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Andrew Reid

Find the best video quality for under $200 - fun challenge

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8 hours ago, kye said:

2 weeks!  2 weeks!?!?  You're hilarious!!

Shipping to Australia often costs more than the item and takes MONTHS.  When I was buying lots of old valves/tubes from the eastern block the ebay feedback time limit would close before I received the goods in the post!  I had items take 10 weeks sometimes!!

I received a package on Monday that I'd ordered in mid-May from JAPAN.  A modern country with effective logistics infrastructure, strong trade relations, and is even in the same timezone as me!

2 weeks.....  


MONTHS??? Oh if only I was so lucky! There was one time when I order a stone tablet that took so many thousands of years to get to here that the frozen ice pathway connecting the continents had melted away. Thus it is trapped there for now on the wrong side of the oceans, I'm waiting for the next ice age and continental plate shift to happen so that the pathway here reemerges. 

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5 hours ago, kye said:

There are, they're just not what you'd call 'competitive' :)

 Australia has historically been subject to the 'Australia tax' which makes new goods about 40-80% more expensive due to lack of competition through wholesalers having a monopoly across a geographic area, and while this is currently diminishing, I still get a lot of "this item does not ship to your location" on Amazon, and retailers here haven't really adjusted to internet pricing.  In terms of local second hand goods, shipping costs somewhat kills price competition:

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People here who are spending even a few thousand on luxury items like electronics, fashion, or even art, often fly to Asia to buy and then bring things home in their luggage as the total cost is less than buying locally!

It's a good thing though, it somewhat curbs my bower-bird-like curiosity 😂😂😂


You're still much more likely to snag a bargain in Australian than New Zealand!

I remember one time I almost almost purchased the Sony a7Smk1 because it was so cheap in Australia compared to locally in NZ, but I just couldn't figure out the logistics of getting my cousin in Sydney to buy it and the a7S to be paid for before the sale ended 😞  :-/ A missed opportunity for me. 

Ditto audio, I'm far far far more likely to find a bargain in Australia than NZ! (is where for instance I purchased my Cedar DNS-2 from, a guy in Melbourne)

But yes, I do very much agree that in general Australian prices are far worse than many other parts of the world (such as the UK / USA / Asia), could be worse though... you could be living in NZ. 

 

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5 hours ago, IronFilm said:

I reckon the amount should be expressed just in one currency, and we can convert it ourselves into whatever our local Pesos currency is. 

And to exclude shipping costs as well, which helps level the playing field a teeny tiny bit between those who live at the ends of the earth like myself and @Mattias Burling living in the golden paradise of Sweden.

To help our Aussie friends, shipping cost is not included in the $200. So if just the camera is under that limit you're fine, and hopefully you might even have something that cheap lying around on your shelf to take part in with.

@Mattias Burling doesn't seem to struggle with price at the other 'end of the earth', that remote Siberian wasteland of Sweden... In fact, he gets his stuff so cheap, I once considered moving  the blog there. Mattias will be doing this challenge on a RED Weapon he traded in some bottle caps for.

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4 minutes ago, Andrew Reid said:

@Mattias Burling doesn't seem to struggle with price at the other 'end of the earth', that remote Siberian wasteland of Sweden... In fact, he gets his stuff so cheap, I once considered moving  the blog there. Mattias will be doing this challenge on a RED Weapon he traded in some bottle caps for.


Yes, I gave Mattias specifically as an example of someone who is living with local sources of very cheap secondhand gear! A golden paradise indeed. 

 

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2 hours ago, Andrew Reid said:

To help our Aussie friends, shipping cost is not included in the $200. So if just the camera is under that limit you're fine, and hopefully you might even have something that cheap lying around on your shelf to take part in with.

@Mattias Burling doesn't seem to struggle with price at the other 'end of the earth', that remote Siberian wasteland of Sweden... In fact, he gets his stuff so cheap, I once considered moving  the blog there. Mattias will be doing this challenge on a RED Weapon he traded in some bottle caps for.

ok.... listen... I bought something for $175 US already...

