Django

53 minutes ago, Mako Sports said:

I've never said Sony is perfect or the best for every genre. You justify using canon in basically EVERY thread related to that brand on this forum, I can do the same. 

 

 

Listen, I'm a happy Canon user, so yes you will find me generally speaking positively about products I own in Canon related threads.

The difference is I don't go into other brand threads I don't own (and have zero intention of owning) to troll & toot my own horn..

19 minutes ago, Kisaha said:

At the moment, I would buy into Canon only if I was a sport photographer, in no other segment Canon has a competative product at the moment.

 

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That may be your own personal conclusion, but many photographers & videographers would obviously disagree.

Body specs aren't everything. Albeit certain limitations, as a complete ecosystem, Canon have imo the most appealing lineup (for my type of work) that give great results with minimum fuss.

Again more & more single operators. Current trend is also 'body per lens' type of shoot. 2 or 3 bodies and a bag of lenses.

A perfect setup for that is a C100/200 as A-cam,  5D4/1DX2 as a B-cam & EOS R as a C-cam (on gimbal, motorized slider).

I would only trust Canon with their DPAF for that type of shoot:

1 hour ago, Kisaha said:

The way you look at it everything is perfect in Canon-land, the way it is, and the way Canon admitted 2 days ago, is far different than reality.

Sports photography belongs to Canonikon for the next half a dozen years, certainly, all the rest has changed.

In wedding photography, a few years ago it was 95% Canonikon, now Sony has eaten a good chunk of that, and I even know a few people shooting Fuji, something unheard for even 2 years ago. If you go from 95-98% share to something like 65-68% on just a few years, then there is trouble in paradise.

Fashion, the same, and the mILC have a bigger share there, for sure. 

Sony didn't just take some share, it almost has a monopoly with their FS5 and FS7 series. When I have knowledge of at least 30 TV shows in my market, and just 1 is Canon (C300mkII) and I even know a few (I worked in 2) using GH5 cameras, then that is not just "took some share", that is even worst than pro photography that changes happen slowly, this is a disaster, and on a market with huge profit margin.

I am not trying to convince you about anything. I have 4 NX cameras, and my favorite tool of all time, besides NX, is the C100mkII, but I can not close my eyes to the writing in the wall. It is just there, with hugh neon lights.

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I am not looking at it in "Canon-land" simply observing with my own eyes the professional scene in my location, Paris France, which visibly differs much from your own local observations (which I am not disputing btw).

That said, living and working in the number one fashion capital of the world, I think I do know a bit about that scene. So to hear " mILC have a bigger share there, for sure " is rather a surprise.

From celebrity model studio shoots to fashion editorials, to the runway or even street bloggers during Fashion week... I'd say it's 95% CaNikon.  And 80% of that 1DX2/5D3/5D4.

Battery life, weather sealing, FPS, balance with telephoto lenses, portrait orientation control. Flagship DSLR still own that market. Canon edges it off with skintone CS.

For video, I think it also depends. TV/Broadcast isn't the only market. We're shifting more & more towards digital content by one man bands.

In the rental houses I visit, i see just as much Canon gear getting rented out then Sony. I also know showrunners that swear only by RED/ARRI. YMMV.

Just now, Kisaha said:

Sony a6xx cameras (which I detest) compete with M cameras, and they easily destroy them, any day. 

For the rest, look at my comment above.

Canonikon will reign in sports photography a long time after loosing all their other castles.

sports photography, wedding photography, fashion etc.. they basically dominate all pro photography where DSLR still reigns supreme.

and in couple years when DSLR dies out, their MILC bodies will have fully caught up and have a solid RF lens lineup pro photogs will still gush over.

For cine cams, DPAF on the C line simply has no competition and therefore is still the preferred solution for many run & gun, docu, events, corporate shooters.

For broadcast, C300II is still a top choice with 12-bit 444 internal 2K, but sure Sony took some shares with FS7 & cheaper e-mount lens options.

As for the future, Canon intends on paving the way for 8K in their upcoming C line refresh in time for Tokyo 2020, so i wouldn't bury them at all yet.

