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Andrew Reid

Nikon Z6 / Z7 to go RAW with Atomos Ninja V - could Panasonic be next?

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15 hours ago, webrunner5 said:

There isn't hardly anybody going to do pure Raw on here. You would have to win the Lotto to buy the Media, let alone the Storage. You are talking minutes, even seconds of video on a card, even a SSD is a joke on a long take.

You are so RIGHT.
That is why I do not understand why manufacturers do not access "industrial standards" and keep creating more or less toys regarding the "memory media".

The M.2 "memory card" is an SSD in a container who is smaller than the SD (and expanable up to 3 times longer).
How about an RAID, this can rise to over 30GB/s with 4 "memory modules" of M.2, and this is already enough.

M.2 size.jpg

M.2 PRO.jpg

M.2 EVO.jpg

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The TYPE 2230 is smaller than SD card. How about 1630 ?
Sure, bigger capacity, bigger size, but you will have both spped and capacity for a video RAW, a TRUE VIDEO RAW, not a "rawish" "codec RAW".

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8 hours ago, BasiliskFilm said:

 

This is the same company who produced the retro Df, which deliberately removed video to keep all the photo purists happy! Nice to see they have moved on. 

I'm a huge fan of the Df. Nothing wrong with making dedicated tools. Not everything needs to be a jack-of-all-trades. The problem with the Df in some ways was that it didn't take it far enough. They could've left the AF out of there and got rid of a lot more buttons. On the other hand the Df was perhaps the most versatile digital camera Nikon has ever made in terms of how you could use it. I'm a fan of Fujifilms layout too but the thing with the Df was that you could switch into 'A" with the mode dial while the shutter speed dial was still set to for example 250 and then when the light became stable again you flicked back to 'M'. Sort of a built in memory function. This kind of thing got panned in the reviews because people only had a few weeks with the camera. But if you worked with it for a few months or years it opened up so many ways of working. Amazing ergonomics and the most fun DSLR Nikon has ever made. And that sensor is incredible. 

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12 hours ago, Castorp said:

I'm a huge fan of the Df. Nothing wrong with making dedicated tools. Not everything needs to be a jack-of-all-trades. The problem with the Df in some ways was that it didn't take it far enough. They could've left the AF out of there and got rid of a lot more buttons. On the other hand the Df was perhaps the most versatile digital camera Nikon has ever made in terms of how you could use it. I'm a fan of Fujifilms layout too but the thing with the Df was that you could switch into 'A" with the mode dial while the shutter speed dial was still set to for example 250 and then when the light became stable again you flicked back to 'M'. Sort of a built in memory function. This kind of thing got panned in the reviews because people only had a few weeks with the camera. But if you worked with it for a few months or years it opened up so many ways of working. Amazing ergonomics and the most fun DSLR Nikon has ever made. And that sensor is incredible. 

I'm all in favour of retro fun; I even put a roll of Ilford FP4 through my Pentax Spotmatic recently. Sadly I don't have the time or money to buy multiple expensive bodies, and the Z6 seems to be the Swiss Army Knife sweet spot at the moment, especially with my existing Nikon modern and vintage glass.

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7 hours ago, Eric Calabros said:

Apparently its 10bit implementation 😐

I don't know what's the benefit over 10bit 4:4:4. 

If you are referring to the Nikon Z6 it is definitely 12 bit raw... Per Jeremy Young founder and CEO of Atomos. Not sure where you heard otherwise, but you are misinformed.

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On 1/10/2019 at 2:03 PM, thebrothersthre3 said:

I wouldn't call 1.18 a large crop. 

1.18 x 1.5 =1.77. Yep, that's huge.

In any case, I am not buying a FF camera to get any kind of crop. I hope the S1 will be 4K60p no crop, and same for A7SIII. If there is a crop on a FF like the EOS-R, then I am better buying a smaller sensor, with lenses that are smaller and eventually getting the same final crop. 

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1 hour ago, wolf33d said:

1.18 x 1.5 =1.77. Yep, that's huge.

In any case, I am not buying a FF camera to get any kind of crop. I hope the S1 will be 4K60p no crop, and same for A7SIII. If there is a crop on a FF like the EOS-R, then I am better buying a smaller sensor, with lenses that are smaller and eventually getting the same final crop. 

Not when compared to 1.5X as its a APSC sensor. On a full frame camera yes I agree 1.77 is a big crop. I'd still rather have cropped 4k 60 then none at all. I mean something is better than nothing.

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Cinema-like, you mean? Yeah, this is a step forward pretty friendly for all of us end users no matter where our money is.

Bias and fanboyism have become a poor quality show off, lately.

The more affordable the gear pops up the more 'my team shirt is more colorful than yours' will be heard from.

E : -)

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1 hour ago, Video Hummus said:

I would really hope Panasonic considers adding this to at least their GH5S cameras. It is a cinema-lite camera after all.

It's nothing they can't add. I asked them about this at NAB, and they told me they would add it if they felt it was needed to even the playing field.  

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Would love to see Atomos develop their own raw file standard and open it for free to all NLEs. ProResRAW is great but its stuck in FinalCut only. I dont see Apple allowing their competition to have it for free.

I cant see Apple going through the trouble to design ProResRAW only to give it out to everybody for no reason.

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8 hours ago, Cliff Totten said:

Would love to see Atomos develop their own raw file standard and open it for free to all NLEs. ProResRAW is great but its stuck in FinalCut only. I dont see Apple allowing their competition to have it for free.

I cant see Apple going through the trouble to design ProResRAW only to give it out to everybody for no reason.

Would be neat if they were able to have braw as an option too. That would be amazing. 

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There is some interesting bits of information contained within the (lengthy) share offer prospectus for Atomos from a few months ago.

Aside from them licensing an SoC to JVC for upcoming video cameras (which may mean hello LS300 MKii ?), four new products for 2019 described as 'next generation' and some interesting data about how big the market is for external recorders, which is bigger than I thought.

One other thing, though, which crops up several times throughout the prospectus as a risk factor is a dispute with RED.

384739347_ScreenShot2019-01-14at23_29_08.png.25ce128a848e17b7e37a9fda302b4d14.png

Elsewhere in the document it states that RED are in the same dispute with another party and, whilst it might not necessarily mean its to do with ProRes RAW and REDCODE it does seem a coincidence that the date of the dispute coincides with the announcement from NAB.

Hopefully it will get resolved and if it is about ProRes RAW that it won't put the brakes on the development of it and expanding it to other camera brands and models.

Full document here 

http://downloads.atomos.com/investor/IPO Prospectus.pdf

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Interesting, Young was in Black Magic as well, while they took most of the Canopus employees!

The agreement with JVC ends June 2019. LS300 was a very promising and groundbraking machine, if they can match the AtomIC1 SoC with a dual ISO variable sensor, then they have a winner in their hands. Imagine a P4K with an APS-C sensor and native m43 mount with inbuild ND (yes, this is still the Holy Grail) and all the rest.

 

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5 minutes ago, Kisaha said:

Interesting, Young was in Black Magic as well, while they took most of the Canopus employees!

The agreement with JVC ends June 2019. LS300 was a very promising and groundbraking machine, if they can match the AtomIC1 SoC with a dual ISO variable sensor, then they have a winner in their hands. Imagine a P4K with an APS-C sensor and native m43 mount with inbuild ND (yes, this is still the Holy Grail) and all the rest.

 

I'm still hopeful they can work together to add ProRes RAW to my original one as one last firmware hurrah.

I'd buy the Ninja V in a heartbeat, not least to gain an actual viable monitoring capability !

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