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Trek of Joy

ZCam E2 4k footage in the wild, including ungraded and 120fps

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EOSHD Pro Color for Sony cameras EOSHD Pro LOG for Sony CamerasEOSHD C-LOG and Film Profiles for All Canon DSLRs

I can't say I am convinced about the output. Too much sharpening, harsh clipping. The 4K 120fps example is unusable. This camera would greatly benefit by ProRes RAW, and it could still fit between GH5s and BMPCC v2. 

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Pass. 

Maybe when it goes down 2/3 of the price within a year like the E1 did... 

6 hours ago, BTM_Pix said:

Oh.

I think this clip of it might actually be a metaphor.

 

The description of this one mentions "noise reduction by ZCam software"... Why is noise reduction needed for something shot in broad daylight? 

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11 hours ago, newfoundmass said:

The description of this one mentions "noise reduction by ZCam software"... Why is noise reduction needed for something shot in broad daylight? 

It was probably needed to mask the sound of disappointment seeping out of the rapidly deflating balloon of expectation.

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2 hours ago, newfoundmass said:

@tweak any thoughts? 😂

Some of the other tests on their FB page look promising for the price IMO. Test them for yourself and see what the files are like. Lots of information in the shadows, much better DR than Panasonic IMO. Keen to see how a Raw output would perform. 

People blowing off a camera because one clip/s look bad is pretty funny IMO. I could find you thousands of bad clips shot with similar spec cameras... I guess that means they suck as well ;) .

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On 6/6/2018 at 11:27 AM, Don Kotlos said:

This camera would greatly benefit by ProRes RAW, and it could still fit between GH5s and BMPCC v2. 

Can we please stop requesting this?  We literally know nothing about it.  No one has explained what this offers over open source raw.

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5 hours ago, Damphousse said:

Can we please stop requesting this?  We literally know nothing about it.  No one has explained what this offers over open source raw.

I am all for open source, but the data rates of Prores are at least half of that of cinemaDNG Raw. Even if we take the efficiency of post-processing out of the way, supporting a 4K 120p data stream of cinemaDNG raw will be unlikely. With prores RAW you at least have a chance. 

But it doesn't matter, any of the two would be miles better compared to what has come out of that camera until now. My best guess is that they will not include any and within few months they will cut the price of this camera in half. And if they don't improve the quality somehow, it will be a hard sell even then. 

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7 hours ago, tweak said:

Some of the other tests on their FB page look promising for the price IMO. Test them for yourself and see what the files are like. Lots of information in the shadows, much better DR than Panasonic IMO. Keen to see how a Raw output would perform. 

People blowing off a camera because one clip/s look bad is pretty funny IMO. I could find you thousands of bad clips shot with similar spec cameras... I guess that means they suck as well ;) .

I couldn't agree more. These are the very first samples from the camera. They seem to have neither log nor any flat profile, and the fact that the CEO is playing with the football in the video (which incidentally nobody else seemed to notice) seems to indicate how casual and informal (non final) the nature of this video is.

 

18 minutes ago, Don Kotlos said:

I am all for open source, but the data rates of Prores are at least half of that of cinemaDNG Raw. Even if we take the efficiency of post-processing out of the way, supporting a 4K 120p data stream of cinemaDNG raw will be unlikely. With prores RAW you at least have a chance. 

But it doesn't matter, any of the two would be miles better compared to what has come out of that camera until now. My best guess is that they will not include any and within few months they will cut the price of this camera in half. And if they don't improve the quality somehow, it will be a hard sell even then. 

I am not completely sure about these figures. What are the flavours of RAW that you are referring to? Blackmagic itself has 3 flavours on the BMPCC4k. So it basically would depend on the kind of flavour of RAW. 

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54 minutes ago, sanveer said:

I am not completely sure about these figures. What are the flavours of RAW that you are referring to? Blackmagic itself has 3 flavours on the BMPCC4k. So it basically would depend on the kind of flavour of RAW. 

You are right I was thinking of the uncompressed RAW. 

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That they have to denoise footage shot in broad daylight doesn't set off alarms for some people? 

I dunno, if the camera can output better footage than this I'm not sure why they'd even release this footage which is, too put it mildly, underwhelming. 

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I have to say I'm bewildered why they've released this footage.

The camera is very interesting but let's be honest they lost a lot of buzz when the Pocket 4K was announced. 

The only way to get that back was to put images out there that made everyone who'd pre-ordered or was going to pre-order the Pocket 4K to think "Mmm....hang on...we might have been a bit hasty here".

Surely no one is anywhere near thinking that based on this?

Manufacturers have a difficult enough time as it is with people making their products look bad by shooting garbage with them without joining in with it themselves.

You can go too far the other way and make a glossy promo film of a £1500 camera with an unrealistic hidden supporting cast of gear and crew so it's fine to show something that is more realistically obtainable.

But it still has to be aspirational surely?

If they don't look like they care then why should we?

This is less to do with what the camera is capable of but what the company itself is capable of.

Showing such half baked and half arsed footage is not going to convince anyone that the company is in it for the long haul with this product. 

The first impression they made with their other interchangeable lens camera wasn't entirely positive and the massive price drop on it was testament to that so they were already playing catch up in terms of perception.

As soon as the Pocket 4K was announced they must surely have known they'd really be up against it to claw back ground from an established brand coming in with something that drastically undercut it like that.

This just doesn't inspire any confidence in them whatsoever that they can build any sort of momentum to counter the Pocket 4K.

I'm the last person who wants to be a sheep and just buy what everybody else does and I like to see the underdog have a go so I'm really disappointed that this is what they've chosen to release.

It's easy to say that we shouldn't write it off based on this footage but this close to the release of the other camera it would have been better to release no footage than release this.

Better to keep quiet and have people suspect the footage from your new camera may not be all that than to open a YouTube channel and confirm it, as Mark Twain would've put it ;)

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27 minutes ago, BTM_Pix said:

Better to keep quiet and have people suspect the footage from your new camera may not be all that than to open a YouTube channel and confirm it, as Mark Twain would've put it ;)

Hahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahaha

 

 

I too think this footage is premature in a very very unfortunate way. Creating any kind of log profile or decent video codec on a camera cannot possibly be that difficult.

Also, if ZCam wants to start improving the official footage slowly and show the improvements to people ovwr weeks or months, they may have understood the mindset of prospective customers all wrong. If people start seeing great footage from the 20th or 30th video, most perspective buyers would already have migrated to things. I doubt anyone has the patience to see the magic happening. They should not give us Alpha and Beta. Just come final product in terms of video quality.

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Well the E1 certainly got better after the big FW update, so they can produce a great looking image IMO. But as others have mentioned, its odd to put out beta footage instead of a more polished product that blows people away and fires up the pre-orders. They need to get something much better before the P4k comes out of hibernation, otherwise its DOA until the 75% price break.

Chris

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