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Lenses to keep throughout GH4 > BMCC 4k > RED SCARLET

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Hello again,

Andy Lee, thank you for sharing your knowledge with me, the breakdown of the lenses used by feature film DP's and Directors is a great help to me and our decision!

 

Tomorrow we have a studio production meeting and we are going to discuss the camera package for the feature film,

 

The body still remains MFT Lumix GH4

The lenses we are going to buy are as you suggested, but with an add-on, so it look like this:

Nikon 28-70mm f/2.8 AF-S ZOOM-NIKKOR (2007)

Tokina 11-16mm f/2.8 AT-X

Nikon G to Micro Four Thirds Speed Booster (To use it with the aperture ring on the Tokina lens)

A set of Follow Focus gears for both lenses

A 77mm wide angle filter that gives extra x0.45 to make the crop factor as small as 1.25

LOMO 35 nap2 3m 56/2 f:80-110 Anamorphic lens front adapter (It's back diameter is 76m and Nikon has 77mm front, with the 1.25 crop we will have a clear picture.

 

Still thinking about the Nikon 80-200mm f/2.8 AF-D NIKKOR ED (2007)

 

1.) And have a question about the Anamorphic adapter - what do you guys think about this type of the set up if the LOMO gives x2.0 times anamorphic and we will shoot it in 4k, afterwords downscale it to have the x1.5 standard that will end up being around 2.5k footage.

 

2.) Now with this set up we are covered with 11-16 cropped to 12-18 and 35-88, do we need to get a lens to cover the 28mm and what will be the suggestions for that? Or go wider after 88 instead?

 

3.) Will the described set up of the LOMO anamorphic adapter work?

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Personally I'd get the Sigma 18-35 f/1.8 instead of the Tokina 11-16 f/2.8 unless you absolutely need an ultra wide-angle lens. I own the Tokina 11-16 and for most shooting scenarios, 11mm on an APS-C body (1,6x crop factor) is too wide in my opinion. I like to use the lens without a Speedbooster on my GH3, so that's a 22mm full frame equivalent. Using the Sigma 18-35 with a Speedbooster and the wide angle converter, the result will be a 22mm full frame equivalent, too. Plus the Sigma is a lot faster, extremely sharp and very usable even when shot wide open. The Tokina isn't exactly sharp unless you step it down quite a bit. 

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Hello again,

Andy Lee, thank you for sharing your knowledge with me, the breakdown of the lenses used by feature film DP's and Directors is a great help to me and our decision!

 

Tomorrow we have a studio production meeting and we are going to discuss the camera package for the feature film,

 

The body still remains MFT Lumix GH4

The lenses we are going to buy are as you suggested, but with an add-on, so it look like this:

Nikon 28-70mm f/2.8 AF-S ZOOM-NIKKOR (2007)

Tokina 11-16mm f/2.8 AT-X

Nikon G to Micro Four Thirds Speed Booster (To use it with the aperture ring on the Tokina lens)

A set of Follow Focus gears for both lenses

A 77mm wide angle filter that gives extra x0.45 to make the crop factor as small as 1.25

LOMO 35 nap2 3m 56/2 f:80-110 Anamorphic lens front adapter (It's back diameter is 76m and Nikon has 77mm front, with the 1.25 crop we will have a clear picture.

 

Still thinking about the Nikon 80-200mm f/2.8 AF-D NIKKOR ED (2007)

 

1.) And have a question about the Anamorphic adapter - what do you guys think about this type of the set up if the LOMO gives x2.0 times anamorphic and we will shoot it in 4k, afterwords downscale it to have the x1.5 standard that will end up being around 2.5k footage.

 

2.) Now with this set up we are covered with 11-16 cropped to 12-18 and 35-88, do we need to get a lens to cover the 28mm and what will be the suggestions for that? Or go wider after 88 instead?

 

3.) Will the described set up of the LOMO anamorphic adapter work?