I didn't know the shipping and duties are all supposed to be within $200 too.

Shipping + duties easily makes it well over $200....

Just take it as it is.... I'm participating in this goddamn motherfuckin competition alright...

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17 minutes ago, Mattias Burling said:

Just browsed a little in the sub €200 range. The GX800, EOS-M, Nex-7 etc are all easy to find, but also obvious and a little boring.

But the original RX100.. that could be fun.

Just over budget, but the original rx10 as well, they even gave that one the XAVCS update.

I snagged a rx10 at the end of March for $245 during a KEH sale. 

 

 

 

 

 

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The results of my morning walk yesterday....

Not an official entry (I may as well just put the camera in a box now in preparation for shipping it..) just a kind of proof of concept test.  

I went for the "it's rubbish, so mess it up and make it look like early film" but I know very little about early film, so there you go.

Equipment used: Panasonic GF3, Super Takumar 55mm f1.8, generic 0.7x m42 to m43 SB.  Graded in Resolve.

Things I learned:

  • It's difficult to focus on a fixed LCD screen with no MF assist functions
  • It's kind-of pocketable and the tiny fold-out Manfrotto Pocket worked well for low angles on the ground, benches, rubbish bins, etc
  • People really get freaked out...  one guy walked into the middle of my shot, stopped, pulled out his phone and using selfie mode had a good look at me and took a photo.  All the time I'm just standing there looking at the screen on the camera and thinking "get out of my shot! why couldn't you have just walked though it like a normal person!"
  • I should have added way more film-grain in post to survive the YT compression
  • The camera has no manual controls in video mode, but if you set the camera to manual stills mode, 1/50 and base ISO then you can adjust ND/aperture to expose correctly, then when it auto-everything's in video mode it should get a 1/50 with base ISO....   it should do, anyway.  This wasn't shot with an ND, just in dark conditions, and some of these shots weren't set up right so shutter angles will be all over the place.
  • I took a photo (RAW still) and video from the same location, then overplayed them in post to compare.  Whomever manages to get 4k will absolutely kill everyone else.

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14 hours ago, IronFilm said:


You're still much more likely to snag a bargain in Australian than New Zealand!

I remember one time I almost almost purchased the Sony a7Smk1 because it was so cheap in Australia compared to locally in NZ, but I just couldn't figure out the logistics of getting my cousin in Sydney to buy it and the a7S to be paid for before the sale ended 😞  :-/ A missed opportunity for me. 

Ditto audio, I'm far far far more likely to find a bargain in Australia than NZ! (is where for instance I purchased my Cedar DNS-2 from, a guy in Melbourne)

But yes, I do very much agree that in general Australian prices are far worse than many other parts of the world (such as the UK / USA / Asia), could be worse though... you could be living in NZ. 

 

Not to mention import taxes :O

I once bought some headphones from overseas and got slapped with a $200 bill when it entered the country. Customs held it ransom until I paid them. Although even with the import tax it was still cheaper than if I'd bought it locally 🤔

On top of that Australia's wages are significantly higher than ours. So we get to enjoy high product prices AND low wages (although on the bright side I guess at least our government doesn't hold refugees indefinitely in offshore detention centres to the point that they set themselves on fire and then prosecute them for attempting suicide)

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5 hours ago, kye said:

The results of my morning walk yesterday....

Not an official entry (I may as well just put the camera in a box now in preparation for shipping it..) just a kind of proof of concept test.  

I went for the "it's rubbish, so mess it up and make it look like early film" but I know very little about early film, so there you go.

Equipment used: Panasonic GF3, Super Takumar 55mm f1.8, generic 0.7x m42 to m43 SB.  Graded in Resolve.

 

Great video. Well I can see this not going to be an easy challenge!

