff.

RS is a serious issue. Bigger issue then the crop factor imo. I'm only using 4K on EOS R for locked tripod shots, but if it weren't the case.. it would be basically unusable.

Anyways let's all take a deep breath, we're all in here with a common passion & these gear wars are getting out of hand..

only owner i know shoots raw with it all the time. it's kind of the main feature and the internal codec is meh (8 bit 4:2:0) for a camera that price range.

i'd be a lot more tempted to shoot raw on a c200 than on a URSA/EVA1/FS7 that have really strong codecs.

I think sony themselves have stated A7S series has eaten into FS sales, but they don't really care, it's still money in their pocket. for every FS sale, there is probably 100 A7S/A73 sold.

But C200 still has a major advantage aside from obvious ergonomics & I/Os: it shoots raw.

Now if Canon were to implement Canon Raw light in lets say a video centric mirrorless model, that would bridge the gap.

Pretty sure Raw (in a more friendly ProRes Raw, BM Raw, Canon Raw Light format) will be the next big thing in upcoming models.

I know a very famous art photographer that still uses the mark 1 as his main tool, and believe me he could afford anything. it fits his aesthetic.

Lotta people cling on to their D700s for similar reasons. (something about those 12MP sensors).

Never selling mine, especially at current market value. Then again i'm a vintage/retro afficionado (still record music to tape with pre-MIDI analog equipment).

I'm no leica specialist but i think the M8's weaker IR filter gets you closer to M9M for B&W photagraphy..at 1/8th the price.

in a somewhat similar vein.. i much prefer the original 5D IQ to mark 2/3/4. the lower DR/resolution etc also masks older Canon glass flaws.

also prefer C100/300 original canon color matrix over the more neutral C200/C300II (thankfully EOS R provides both options in log settings).

same thing with original A7 vs A72/A73.

another case of specs don't always tell the entire truth.

Funny you mention this 'personality aspect' of a camera. Like you guys I have and swap around many systems and some just kind of stick out in the fun factor department, like this EOS R (time will tell though as I'm currently in honeymoon phase). Fuji comes close, I'm very fond of the dials and whole Nikon FM2 / Leica approach. But for video, it's a little more quirky to use.

EOS R definitely feels like a mini C100/200. In fact i've got mine setup like my C100 with the Ninja star placed on the flash bracket under vertical grip.

probably overkill for many, but i can just swap the atomos for a speedlite to get my terry richardson hat on or remove the grip altogether for a lighter setup.

love this versatility.

Depends on your country.. cable boxes usually upscale to 1080p/4K.

Netflix has it's own restrictions (you won't be able to submit anything to them with your 4K DSLR/hyrbid anyhow).

Casey Neistat infamously went back from shooting 4K with a GH5 to 1080p on a 6D for that FF Canon look & DPAF (i heard he's on 1DX2 now, probably EOS R soon).

Fair point.. and going further with that I've never heard a single viewer in the world complain that a movie/video scene had a poor/massive crop factor. 

Ignorance is bliss.. but that doesn't mean of course, we as filmmakers don't notice these limitations and have to work with/around them.

Personally RS really bothers me. 4K on EOS-R will be locked tripod/slider shots only. and not aboard any trains!  

Getting back to the review (great as usual) there is one category of shooters andrew doesn't mention in his who this camera will appeal to, and those are 1080p shooters.

Yes we are still alive in 2018! A lot of YT content is still 1080p, even from top tier accounts. TV/Cable is still 720p/1080i. Most hollywood movies/theatres are 2K.

This is where RF/EF L/Cine lenses will matter, to get all the resolving power possible from Canon's soft 1080 and of course benefit from the entire FF.

1 hour ago, Mokara said:

Not all encoders are created equal. Some are better optimized than others, even if they are spitting out the same codec. 

Even Canon cameras produce vastly different results with what on paper is the same encoder. Their dedicated video cameras have far more robust cooling than stills cameras, which means that the processors inside can run faster and hotter. That increased computational power that results is what allows cameras like the Cxxx series to use the same encoder found in their stills cameras, but without all of the compromises that otherwise might be made to keep the thermal envelope in check. That translates into a better image.

You will see that with many cameras from different manufacturers as well. Some can produce great results with what seems like a limited bit rate, while others generate relatively poor output with a high bit rate, even though all are H.264.

True, but the fact they are dedicated video cams also means the sensor & processor are fully tuned towards video IQ. For C100 all the magic happens pre-codec:

Canon Super 35mm CMOS Sensor

The EOS C100 Mark II Digital HD Camera employs the same single Super 35mm Canon CMOS image sensor as the rest of the Cinema EOS camera family and includes the same innovative strategies that have established the outstanding image performance of these cameras. This 8.3 megapixel sensor maximizes the size of the individual photosites each of which deploys two photodiodes to ensure high speed removal of accumulated charge, which in turn helps elevate the effective sensor dynamic range.  Allied with innovative Canon signal extraction strategies that enhance the sensor signal to noise performance allows unprecedented elevation of the ISO setting in this professional Super 35mm camera, while always protecting its dynamic range. 

Canon DIGIC DV 4 Image Processor

The four 1920 x 1080 HD R Gr Gb B video components from the image sensor are pre-processed and then sent to the DIGIC DV 4 processor for advanced video processing. This includes separate interpolation of the sparsely sampled R and B HD components to form full frame 4K for each. The two green HD components are also interpolated to form a single full frame 4K Green component. These three 4K RGB components are then down-sampled to create a set of  YCC 422 HD components that have high MTF, improved edge transitions, low false color moiré, and enhanced overall color reproduction. These components are further processed preparatory to sending them to the AVCHD and MP4 codecs.

1 hour ago, Yurolov said:

If i am going to crop I may as well shoot 4k though so not too certain if there will be any benefit for me with the crop mode in 1080p. 

 

perhaps lower RS. that's the 4Ks biggest downfall imo.

yeah i suggested this too here on my first day with EOS R: EF-S crop mode in FHD appears super sampled, just like the 1080p HDMI output is in 4K mode (same as in 1DC/1DX2/5D4)