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Andrew Reid

Nikon Z6 features 4K N-LOG, 10bit HDMI output and 120fps 1080p

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7 hours ago, DBounce said:

I think the thing everyone is missing is that if you are judging this camera on specs alone you will miss the point entirely. We all understand that spec wise the competition may seem to hold the upper hand. But specs be dammed, most people that have used both side by side end up preferring the EOS R... frustrating as that may be.

That's not 100% true that most people prefer the EOS R over the Z6. Most people have not shot with both cameras and are biased anyway. There is no "more film like" with the EOS R and the footage proves that without a shadow of a doubt. I use my eyes and my eyes don't say the EOS R is more film like then the Z^. In fact the EOS R has issues with washed out highlights and the Z6 does not. 

I will look into the EOS R more my self because I haven't invested into Nikon yet besides the Z6 and 50mm 1.8.

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EOSHD Pro Color for Sony cameras EOSHD Pro LOG for Sony CamerasEOSHD C-LOG and Film Profiles for All Canon DSLRs

Most people have been hostile in response to Nikon Z6 and it doing 12 bit Raw external. Why? That should be a good thing for everyone. 

I know for a fact the Z6 4K video even at 8 bit is better then the A7III's video and I know for a fact that it compares to the C200 that was used at the same place with the same talent.  That's not saying the Z6 is better or even as good but just what I can tell you based on footage between the two cameras. 

As far as having other cameras that do decent 4K comment. What? and what cameras? The GH5 does very good 4K but at what coast with the speed booster and glass you have to buy. 

The P4K is great but went I went to order one no-one had the P4K in stock.  Sony's 4K sucks, Fuji no and Panasonic S1 is great but is even priced higher then the Z6 by over $1,000. 

The EOS R looks good but the 1.8 crop shouldn't even be happening and no way they get away with that in the next builds. 

 

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48 minutes ago, Skip77 said:

Most people have been hostile in response to Nikon Z6 and it doing 12 bit Raw external. Why? That should be a good thing for everyone. 

I know for a fact the Z6 4K video even at 8 bit is better then the A7III's video and I know for a fact that it compares to the C200 that was used at the same place with the same talent.  That's not saying the Z6 is better or even as good but just what I can tell you based on footage between the two cameras. 

As far as having other cameras that do decent 4K comment. What? and what cameras? The GH5 does very good 4K but at what coast with the speed booster and glass you have to buy. 

The P4K is great but went I went to order one no-one had the P4K in stock.  Sony's 4K sucks, Fuji no and Panasonic S1 is great but is even priced higher then the Z6 by over $1,000. 

The EOS R looks good but the 1.8 crop shouldn't even be happening and no way they get away with that in the next builds. 

 

The Z6 is a great leap forward for sure. People don't appreciate things once they come along there is always something else on the horizon. 

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1 hour ago, Skip77 said:

Most people have been hostile in response to Nikon Z6 and it doing 12 bit Raw external. Why? That should be a good thing for everyone. 

I know for a fact the Z6 4K video even at 8 bit is better then the A7III's video and I know for a fact that it compares to the C200 that was used at the same place with the same talent.  That's not saying the Z6 is better or even as good but just what I can tell you based on footage between the two cameras. 

I think the hostility is not so much directed at the Nikon Z6, but more towards the choice of prores raw. Which many view as psuedo raw. 

I believe the Z6 is a good effort from Nikon,  but I wouldn't trade my C200 for it. Also,  we've had no confirmation that it will output 12 bit... that is merely speculation at this point. 

The omission of a battery grip with controls was a big miss for many shooters.  

Like I said,  none of these first gen efforts are checking all the boxes. 

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16 minutes ago, DBounce said:

I think the hostility is not so much directed at the Nikon Z6, but more towards the choice of prores raw. Which many view as psuedo raw. 

I believe the Z6 is a good effort from Nikon,  but I wouldn't trade my C200 for it. Also,  we've had no confirmation that it will output 12 bit... that is merely speculation at this point. 

The omission of a battery grip with controls was a big miss for many shooters.  

Like I said,  none of these first gen efforts are checking all the boxes. 

How is this merely speculation? This would mean any announcement from any camera company is merely speculation. 

The evidence is from Nikon and Atomos. 

https://www.redsharknews.com/production/item/6159-nikon-adds-12-bit-raw-output-to-z-7-and-z-6

The C200 is not a hybrid camera and it's price tag and what you get from the BM Ursa Min 4.6 and EVA-1, some would say this puts the C200 behind those camera.

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10 hours ago, Skip77 said:

How is this merely speculation? This would mean any announcement from any camera company is merely speculation. 

The evidence is from Nikon and Atomos. 

https://www.redsharknews.com/production/item/6159-nikon-adds-12-bit-raw-output-to-z-7-and-z-6

The C200 is not a hybrid camera and it's price tag and what you get from the BM Ursa Min 4.6 and EVA-1, some would say this puts the C200 behind those camera.