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Not entering cos I suck at video regardless of camera but may I suggest that people might get better value away from things like like Sony A mount cameras might be found cheaper?    The other ones that could be great bargains include the A3000 type Sony's.    They look like DSLRs and are cheaply made with small EVFs but are actually quite decent mirrorless cameras from what I can see ( I want one but even $200 is a bit steep right now as is the original $150 sigh!).   Besides my ancient Canon 450D does not even have video and if it did it would no doubt stink since the jpegs do (RAW is ok with decent lenses like L's).       If I was going to enter it would be with a point and shoot I got from a Op shop for around $10 but only has 720p.

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Okay, final two questions regarding rules...

1. I found a couple cameras that come with lenses but they’re over the $200 limit. If the lens could be sold for the difference, is that allowed?

2. Can we enter more than one video if we find multiple cameras?

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In my mind you can do whatever you want and then state your case afterwards. If it feels ok it probably is.

The goal is a sub €200 camera and if it's €220 that will be taken into consideration. So if it's neck and neck between two videos and one was under budget it will win.

I really don't think we need to have the rules in such detail for a friendly competition. 

Personally I'm not trying everything to max the budget, instead I will try to go as low as possible. I mean a store here has a used GH4 in the sub €300 so a G6 or GX80 is probably doable. But what's the fun in that :)

 

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1 hour ago, noone said:

Not entering cos I suck at video regardless of camera but may I suggest that people might get better value away from things like like Sony A mount cameras might be found cheaper?    The other ones that could be great bargains include the A3000 type Sony's.    They look like DSLRs and are cheaply made with small EVFs but are actually quite decent mirrorless cameras from what I can see ( I want one but even $200 is a bit steep right now as is the original $150 sigh!).   Besides my ancient Canon 450D does not even have video and if it did it would no doubt stink since the jpegs do (RAW is ok with decent lenses like L's).       If I was going to enter it would be with a point and shoot I got from a Op shop for around $10 but only has 720p.

I was contemplating not entering because I was pretty sure I'd be last..  

Maybe the 'cheapest camera you can find' is a better approach?  I do like the sound of that :) 

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11 minutes ago, mercer said:

@Mattias Burling that makes sense. I don’t care about winning, I see this as a way to mess around with some older cameras I’ve always wanted to test. In fact, the safe bet is to buy the cheapest camera possible since I could lose it if I come in dead last. 

Yeah, thats actually a smart way to get people to keep it reasonable. 
One can do everything imaginable to get that BMCC under $200 or slightly above. But if it comes of as "cheating" it might be last and "bye bye camera".

Ive always had my trusty old GM1 as my backup incase I don't have time to find something else. But when thinking about it.. I don't want to loose it :) 

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i'll have a go, I do have a couple of questions. Such as software for creating content ?

I assume since the creative side is being encouraged does what software is used count? i got a full version of resolve with the bmp4k ( obviously using the bmp4k is out of the question but what about resolve ? ) not sure what differences there are between the full version and the free version. Does using the full version give me an unfair advantage ? the reality being i know about 1/100th of what resolve can do but thats beside the point.

i have an older camera that now retails for about $150 on ebay with a cheap m42 adapter and one of my pentax m42 lenses i should fit within the parameters stated, except the pentax 85mm 1.9, that one would take me over budget 😳

by the way are  entries to be critiqued ? i'm open to the idea of learning but being ridiculed from one end of the internet to the other might not be much fun

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7 hours ago, kye said:

Whomever manages to get 4k will absolutely kill everyone else.

I would think that peoples skill and creativity will be way more of a deciding factor that the negligible "improvement" 4K gives in a sub $200 camera.

5 minutes ago, leslie said:

by the way are  entries to be critiqued ?

Post something online and it will.

5 minutes ago, leslie said:

 

i'll have a go, I do have a couple of questions. Such as software for creating content ?

Same as everything else. Use what ever you like but it might be taken into consideration by people.
If it feels ok, it probably is.

6 minutes ago, leslie said:

being ridiculed from one end of the internet to the other might not be much fun

Anyone ridiculing another persons work in a learning exercise is either jealous, an idiot or a bot.
You only need to ever care about constructive criticism and there is never any ridiculing in that.

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