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AlexTrinder96

Atomos Shinobi (monitor only version of the Ninja V)

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https://www.cinema5d.com/atomos-shinobi-priced-ninja-recorder/

https://cvp.com/product/atomos-ao-atomshbh01-shinobi-hdmi-5in-monitor

looks decent. Cheaper body but very similar features for around £400 (no recorder) 1000nits, 427 ppi 5 inch. 

 

Monitoring FeaturesLuma Waveform, RGB parade, RGB Overlay, Vectorscope, Vectorscope Zoom, Histogram,

RGB Histogram, Anlaysis mode (Multiview scopes: Waveform, Histogram, Vectorscope), Focus Peaking,

Zebra, False Colour, Blue Only Exposure, Zoom (1:1, 2:1, 4:1), SMPTE Safe Areas, Cinema Guides, Anamorphic Desqueeze

 

 

13-02-20191550076422ao-atomshbh01.thumb.jpg.692bd872ae35024649950bd52d2b58e9.jpg

 

The new multi tool 'analysis' seems like a great feature. It simultaneously shows the image, plus waveform, histogram, vectorscope and audio-level meters. In addition, there are multiple options inside each of these tools. This gives the operator a complete picture of what is going on within the image, at any time 

Shinobi-AnalysisMode-640x363.jpg.6185b10b91f589662c47c77af1a2e4b9.jpg

 

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EOSHD Pro Color for Sony cameras EOSHD Pro LOG for Sony CamerasEOSHD C-LOG and Film Profiles for All Canon DSLRs

I'm going to bang the Ninja Star drum again but I've got to say that if they were going to split the Ninja V into its two component parts then they've arguably decided to sell the wrong half !

Don't get me wrong, its a great monitor for that price but at £349 the extra £200 for the Ninja V having the recorder is almost a no brainer.

Whereas if they reversed that equation and made a compact recorder only version for £200 then everyone who's cameras offer enhanced frame rates and bit rates over HDMI only would be all over it.

And while we're at it, Atomos would also have a big hit by doing an affordable EVF.

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I guess they've gone after people that would want the ninja v with the pocket 4k... (obviously don't need the recorder). 

Really in terms of price; I think under £350 would have been great but it still is unbeatable a this price!

16 minutes ago, BTM_Pix said:

And while we're at it, Atomos would also have a big hit by doing an affordable EVF.

couldn't agree more, seriously. People would be hot on a great evf, with less than zacuto prices 😎

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Yeah this seems kinda pointless whereas I'd pick up a 4K Ninja Star in a heartbeat. With so many cameras outputting 10-bit now it makes more sense than ever.

Definitely a gap in the market for that.

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7 minutes ago, AlexTrinder96 said:

I guess they've gone after people that would want the ninja v with the pocket 4k... (obviously don't need the recorder). 

For the Pocket 4K, the ProRes 1080p (with or without baked-in LUT) to external recorder while simultaneously recording RAW internal is often overlooked though not only for fast turnaround but also as a guerrilla route for creating a non-transcode proxy workflow so I think the recorder only option would be a big deal there too.

Even just re-releasing the Ninja Star would be a winner for that though :)   

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29 minutes ago, AlexTrinder96 said:

I guess they've gone after people that would want the ninja v with the pocket 4k... (obviously don't need the recorder).

I don't think it is aimed at Pocket owners. At this price, if you have the P4K it'd be better to get the 5inch Blackmagic Video Assist that records 1080p as well. The UI between camera and VA is the same, the batteries are the same and you can record 1080 and 4K at the same time. - the Ninja V is overkill since the P4K doesn't output 4k, and the Shinobi is just a monitor (with great features).

4 minutes ago, BTM_Pix said:

For the Pocket 4K, the ProRes 1080p (with or without baked-in LUT) to external recorder while simultaneously recording RAW internal is often overlooked though not only for fast turnaround but also as a guerrilla route for creating a non-transcode proxy workflow so I think the recorder only option would be a big deal there too.

Even just re-releasing the Ninja Star would be a winner for that though :)   

You don't need a 4K Ninja Star for that, in fact, being 4K would make it overkill for the Pocket. The OG Star - which I use a lot with the pocket - is perfect. Output the LUT and record a 1080 file and a LOG/RAW 4K file at the same time. 

In my line of work, we use 4K for backups/future proof and 1080 for actual broadcast, so a majority of shoots we're just downscaling the footage. The BMD VA or Ninja Star skips that step, and we have both resolutions in real time, automatically. The only real difference is if you'd like a monitor or not.

