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Sharp's new 8K M43 camera

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19 hours ago, Snowbro said:

The Sharp presenter said it will be great for vloggers. How many girls do you know that will want their face filmed in 8k? haha

Hey, don't underestimate what good makeup can do.

17 hours ago, Nikkor said:

8k on a tiny sensor is pretty pointless. Even on fullframe it's on the limit and is more a way of getting true 4K because of the Bayer array. 

Not true, there's definitely room to grow. 36mp on f/4 at m4/3 just about hits the diffraction limit, for example.

14 hours ago, Davide said:

Seriously.....who needs 8K? 

That's a good question. I personally think it might be one step too far, but that's what many said of 4K vs 1080p Full HD, so who knows? Prognostication of this level is difficult, so I'm not going to attempt it. 😛

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EOSHD Pro Color for Sony cameras EOSHD Pro LOG for Sony CamerasEOSHD C-LOG and Film Profiles for All Canon DSLRs

I saw the video they posted on 43rumors.com ( https://www.43rumors.com/sharp-has-developed-the-new-30-megapixel-micro-four-thirds-sensor-and-the-camera-might-cost-around-3000/#disqus_thread ) and he mentioned that Sharp introduced the 8k Professional /Broadcast camera last year which is for 100k (77k plus accessories), and this should be in the 3k-5k range for ... bloggers, and I am suddenly wondering what low bitrate codec this will have. Sharp could have kept this solely for 8k 12-bit/14-bit photos and 10:1-15:1 compressed 4k 12-bit RAW video. He also mentioned this will have Stabilization, and I am wondering whether it is a M43 sensor or an APS-C one since the professional camera has a Super 35mm sensor. 

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1 hour ago, sanveer said:

. He also mentioned this will have Stabilization, and I am wondering whether it is a M43 sensor or an APS-C one since the professional camera has a Super 35mm sensor. 

I read someplace it was a m4/3 sensor with a m4/3 mount.

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This is a Foxconn initiative. It has a Canon sized $30B company behind it.

Apparently Foxconn is trying to step out of its roots as a contract manufacturer and to achieve end product producer status.

High definition video offers them an unusual opportunity to do just that. They are familiar with the technologies involved, but have no existing franchise to nurture.

Hence they have the opportunity to disrupt a complacent sector and to develop a new line of business independent of their existing base.

Canon's frantic '8K is in our road map' comment suggests they recognize the challenge.

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7 hours ago, leeys said:

It's a strange realm to fight though; you'd think they'd do something more consumer focused.

Nah, go big or go home.

and a consumer 8K m43 camera is definitely going big.  

Just ask yourself WWCD? (what would Canon do?) and then do the opposite!!

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Most of the 8K TV's I saw on demo in stores in Japan were Sharp ones so them being first with something a consumer can create their own content in 8K with doesn't surprise me.

But I have to say I'm surprised at it being in this form factor of being an interchangeable lens camera as I thought it would be much more in the realm of a Sony RX10/Panasonic FZ2000 type of camera if not even a traditional camcorder format like a Sony NX80/AX700. 

Whilst the price seems very high for it to be a "consumer" product, its actually far less in relative terms versus the cost of the screen its intended to provide content for than it was for those early adopters who wanted to do the same for HD and 4K. 

And its certainly cheaper than Sharp's other 8K camcorder.

 

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6 hours ago, kye said:

Nah, go big or go home.

and a consumer 8K m43 camera is definitely going big.  

Just ask yourself WWCD? (what would Canon do?) and then do the opposite!!

Any dedicated camera is not going big; standalone sales number at 30m per year and are going down; smartphones sell 300m in a QUARTER alone. That's consumer numbers.

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I was all Panasonic S1 up to discovering this. Now I don't know what to think.
S1 is bulky and full frame, and this super compact which I love (especially the fact there's no viewfinder prism), video dedicated, but for some reason I am afraid vloggers' oriented i.e. it will lack many features Panasonic offers.
Ah, the time will tell.

 

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I have no clue how Panasonic thinks they are going to compete with a Photo camera against Canon, Nikon. That sounds crazy. Photo stuff is all about super good AF and Tons of lens choices. And then you throw in Sony, nah weird path they are on.

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On 1/9/2019 at 5:59 PM, kye said:

8K has four times the pixels of 4K, so 8K30 is equivalent to 4K120 in terms of pixels-per-second.

You might be right about less processor intensive processing but they'd have to be choosing from the options available in the marketplace which may not have a less-compression / higher bit rate option at the right price. Of course, if you were a microchip manufacturer then investing in the market for a 8K video compression chip isn't a risky proposition, and phones have been doing 4K60 with efficient power consumption and thermal loading for a few years now, so it's not like the tech is that far away.

 

Current processor technology likely could encode 8K30p, but it would require serious cooling to do so, which is not practical in consumer setups.