My bad, I didn't realise Nikon had announced the offical specs. But it also doesn't change the fact that more than a few would have preferred "real" raw,  instead of prores raw. Braw would have been a better choice... at least until Red makes BMD pay up and forces them to remove it from all their cameras. 

C200 is quick to get up and running,  reliable and shoots a great image. For the money I could have opted for any of the others... hell I sill could... they are still selling them,  but I won't.  They just don't do it for me. 

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What's wrong with ProRes Raw? Done know enough about it yet? As much as Quicktime gives us in various codecs I would think Pro Res would be welcomed.  Especially since Red holds the keys.

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It could always be better, I guess. But seriously, how many of you have expected we would talk about any kind of raw video in a mirrorless so soon? 12bit prores raw out of a full frame mirrorless camera - I'd say this is the "good enough" line I draw.

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@DaveAltizer I just watched your video earlier too and enjoyed the rant ha. I picked up an EOS-R, A7III, X-T3, and just now a Z6 just to compare for myself. And I’ll be damned if EOS-R doesn’t have some mojo. It doesn’t make any sense on paper but as you, @DBounce and others have said, there is something satisfying about the image. And it’s not just color as I’m shooting monochrome video. It just somehow looks closer to vision I have my head. Even the X-T3 I found to look nice, but somehow more sterile and less vibey ha ha.  And that was with both F-log and Acros and trying to match the rich monochrome look I can get out of the Canon. 

Still I’m very interested to see what the raw Z6 image will look like. 

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12 hours ago, Skip77 said:

What's wrong with ProRes Raw? Done know enough about it yet? As much as Quicktime gives us in various codecs I would think Pro Res would be welcomed.  Especially since Red holds the keys.

Pretty good article about it. I think the comments say more than the article. BMD obliviously is never going to use it in their cameras now that they have bRaw. I doubt Red or Arri is going that way. And I am not positive, but I think you Have to use an Apple computer to use it. So that is another turd. And is Resolve ever going to let you use in it it? Might be a good idea but looks like you are going to have to kiss Atomos's butt, and lick Apple's ass to use it....

https://www.newsshooter.com/2018/05/07/understanding-prores-raw-is-it-prores-or-is-it-raw/

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1 hour ago, webrunner5 said:

Pretty good article about it. I think the comments say more than the article. BMD obliviously is never going to use it in their cameras now that they have bRaw. I doubt Red or Arri is going that way. And I am not positive, but I think you Have to use an Apple computer to use it. So that is another turd. And is Resolve ever going to let you use in it it? Might be a good idea but looks like you are going to have to kiss Atomos's butt, and lick Apple's ass to use it....

https://www.newsshooter.com/2018/05/07/understanding-prores-raw-is-it-prores-or-is-it-raw/

I read the comments below the article and why are so many people missing the fact that Resolve and Premier and almost all cine cameras already support Apple Pro Res? I understand Pro Res RAW would be an additional license but that's only because its new. Sony cine cameras already use Pro Res RAW so not sure what app the complaining is about. 

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58 minutes ago, Skip77 said:

I read the comments below the article and why are so many people missing the fact that Resolve and Premier and almost all cine cameras already support Apple Pro Res? I understand Pro Res RAW would be an additional license but that's only because its new. Sony cine cameras already use Pro Res RAW so not sure what app the complaining is about. 

"ProRes RAW Post Production. As we know, ProRes is owned by Apple. ... So the only way to edit ProRes RAW, is currently with Final Cut 10. Unfortunately there is no support for Adobe Premiere Pro or After Effects as well as no support on BlackmagicDaVinci Resolve.Feb 11, 2019"

So you are going to Lick Apple's ass. And if you don't own an Apple, or use FCP you are shit out of luck. To me it is a no starter.

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3 minutes ago, webrunner5 said:

I wouldn't hold your breath that Resolve uses it.

Resolve maybe not because they want people to use their own cameras. Would be kind of a bitch move though. 

Though I'd be cool recording in Prores RAW and transcoding to regular prores in post. It would still be beneficial especially if you transcode to prores 444. 

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17 hours ago, ade towell said:

Have you got any footage you can share with us Zeng, you mentioned creating alexa luts earlier in this thread I think

Alexa rec709 based monitoring luts that is. I'll try to shoot some side by side Alexa and Z6 over the next week. Was asked to do this over on dvxuser.

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6 hours ago, webrunner5 said:

"ProRes RAW Post Production. As we know, ProRes is owned by Apple. ... So the only way to edit ProRes RAW, is currently with Final Cut 10. Unfortunately there is no support for Adobe Premiere Pro or After Effects as well as no support on BlackmagicDaVinci Resolve.Feb 11, 2019"

So you are going to Lick Apple's ass. And if you don't own an Apple, or use FCP you are shit out of luck. To me it is a no starter.

And what program do you use to edit B-RAW from BM? There's only one for that one also. Do you need a hint?

6 hours ago, webrunner5 said:

"So you are going to Lick Apple's ass. And if you don't own an Apple, or use FCP you are shit out of luck. To me it is a no starter."

The same train of thought goes for B-Raw as a non starter. 

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