 

 

thats Lomo is a brick - its massive very hard to rig up as its barrel is so wide and it weighs a ton , hang that off the front of a Nikon 28-70 and you will rip the front of the Nikon lens clean off

The Nikon front is delicate as it extends 1 inch when zooming and you do not want to hang anything heavy off it , NDS are fine just not massive Lomos

 

I would advise you against even buying the Lomo to try shooting a feature film , it will take you x4 longer than normal just to use the Lomo as its duel focus and huge . - avoid

 

Shoot spherical and frame for 2.39 and add black bars in post - thats what they did on the last James Bond film Skyfall and the Bourne films too and so many Arri Alexa shot films these days , its accepted industry practice these days -

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thats Lomo is a brick - its massive very hard to rig up as its barrel is so wide and it weighs a ton , hang that off the front of a Nikon 28-70 and you will rip the front of the Nikon lens clean off

The Nikon front is delicate as it extends 1 inch when zooming and you do not want to hang anything heavy off it , NDS are fine just not massive Lomos

 

I would advise you against even buying the Lomo to try shooting a feature film , it will take you x4 longer than normal just to use the Lomo as its duel focus and huge . - avoid

I second that, you can't mount it without a rig. And close focus on that lomo attachment is about 7 meters! I think it's unusable without rehousing.

Here is the picture of it with canon 600d

RqPIJxPAiy0.jpg

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Hello my friends,

 

Thank you so much for the participation in the discussion that I started a couple of weeks ago.

 

Andy Lee - thank you for making me think a bit different "Out of the box" in terms of the focal length of the lenses for my feature.

 

I have just wrapped a film in a ghost town Randsburg, CA. It was fun to be in a middle of nowhere for a week and I had time to think about cameras and decided on skipping the GH4 and moving straight to ordering a Black Magic Production Camera 4k in PL mount.

 

Both nikon lenses that you recommended me - the 28-70 and 80-200 Nikon with Tokina 11-16 are available modified in to PL mount - and that is an option to go.

 

My new research gave me an idea of buying Pentacon Six Medium Format lenses and adapting them via PL mount to the camera.

 

The only problem that I'm worried about is that the pentagon six lenses will not focus to infinity (But adaptor seller guaranties that it will) and because BMPC sensor diameter is 24.23 and medium format lens is 79 - I will end up with x3.2 crop factor. (We discussed the screw on adapter that will gives me a wider view by x0.7, but still it will be 2.5 crop)

 

My second option is buying a LOMO Oct-19 zoom lens and converting it to PL, because the lens was made for a 35mm camera the crop factor is only 1.13

 

What do you guys think about this new Idea for my first feature film?

 

Thank you so much by helping make the right choice!

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On 10/13/2014 at 2:54 PM, lafilm said:

Gleb, use your money and buy a cam that has filmic properties. GH4 screams video and your movie will suffer in the long run. Just my 2 cents.

 

Good luck.

Old thread, but burning question if someone can answer, what he meant?

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I'll give it a go... some people believe the image coming out of the GH4 has a video quality to it, whereas a camera from BlackMagic or other brand of "cinema" camera is more tuned to create a cinematic image. So if you believe this theory, and you're making narratives, a "proper" cinema camera could be a better choice.

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3 hours ago, mercer said:

I'll give it a go... some people believe the image coming out of the GH4 has a video quality to it, whereas a camera from BlackMagic or other brand of "cinema" camera is more tuned to create a cinematic image. So if you believe this theory, and you're making narratives, a "proper" cinema camera could be a better choice.

My thoughts.

Camera-wise: 

Used BMMCC (Micro) + Rawlite or Mosaic IR cut and Aliasing/Moire reduction replacement OLPF. Uncompressed raw or 3:1 compressed or Prores if not comfortable with raw. 60fps is good for a touch of slow when you need it. If you don't though, a used BMPCC (Pocket) can be had for quite cheap now. Sure only 1080p but 4k for lower budget features is just not necessary IMO. Without knowing much about your technical details for your film, I will guess that the DR and colour of the BM vs GH4 4K will likely make the image look better.

 

Lens-wise:

1. I personally love s16 sized glass, and have found that really excellent cinema quality glass can be found at a good price vs. s35 and beyond. Old Cooke and Canon zooms, Zeiss superspeed primes or Cooke primes are absolutely wonderful.