Just now, Mako Sports said:

Fanboyish statement sounds like its from Canon's marketing department. 

But hmmm what job?

I shoot sports (video) from the sidelines at all levels of play Youth, Varsity HS, Club/NCAA, and professional lacrosse.

Nearly every camera body they make would be total joke for what I do..

Edit: After watching the Northup video, I agree the EOS R is great "Family/vacation" camera ?

4

Riiiight, because your comment doesn't come off at all like Sony fanboyism.

You might have had a case if you were using an A9 series (rest aren't even weather sealed). But the A6300... better than Canon.. for sports really? Cmon.

The joke of the LCD rear display with less than 1M px (not even half of EOS R's resolution) requires that monitor on top. Lack of ergonomics means you need that side handle.

That camera has worst RS than EOS R (more than double in FHD), overheats after like 15mn, AF nowhere near DPAF, no touchscreen, no IBIS/IS, weak battery life etc..

Yeah what a pro solution over Canon that camera is ? Better not rain during the game.. meanwhile Super Bowl last year:

RIP CANON ?

1 hour ago, currensheldon said:

Fuji has a huge opportunity, I think, to release a $5-6k mini cinema camera. They're the ONLY manufacturer that has a great lens lineup specifically made for Super35mm. Even though Canon has tons of Super35mm/APS-C cameras, their professional lens lineup for the system is sad. Even their fastest/best lens for the system (the 17-55mm f2.8) vignettes at DCI 4k.

 

EF-S is not Canon's Super35 4K ready professional lens lineup, this is:

PROFESSIONAL VIDEO SOLUTIONS | CINEMA LENSES

Very expensive for the most part but you can always rent.

There are also many EF Super35 cine lens options from the top third-parties (Zeiss, Xeen etc) .

Sony E-mount also have a good range of pro cine native & third party lenses.

Fuji's X-mount only has two MK pro cine zoom lenses. The regular photo lenses aren't that great for video imo (pulling focus manually isn't easy).

It would be nice of course if they did develop a cine cam and added some fast cine primes to MK series.

The way I see EOS R is a great 30MP FF stills & FF FHD camera with a cropped 4K mode. 

I rarely shoot 4K handheld on any camera so it’s mono/tripod/gimbal for 4K which tend to minimize RS.

Unless you need ultra wide angles something like the Sigma 18-35mm F1.8 works great for standard needs in 4K. 

Then my 50mm primes turn into 85’s..etc

Not trying to make any excuses for Canon, I’d love no crop / good RS in 4K but I guess you just learn to workaround issues.. while we await the higher end model!

I do understand though why other system users wouldn’t fathom switching given the limitations. 

The battery life is pretty good though, close to DSLR. With the grip and 2 batteries fitted I haven’t run into any problems even on full day shoot.

Well like I said YMMV lol..

I’m still choosing to stick with them as a complete eco-system (DSLR/Mirroless/Cine cam/Lenses) they are kinda still the only game in town. 

For video, the cine camera options are what guide me for A-cams and the C100/200/300II are still by far my favorite under $10K cameras.

Well people can whine, hate, cry, scratch their heads all they want at Canon, they remain the number one camera company in the world so they must be doing a thing or two right!

Other than brand recognition, color science, DPAF, UI etc.. they entice users through their lens system and there are plenty of people that still want access to that L series and probably soon the evolution which is RF.

Canons objective is to sell their lenses (which are also the most sold in the world) and so indeed a lower end model is a quick priority after putting out the mid-range model..

With that perspective, I don’t really see what the big fuss is about: Canon are putting out a lower end model follow-up.

The higher-end model could be the ticket though, rumors are saying SD+CFast & joystick return.. so an improved FF 4K60p 1DX2 with C-log, 10-bit & no crop could be that no compromise Canon camera videographers have been waiting for. Start saving though  

Indeed EOS R IQ is what keeps me happy, Canon still provide the most robust FF internal codec and DPAF is still king of the hill. 

Z6 can’t even do internal log and when you go external the AF goes haywire so that’s a major fail IMO.