Interesting side-note for those who do have the P4K and the Ninja Star - the Rec trigger on the camera sets the Star to record too. Most recent cameras don't do that since Atomos changed their trigger protocol, meaning you have to press Rec on the camera and the Star.

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10 minutes ago, Anaconda_ said:

You don't need a 4K Ninja Star for that, in fact, being 4K would make it overkill for the Pocket. The OG Star - which I use a lot with the pocket - is perfect. 

I know.

That's why I said they could/should also re-relase the Ninja Star.

The argument for Pocket 4K owners having a 4K version is that they may have more than one camera that can benefit in a different way (opening up 4K60p for the LS300 etc). 

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8 minutes ago, Anaconda_ said:

I don't think it is aimed at Pocket owners. At this price, if you have the P4K it'd be better to get the 5inch Blackmagic Video Assist that records 1080p as well. The UI between camera and VA is the same, the batteries are the same and you can record 1080 and 4K at the same time. - the Ninja V is overkill since the P4K doesn't output 4k, and the Shinobi is just a monitor (with great features).

If you want a proxy then sure it would be a great fit... but how many users want that? The video assist is still great but I think a lot of users would take the 1000 nits and smaller profile of the Atomos over the  assist! 

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Is it just me or is there a big lack of 4" recorders that would be pretty great? I usually don't have trouble with on-camera monitors, but a bit more size would be great sometimes, but 5" is often overkill and just dwarfs all mirrorless cameras. 

Perhaps cameras should just start including a 4" screen - the Pocket 4K screen is awesome, but it really doesn't need to be that big (and, probably, that power hungry). I would love a 4" monitor to just siwtch between different cameras when necessary. 

I think the C200 screen is perfect in clarity, size, and weight (once you get a much better mounting solution, which is easy enough) - I think it's a bit smaller than 4"

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1 hour ago, BTM_Pix said:

The argument for Pocket 4K owners having a 4K version is that they may have more than one camera that can benefit in a different way (opening up 4K60p for the LS300 etc). 

So the argument is for people with multiple cameras, not just P4K owners?

Don’t get me wrong a 4K star would sell a bunch and I’d buy one, but not for my P4k. 

Itd also be be awful for FS5 users as using the HDMI out shuts off the LCD and viewfinder while recording 😂

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5 minutes ago, Anaconda_ said:

So the argument is for people with multiple cameras not just P4K owners?

Don’t get me wrong a 4K star would sell a bunch and I’d buy one, but not for my P4k. 

I'm not sure where the disagreement is here (or even if there is one) to be honest mate?

The original point that @AlexTrinder96 made was that Pocket 4K owners wouldn't be interested in a monitor free version of the Ninja V to which I said that they could be because it would give them a transcode free Proxy workflow but I then said it was overkill because you could use a Ninja Star if they re-released it. 

You then said they could use a Ninja Star to which I obviously agreed because I'd already said it in my original response.

 

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@BTM_Pix - no disagreement from me, I was just clarifying and adding info to what you wrote, but also trying to explain why a 4K Star wouldn't add anything to the Pocket and Star workflow that already exists, so there's no point waiting for it.

In my opinion, the Pocket 4k and the desired 4K Star don't go together at all. If they did release one, Atomos would have other cameras in mind to pair it with. As you say, the LS300 for example, or of course a small footprint Nikon/ProRes RAW option.

Sorry if my point came across any other way than intended.

@AlexTrinder96 - at this price I'd still sooner go for the 5inch BMD VA for the backup recordings with a P4K, but realise other people want different things. Is this Atomos really much smaller than the VA?

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17 hours ago, BTM_Pix said:

And while we're at it, Atomos would also have a big hit by doing an affordable EVF.

I actually made a thread a while back on here asking about "where are the affordable EVF's" Majority of folks that shoot video and i'm guessing on here don't have $2K to drop on a Zacuto EVF. 

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17 hours ago, androidlad said:

Portkeys/IKAN has one, brighter at 1500nit, similar feature set and quite a bit cheaper at $279

https://suikui.myshopify.com/products/lh5-hdr-5-1500nit-4k-signal-support-touch-screen-1920-x-1080-hdmi-on-camera-monitor-with-hdr

FYI this is exactly the same design and probably built, of an older Ikan/Chinese manufactured monitor that was notorious for its bad build quality. Check the users reviews around the net, and actually a very good friend owned one (the Ikan model was close to 450€ here) but one could found the oroginal from China for 250€, which it was an unbelievable bargain back then (not a lot of 5"-ish options).

It seems to me like the same construction with a different panel. It can be much better than the older one of course.

Also, SmallHD Focus, half the weight and much smaller than the Shinobi!

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