On 1/11/2019 at 7:50 PM, Video Hummus said:

I'd take better quality 4K, i.e better dynamic range, 10bit, HDR, compressed RAW codec over 8K any day. 5 years from now I'll take 8K standard. I think people are under estimating the burden of handling 8K video. With media costs where they are at today, 8K is just stupid in a consumer camera. There are a lot of factors that make a particular scene in a video compelling. Resolution is at the bottom. Yes, I'm aware a 480p video is worst than a 1080p, but there is the law of diminishing returns.

From most important to least.

1. Audio
1.5 Composition 😉
2. Lighting
3. Dynamic Range
4. Bit rate
5. Bit depth
6. Resolution (1080p and up)
 

Not when people have 85" 8K TV panels as the consumer standard (and yes, that will happen sooner than you think). You can already tell the difference between UHD and FHD on a 65" 4K panel (when footage is actually shot with a camera that delivers properly resolved 4K). What do you suppose will happen when the consumer sweet spot hits 85" 8K? All of your FHD footage that is really only 720p resolution is going to look pretty dated on those screens.

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52 minutes ago, webrunner5 said:

I have no clue how Panasonic thinks they are going to compete with a Photo camera against Canon, Nikon. That sounds crazy. Photo stuff is all about super good AF and Tons of lens choices. And then you throw in Sony, nah weird path they are on.

I have Panasonic's current full frame camera (the one with the expensive German overcoat) and I've got to say that based on my experiences with that and then adding in the four years subsequent development that they will have had by the time the new one is released that they will do just fine with it as a pure photo camera.

The drawback of the current one is the limited range of lenses and the eye watering price of them.

Both of those aspects will be addressed by the alliance between Panasonic, Leica and Sigma.

What they will actually be offering with this camera is a mark II version of the Leica SL at less than half the price with a vastly expanded and cheaper lens line up.

When viewed like that, even taking off the premium cost factor of adding the red dot, it is a competitive offering.

If nothing else they will shift a bunch of lenses to owners of their existing full frame camera ;)

 

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Oh I don't doubt it is impressive. Leica stuff is that. But how good will the AF be. You going to shot wildlife, BIF, Sports with your Leica? Panasonic ain't exactly known for great AF. And if they keep that same thing they have now, which it sounds like they are with AI, it still is not going to beat phase detect or DPAF you know that. And they are not going to have 400mm, 600mm lenses out anytime soon.

Sure it will help you out lens cost wise but. It's like this new Zeiss FF camera. How many do you think are going to buy it. There is only so many Dentists LoL. The FF arena is just becoming too damn crowded now for all of them to make a buck. Somebody is going to bite the dust hard.

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28 minutes ago, webrunner5 said:

Oh I don't doubt it is impressive. Leica stuff is that. But how good will the AF be. You going to shot wildlife, BIF, Sports with your Leica? 

Well I did actually shoot an international match with the Leica SL a few months ago but that's another story!

To be brutually honest, nothing has come along in the mirrorless realm from any of the manufacturers (including Nikon and Canon themselves) that has come close to usurping mirrored versions for sport at that level anyway so in that respect it won't be much different.

For all the specs of these cameras, you know full well that I'm still going to beat that drum and say it none of it translates into them breaking that stranglehold at the sharp end.

The long lens issue is an unknown until Sigma produce their roadmap as I would expect it to be them rather than Panasonic that would service that end. They have a serious back catalogue to work from though and one thing that isn't talked about much is that they have always had to reverse engineer and make tweaks to get them to work with other cameras so it will be interesting to see how much performance boost they can get when they are involved from the ground up.

Having said that, I have an SD Quattro with a 30mm ART that is entirely their design from end to end and the AF on it is absolutely shit so probably not ;)

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1 hour ago, BTM_Pix said:

Well I did actually shoot an international match with the Leica SL a few months ago but that's another story!

To be brutually honest, nothing has come along in the mirrorless realm from any of the manufacturers (including Nikon and Canon themselves) that has come close to usurping mirrored versions for sport at that level anyway so in that respect it won't be much different.

For all the specs of these cameras, you know full well that I'm still going to beat that drum and say it none of it translates into them breaking that stranglehold at the sharp end.

The long lens issue is an unknown until Sigma produce their roadmap as I would expect it to be them rather than Panasonic that would service that end. They have a serious back catalogue to work from though and one thing that isn't talked about much is that they have always had to reverse engineer and make tweaks to get them to work with other cameras so it will be interesting to see how much performance boost they can get when they are involved from the ground up.

Having said that, I have an SD Quattro with a 30mm ART that is entirely their design from end to end and the AF on it is absolutely shit so probably not ;)

Well I am sure Sigma can reverse engineer the Sig Monster and other lenses like it. They have some darn nice long lenses. So Yeah the S1R may have a lead right out of the box over other contenders. But none of the Sigma big lenses I would call L class lenses. They are very good but not super great, at least some of the older ones I have owned. Maybe now they are better?

I would have thought you would have bought the SD H model for what you do? Too big of files?? I sort of like the look of the DP2 Quattro more myself. I actually like the Merrills more, but they are lacking resolution in this day and age. I love Foveon cameras. I have had a lot of them.

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