2. Buuuuuuuuut, you could also go the route of the bmpcc .58x focal reducer and get your crop to almost s35 factor and pound that light in. Throw on some cheap vintage Nikkor primes, the lovely Tokina 11-16mm wide zoom, those Nikkor f2.8 zoom beasts or Sigma 18-35 etc... that others rave about. This path probably makes more sense for moving onwards towards RED and so on without center cropping.

 

Upgrade Path:

Did you mean BM 2.5k Cinema or the 4K production? I think I would skip this pit-stop and just get better with the BMMCC until the RED is feasible. Playing with raw on the BM will set you up for fun with R3D too. Really getting to know the camera, where it shines, where it breaks and all of that is probably the way to make better films and really grow. Thinking upgrade and then upgrade to the upgrade for the 1st of 3 cams that you dont have yet might be a little bit much. I guess mainly what I am saying camera-wise is that I think you can condense the GH4 + BMCC/BMPC  stages into a BMMCC or BMPCC to start before looking at things like RED or Kinefinity etc... Which btw could just be rented on a per gig basis as well. I'm a big fan of trying before buying, especially when the tech cycle moves so fast.

Hope that helps.

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10 hours ago, Kurtisso said:

My thoughts.

Camera-wise: 

Used BMMCC (Micro) + Rawlite or Mosaic IR cut and Aliasing/Moire reduction replacement OLPF. Uncompressed raw or 3:1 compressed or Prores if not comfortable with raw. 60fps is good for a touch of slow when you need it. If you don't though, a used BMPCC (Pocket) can be had for quite cheap now. Sure only 1080p but 4k for lower budget features is just not necessary IMO. Without knowing much about your technical details for your film, I will guess that the DR and colour of the BM vs GH4 4K will likely make the image look better.

 

Lens-wise:

1. I personally love s16 sized glass, and have found that really excellent cinema quality glass can be found at a good price vs. s35 and beyond. Old Cooke and Canon zooms, Zeiss superspeed primes or Cooke primes are absolutely wonderful.

2. Buuuuuuuuut, you could also go the route of the bmpcc .58x focal reducer and get your crop to almost s35 factor and pound that light in. Throw on some cheap vintage Nikkor primes, the lovely Tokina 11-16mm wide zoom, those Nikkor f2.8 zoom beasts or Sigma 18-35 etc... that others rave about. This path probably makes more sense for moving onwards towards RED and so on without center cropping.

 

Upgrade Path:

Did you mean BM 2.5k Cinema or the 4K production? I think I would skip this pit-stop and just get better with the BMMCC until the RED is feasible. Playing with raw on the BM will set you up for fun with R3D too. Really getting to know the camera, where it shines, where it breaks and all of that is probably the way to make better films and really grow. Thinking upgrade and then upgrade to the upgrade for the 1st of 3 cams that you dont have yet might be a little bit much. I guess mainly what I am saying camera-wise is that I think you can condense the GH4 + BMCC/BMPC  stages into a BMMCC or BMPCC to start before looking at things like RED or Kinefinity etc... Which btw could just be rented on a per gig basis as well. I'm a big fan of trying before buying, especially when the tech cycle moves so fast.

Hope that helps.

Great advice. I had the BMMCC for a few months last summer and the images it produces is just astonishing for a Rubik's Cube sized camera. I'm a little more run and gun, one man band oriented and the added screen was a bit too much for me.

Am waiting to see what BM releases  at NAB, but I would not be surprised if I end up purchasing another BlackMagic camera by year's end.

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When shooting a movie you will set up a location /room with lights and actors and what not. Normally your set will get better the longer you do that, or an art director joins your crew;) When starting you will probably use the same location/ rooms again and again and stage them according to your script. I think then you need a lens to fit your set up, not the other way around. Later you may prefer one focal length and fstop over another, you can then redesign your stage or find new locations. Also, better don't spend a lot of time staging a nice background, only to destroy everything with a shallow dof of a constant fast aperture lens (looking at you rogue one😉) .

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