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IMX800 1-inch sensor — Are we nearing the end of dedicated consumer cameras?


Matins 2

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The Sony IMX800 is rumoured to be a 1-inch sensor designed for phones. It is expected to make its debute soon.

What does the future hold for dedicated consumer cameras if this rumour is true?

https://gsmarena.com/rumor_the_huawei_p50_phones_will_be_the_first_to_use_sonys_1_imx800_sensor-news-47938.php

https://twitter.com/RODENT950/status/1364507707907178496

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The new OnePlus and Huawei P50 look like they will have very good sensor specs. That takes care of the UWA and WA modules, but to tackle the telephoto lenses, someone will have to bring the extending lens design back and bet on a (very) thick camera hump. With every company just drowning in the dozens of models they offer, one should be a premium photo-first device.

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11 hours ago, Matins 2 said:

The Sony IMX800 is rumoured to be a 1-inch sensor designed for phones. It is expected to make its debute soon.

What does the future hold for dedicated consumer cameras if this rumour is true?

https//gsmarena.com/rumor_the_huawei_p50_phones_will_be_the_first_to_use_sonys_1_imx800_sensor-news-47938.php

https://twitter.com/RODENT950/status/1364507707907178496

It's a thing, but you have to remember the sensor isn't the camera.

For example, the Canon XC10 has a 1" sensor, but has a 24-240mm equivalent fixed lens, shoots up to 305Mbps 4K 8-bit footage with C-Log internally, and has a very long battery life.  The ergonomics are spectacular, and is has a fan to keep it cool, which it needs because it has the image processor chip that Canon don't put into their DSLR/MILC cameras.

Another example is the Sony RX10ii which has a 24-200mm f2.8 lens.

These cameras had their weak points, the most notable being that the lenses were fixed and didn't offer much shallow DoF due to the crop factor, but I very much doubt that anyone anywhere was thinking they'd be replaced by something with no zoom, terrible ergonomics, no articulating / flippy screen, and a battery that can barely run the screen for a few hours on a (non-replaceable) battery charge, without even processing video....

Would a smartphone with a 1" sensor replace a device with a tiny battery, non-articulating screen and single tiny prime lens? Maybe, but their days were numbered anyway.  Of course, it might take longer than you'd think - the wide camera on the iPhone doesn't remotely compare to a GoPro, despite using broadly the same sensor size.

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I am excited for this and will want to see what the Huawei P50 Pro is like as the Mate 40 Pro I am using now is incredible for photos. Biggest step has been with the smaller sensors and periscope folded zoom optics though. With the iPhone 12 Pro Max the step to a  larger sensor didn't make much difference although it still has a much less capable chip than the P40 / Mate 40 Pro. I think image processing on phones is so good at getting more out of smaller sensors, it does somewhat mask the step to larger physical surface area. Larger sensors can even introduce some compromises in terms optics, with ugly bokeh and poor corners.

Eventually I see phones being able to match full frame cameras for dynamic range (some they already are), low light shooting and even get closer in resolution terms but not optics.

The look of lenses will have to be simulated with computational photography and depth maps.

You can already do this with third party apps and it does work very nicely - pick your lens style (Helios 44-M for example with bokeh swirl, or even an anamorphic) and it applies the fake bokeh very convincingly.

We're a while off this being as convincing as a real full frame camera or it working in realtime at 4K/120fps though.

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30 minutes ago, Andrew Reid said:

You can already do this with third party apps and it does work very nicely - pick your lens style (Helios 44-M for example with bokeh swirl, or even an anamorphic) and it applies the fake bokeh very convincingly.

What's the app? Would love to have a play with that.

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17 hours ago, Matins 2 said:

What does the future hold

I think regardless of this particular model, the sales of traditional DSLR type cameras are going to wane so much that the market will be niche in the immediate future.

Speaking for myself, a handful of what I'm already filming now is done with a phone.  And the other camera I do use and find perfectly acceptable for my doc work is a very modest cheap m43 camera.  And I'm a quote/unquote professional. 

As phone tech advances and offers computational imagery with video, I don't see how the consumer market could be anything but dominated by mobile devices leaving camera enthusiast with slim pickins'.

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A neighbour friend of mine - a dedicated and competent Canon DSLR chap - admitted to me last weekend that his girlfriend now gets better pictures on her phone - always with her and perfect for “memory” pictures.

Phones will inevitably improve whilst sales of large, heavy ugly black boxes will decline. Both equally dramatically.

And at this point I sulk that Jim’s Hydrogen with its add-on camera modules failed...

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My iPhone is awesomely convenient, but the god awful flaring of light sources, especially at night, ruins it for me...and the plastic skin tones, and the flickering HDR auto modes, and the clunky controls when I want to manually control anything, and the ergonomics in my hand.

I'm not that convinced smartphones are going to eat everything or that traditional cameras will be regulated to a niche of a niche geek obscurity. Video is exploding. Production values are going up. Technology is advancing on all fronts.

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On 3/17/2021 at 10:12 PM, JurijTurnsek said:

One of the more striking changes that the smartphones brought, is that the 23mm-ish FOV is now the new "normal" and everything above it labeled at "tele".

They may actually be correct.  If we were able to analyse the focal length of every second of video watched by everyone in the world ("person viewing seconds" as it were) and look at what the most popular focal length was, it would likely be around 24, just because of the amount of content that is shot on phones (and kit zoom lenses also add to that but probably don't tip the balance).

Selfie culture has really made a huge impact on how people see themselves too.  A huge percentage of my female family and friends don't like me shooting video or photos of them because of what the "longer lens" does to them - ie, the wide-angle distortion from taking a selfie at arms-length that they use to make themselves look thinner / cuter is absent, but because they've gotten used to the distortion they think my lenses "do" something to them rather than understanding that their selfie camera "does" something that my lenses do not do.

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