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Andrew Reid

Sony A7S Mark 3 - What to expect

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7 hours ago, webrunner5 said:

Hell the damn thing is in French LoL!

Thanksfully I am French. 

But the video is BS. The guy himself says he has absolutely no clue what Sony is preparing as it so well kept secret in Japan 

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I'm praying for 4k60 on the A7SIII just like everyone else but I'm not holding my breath.  If they didn't even do it with the much larger body FS5-II what hope do we have of getting it on the A7SIII?  Maybe we'll get a bump in the bitrate or something.

Or maybe they'll make the jump to h265 finally and we'll get better quality with the same bitrate.  And they can finally claim they bested the 4 year old Samsung NX-1.

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22 hours ago, tellure said:

I'm praying for 4k60 on the A7SIII just like everyone else but I'm not holding my breath. If they didn't even do it with the much larger body FS5-II what hope do we have of getting it on the A7SIII? 

Quite some hope actually. 
You know, the FS5 is not in the same market as the A7. It has millions things (pro camera features) that the A7 does not have and it has very advanced external recording capabilities. Therefore it is totally possible that Sony will release a A7S with 4K60P even if FS5 does not have it because it has many other things that the former does not have. It would not be the first time something like this happens. 

And look at the A9. 4500$ and a few months after you get a A7III which has better IQ (dynamic range) and 95% of A9 functions for 2500$ less. What was the hope of that? 
Well the A9 has 1-2 pro features (burst shooting..) on top of A7III. 

So here you go my friend. Quite some hope. 

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Bless your heart @wolf33d, you're a very optimistic person! I kinda doubt the A7S III will have internal 4K 60p unless they have some giant breakthrough in processing to prevent overheating. I think people really don't understand how big of an achievement it was that the GH5 was able to do this in camera and implement it so well. It's not an easy feat in such a small body. 

And the FS5 mk II is relevant because it was just announced, is a professional cinema camera, and didn't include 4K 60p. There's more of a reason to include it in that camera than there is for the A7S III. 

The A9 is a stills camera that has basic video features. It's not marketed for hybrid and video shooters, which should be apparent given it only does 1080p. Comparing its video features to the A7III doesn't make sense. 

Part of the reason people are drawing blanks on what Sony could have in store for the A7S III is because there's a limit to what they can do based on the tech. They already push their cameras to the limit given the tech in them, so it feels like, to achieve a lot of people's requests, they're going to need to have some kind of breakthrough. It's reasonable to expect that they have something big, but how big and what the implications could be are completely unknown. 

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37 minutes ago, newfoundmass said:

Bless your heart @wolf33d, you're a very optimistic person! I kinda doubt the A7S III will have internal 4K 60p unless they have some giant breakthrough in processing to prevent overheating. I think people really don't understand how big of an achievement it was that the GH5 was able to do this in camera and implement it so well. It's not an easy feat in such a small body. 

And the FS5 mk II is relevant because it was just announced, is a professional cinema camera, and didn't include 4K 60p. There's more of a reason to include it in that camera than there is for the A7S III. 

 The A9 is a stills camera that has basic video features. It's not marketed for hybrid and video shooters, which should be apparent given it only does 1080p. Comparing its video features to the A7III doesn't make sense. 

Part of the reason people are drawing blanks on what Sony could have in store for the A7S III is because there's a limit to what they can do based on the tech. They already push their cameras to the limit given the tech in them, so it feels like, to achieve a lot of people's requests, they're going to need to have some kind of breakthrough. It's reasonable to expect that they have something big, but how big and what the implications could be are completely unknown. 

- Panasonic did it, Sony can. No technological barrier here. Not saying it is easy but they can

- You totally missed my point with the A9. I never compared the A9 video features (which shoots 4K unlike what you say by the way) with the A7III. I was comparing photo. The point is that Sony did not hesitate to release the A7III which is almost an A9 for much less, so they wont hesitate to release something with 4k60p even if they have a 5000$ camera that does not. 

- If Sony releases a A7S III tomorrow with 4K30p, at 3000$, nobody will buy it. Nobody wants a 12mpx piece of crap when they get better (A7III) for 1000$ less. Plus the competition (GH5) does 4K60p for a year already. 

I would not bet money, but I am 80% sure the A7S III will have 4K60p. Simply makes no sense otherwise. Sony knows it and that's probably the reason why you do not see one in store yet (along with the fact the A7III is sold out so they are not in rush)

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35 minutes ago, wolf33d said:

Panasonic did it, Sony can. No technological barrier here. Not saying it is easy but they can

Based on Sony's current mirrorless offerings there definitely does seem to be a tech barrier. 

35 minutes ago, wolf33d said:

You totally missed my point with the A9. I never compared the A9 video features (which shoots 4K unlike what you say by the way) with the A7III. I was comparing photo. The point is that Sony did not hesitate to release the A7III which is almost an A9 for much less, so they wont hesitate to release something with 4k60p even if they have a 5000$ camera that does not. 