A73? Solid specs but painful shooting experience & post can be a PITA.

GH5S? Wack AF. Poor choice for stills.

P4K: No AF. No stills.

XT3. Now that’s a dope camera. Better hope not to get a lemon though. 

YMMV of course and I’m probably biased.

Anyways maybe I’m wrong about the “RP”. Really isn’t much info on it yet. Canon could surprise us in a desperate attempt to regain some shares in the video market.

Hey don’t shoot the messenger! 

I’m just telling you what I believe is the most likely scenario from Canon, not what I’d personally want.

If you are looking for something better than EOS R then quite obviously IMO you gotta wait.. for the higher end model.

Wait & see, unless I missed something all the rumors said was 26MP & no touchbar.

But Canon isn’t silly, they know how to segment and are not going to give a lower end model better (video) specs than the R.

The 26MP is probably the same 26MP sensor as in the 6D2 (just like the 30MP on the R echoes the 5DIV).

So what does this indicate? Probably no 4K! Or maybe 4K with no DPAF (a la M50)

Other possible limitations could be: 

No touchbar, no flip-out screen, no top LCD, no C-Log, no ALL-I codec, no 10-bit out, less AF points, less DR.. etc

Again I highly doubt the RP will have anything better for video than the R.

Canon are just applying the same formula & release strategy than their 6D, 5D, 1DX2 FF models imo: mid market first, then lower end, then pro.

Plenty to hate about Canon but nobody is going to end up crying.. you guys sure like to jump the gun!

I'm super happy with the RodeLink Filmmaker kit. Great sound quality, has never failed me. Like that you can have standard spare batteries.

This Senny kit is very interesting though for sure as it's tiny and can be switched to XLR and can be setup as a wireless interview mic or even wireless boom mic!

Pretty amazing stuff..

10 hours ago, kye said:

I remember when I was young and you'd see the snooty rich people saying "we spend our summers in the south of France" in their snooty accents while looking down their noses at everyone else who can't afford to do that.  
Later on in life the thought crossed my mind that if you can work remotely (or work online, etc) then you can do that "summers in the south of France" kind of lifestyle too.  

1

As someone who has family and spends a lot of down time in one of the most popular areas on the coast of the south of France it kind of amuses me to hear that, as people who live down there all year are always complaining about it and dreaming about going to exotic places (well for them) like Brazil, Hawaii or Australia etc..

Basically, my answer to this thread is the grass is always greener on the other side.

That doesn't mean you shouldn't chase that dream (especially if you are feeling miserable where you are) but it can sometimes be more a fantasy or an illusion.

I know for many visual creatives & electronic musicians here in the EU, Berlin has long been considered the mecca.

I've got quite a few friends that moved there and now are back home (including our own Andrew Reid i believe).

Now working/living in several places that's definitely an entertaining idea which I'm considering myself mid-term. Kind of hard to pull off though.

I don't wanna belittle Nikon's efforts but you can get internal RAW today for $1300. And internal 10-bit for $1500.

A Nikon Z6 + FTZ adapter + Ninja V will run you almost $3K. That's second hand FS5 money. We're also talking ProRes Raw which has its limitations.

And furthermore who really wants to use an external recorder on a mirrorless? Not that many people imo. Kind of defeats the whole compact portable purpose.

I still think this is a step in the right direction but I'm hoping Nikon goes further and gives us internal 10-bit, Log & even Raw. We know its technically possible.

I'd really like to see Nikon put a strong dent in the market (they deserve it and competition is healthy for all us) but with BMD, Fuji, the S1 & Sony's response I sincerely think it's going to take a little more than external ProRes Raw to do so.

C200 can do RAW to Cfast & 2K proxy to SD.

i'm not quite sure the overuse of super slow-mo shots, cheap pistol gimbals with that floaty effect, "film stock" LUTs, or ultra shallow DoF are the correct answer..

Super35 sensor + Cine lens is a good start imo.. follow with 10-bit log or RAW and you're more than halfway there assuming you know what you're doing!

Camera got slammed by Sony Northrup 

I think we have to distinct making tweaks and applying a LUT which is what most of us (myself included) are doing and advanced pro color grading which is a complete artform imo.

I got into shooting log & grading mostly out of a necessity because i'm generally unsatisfied with most picture profile in hybrid cameras (aside from Fuji Eterna, Nikon flat) which are often way too sharp/saturated/crushed blacks, need the extra DR and need to fix exposure, wrong camera AWB, color science issues..etc. 

So I'm usually just trying to get things looking correct and then i might apply a LUT for certain look. I might go full manual if i have the time.

I've been experimenting with ACES recently and it looks like it might be a game changer as far as workflow.

On a side note, I do wish hyrbids would either allow LUT import in camera or offer more filmic picture profiles for fast turnover projects.

Pretty sure Sony has the most complete picture profile settings (a little convoluted though). I also like how in Fuji's you can adjust shadows/highlights.

My personal favorite PP is WideDR on Canon's C line.

3 hours ago, ntblowz said:

All that and still no SLOG/HLG.. there is no excuse! 

Such a slap in the face for A9 hybrid shooters. The one feature they've been asking since day 1 and that's available inside their "basic model".

This reminds me of the FS5 mark 2 announcement when the only thing they added was a new picture profile (which could have been delivered to FS5 mk1 via firmware).

People love to harp on Canon but Sony at times are similar if not worst.

Well Sony has been doing FF 4K without crop since A7SII (2016) and 6K supersampled 4K no crop since A9 (2017) so if anyone is making them look bad its Sony (they supply Nikon & Fuji with their sensors btw).

It's painfully obvious Canon are lagging behind in the sensor department. No BSI. No FF 4K. Average DR.

As the recent interview on IR confronted them on that, they're only response was "we're aware of it. we're working on it". 

We'll just have to wait & see. It's certainly an embarrassment at the moment..

Canon are certainly smart about their segmentation though. They've stated upfront EOS R isn't a replacement to their DSLRs & Cine cams but rather a companion to them (hence not pushing for a better sensor than 5DIV/1DX2).

Sony are more individualists, they believe in making as many different cams for individual segments (R series, S series, A9, A6..)

Nikon seem to follow that approach with the Z6/Z7 (one is more oriented towards video, the other still shooters).

41 minutes ago, Snowbro said:

Interesting to see Canon got their 4k RS in the 1D bodies down to 14.7ms (24/60fps), from 25ms on the 1DC. That would be cool if they get to single digits in the next one that should release within a year.  I think the 5D iv & Eos R have around 40? lol, I still think the worst one I have experienced was the a6500. 

5D4/EOS-R RS in 4K is 31ms. Terrible but yeah not quite A6xxx bad. Canon supposedly has a GS FF sensor in the works. Remains to be seen in what camera line that will appear..

I think the 4K lobby has been pretty successful at this point in time. 4K is like a brand. And youtubers are pretty sensitive to that.

RS on the other hand is a technical term which outside these forums very few people probably know/care about. 

That doesn't mean it shouldn't matter to us but within the intended target audience: 4K > RS.

People can LOL all they want but I think it really takes shooting & working with the EOS R footage to appreciate it.. or not. But until then, a spec sheet isn't going to give you the full picture. And again as part of an ecosystem it makes total sense.

We shoot Sony at work and personally, I'm not at all a fan of matching my Canon gear with the A7III etc.. I'd rather rent an FS5/7. And even then its a bit annoying because Sony keep changing their colour science. Canon has done so too but at least gives you the option on EOS R to choose in between original C100/C300 log & the newer C200/C300II log colour matrix. Its little details like that which make life easier. I hate losing time in post with that type of stuff..

33 minutes ago, Kisaha said:

Who r those? Are these youtube celebrities or smthng? I opened the video for a few seconds and it was embarrassingly unwatchable. You are very brave to reach the 4:03!

sorry i have no idea who they are. i wish i could take bravery credit for watching that but i  just scrubbed with my macbook touchbar until i hit that frame. took about 5 seconds.