You're right. For some reason I thought it only had HD. I could've sworn Max Yuryev went to the premier and that it could only shoot 1080p and didn't have s-log. 

Again though, it is a camera marketed for photography with features that appeal to photographers, specifically double in burst mode which isn't a minor difference for photographers. They were also released almost a year apart. 

35 minutes ago, wolf33d said:

If Sony releases a A7S III tomorrow with 4K30p, at 3000$, nobody will buy it. Nobody wants a 12mpx piece of crap when they get better (A7III) for 1000$ less. Plus the competition (GH5) does 4K60p for a year already. 

We'll see. Again we have no real idea what to expect, but I think it's a taller order than you think to record 4K 60p internal unless there is a major breakthrough in the processing. That MAY be why it's been in development for longer than people expected? 

35 minutes ago, wolf33d said:

I would not bet money, but I am 80% sure the A7S III will have 4K60p. Simply makes no sense otherwise. Sony knows it and that's probably the reason why you do not see one in store yet (along with the fact the A7III is sold out so they are not in rush)

I think it's very possible, even likely, that it outputs 4K 60p but internally? Who knows. I feel like you put way too much emphasis on 60p and auto focus. I think @Shirozina makes a good point, I think 10 bit and a higher bit rate is just as important to many shooters. 

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24 minutes ago, scotchtape said:

I want 4k60p too or no go for me too. Even if codec is a bit better it's not worth 3k... I have gh5 and a7iii and I use 4k60 frequently and it sucks not having it on Sony.  Not to mention the crap ibis for video.

Good luck with getting better IBS as the physical limitations of a smaller body size and 4x sensor size mean it will always be inferior.

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On 6/24/2018 at 2:34 AM, Shirozina said:

Good luck with getting better IBS as the physical limitations of a smaller body size and 4x sensor size mean it will always be inferior.

With IBIS at least there is IBIS. Better than nothing. Also one can use a gimbal which works 10 times better than any IBIS. 

4K60p what are you gonna use to replace it? Twixtor ..? lol 

Same for a good AF. 

On 6/24/2018 at 1:14 AM, newfoundmass said:

I think 10 bit and a higher bit rate is just as important to many shooters. 

See message above. 4K60P and good AF is very hard to replace. 10 bit... Well yes gives you a little more margin to grade than 8 bit.
Not saying I would not want 10 bit, would be great, just that for me a good AF is more important. 

It is for Sony also a question of marketing. I think we have more chance to se 4K60p because it's a "must" marketing wize VS the GH5 but 10bit is seen as less important for the masses. 

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I would have thought that getting 60p out of a full frame sensor takes much, much more processing than on a m4/3 sensor - not to mention the added heat dissipation issues that come along with that which are compounded by the fact that the full frame and m4/3 cameras are pretty much the same size.

Look how big the 1dx has to be. 

Short of a redesign in the body I don't see it happening. Best we can hope for is Venice colors. 

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6 minutes ago, spinkscapes said:

Then they have to be prepared to lose out big time for sales to Panasonic and Blackmagic.

 

I think some people tend to think for manufacturer way too much, its not they are giving you the profit they earned, or help you with your business in anyway beside just selling you the camera.

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54 minutes ago, spinkscapes said:

Then they have to be prepared to lose out big time for sales to Panasonic and Blackmagic.

Not necessarily. 4K60p and even 10-bit aren't the only priorities for a lot of shooters. Sensor size (FF), Low-light capabilities & AF are areas where A7S3 will trump others.

I'm more worried about A7S3 losing sales to A7III if they don't seriously upgrade the codec & 4K specs.

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5 hours ago, froess said:

If they improve the evf, the battery and lower the iso in slog2 to 400 or something like that, that already makes my life way easier.

Well Sony A7 series cameras really do have a base of ISO 400. But to get good results in Slog they have to push the thing up a couple of stops. And in reality you need to push it up even more when shooting a stop or two more yet. I use a 3 stop push at times on my A7s.  I don't ever see Slog at 400 ISO with current tech. But you might be right with a new Sensor design. Lets hope. Even 800 ISO would be a blessing.

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16 minutes ago, scotchtape said:

A7iii slog2 min iso is already 800... Where have you been.

I have been in the poor house. Way above my pay grade. I would have to sell all I got to even buy it. I have never read much about the A7 mk III. My bad.

But the A7 mk III " in S-LOG 2, the minimum ISO is 800 which is pretty good but in Hybrid LOG Gamma you can go all the way down to ISO 125! Compare that to the original A7S which was ISO 3200 minimum." Andrew's words.

So @froess Needs to buy a A7 mk III. Me I guess, I Have to keep my old shitty A7s. 😁

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