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Samsung "The Frame"


sam
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Just hung this up in the living room.   A 4k Hdr tv that looks like a picture/art frame on the wall. It displays an image  as long as motion is detected and adjusts its brighness to the ambient light.   Extremely believable and love this feature.   The reason I mention it here is the 4k hdr.   Horrible.   I come from a panny plasma and a 65" 4k hdr lg oled.  I assumed a 4k hdr panel from samsung would look somewhat respectable.  Nope.   Turned off all the typical motion, sharpening,  contrast,  etc...  Still horrible. Oversharpened with terrible motion. If this is the type of image folks are used to viewing,  no wonder no can ever agree on what cameras look good. Drastic difference in the look of shows I know and you tube camera tests.  Shocking a $1400 panel can look this bad in comparison.  

20180309_153351.jpg

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At least you have a piece of art you can enjoy for your 1400!

It’s interesting isn’t it - we discuss image quality from capture devices and how “we” can manipulate it to “our” preferences. It sort of forgets that once it’s in the living room of the consumer who knows what travesties are being applied.

 

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18 minutes ago, Snowfun said:

It’s interesting isn’t it - we discuss image quality from capture devices and how “we” can manipulate it to “our” preferences. It sort of forgets that once it’s in the living room of the consumer who knows what travesties are being applied.

That insight shouldn't shock us too much. This whole image quality theme is much less about purism than it is about subjective preferences. A world of travesty (> film look recipes). But yet, confronted with a particular drag queen, you'd still have a general idea what Marilyn Monroe should look like. 

@sam

Very nice room. Don't like the glass-protected fireplace. Contradicts the purpose and dignity of a traditional one. You could put the Samsung there and loop an HDR fireplace ...

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7 hours ago, jonpais said:

 

@sam Could you tell us more?

It is supposed to have 630 nits. Covers roughly two thirds of rec. 2020. Doesnt support dolby vision although I dont believe any samsung at any price does. It is edge lit so I wasnt expecting much in terms of hdr.   Very middle of the pack in terms of specs for a current panel.  However, I only purchased it for art mode and watching the news/weather.

 

Im not complaining about the panel, just shocked,  that excluding production value,  I dont think i would be able to tell if something was shot on a gopro or 65mm film with it.  All the typical attributes of the moving images I am used to observing are thrown into a processed mess of a jittery digital cocktail.   Which made me think,  what panels do those who review cameras for $ or ❤ use to make their assesment regarding image quality?  Its one thing to debate in online forums from your moms basement in the middle of suburbia, when your only reference is a couple hundred dollar (or$1400) panel from bestbuy. But are the experts,  so called professionals,  or those doling out advice for monetary gain any better?

 

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There is a similar LG OLED that you can hang, and it costs 6500euros here, so maybe the Samsung is a bargain!

There are a lot of specialized TV reviewers, this panel is obviously targeting people that care more about the form, than the function, design can be expensive, for non other reason, than to look different, and have something most of your friends can't. So having a 1400$ frame on your wall, is maybe priceless!

There are worthy TV sets from Samsung (around that price), but the 2017 LG OLED's have the usual price deduction this time of year (around 1600$? I am not sure about N.American pricing), and there aren't many differences to the 2018 models, so anyone want to grab a bargain, should go for one. The introductory 2018 model especially seems like a downgrade these year (while last year all models had the same panel, and I think processor as well).

 Sony and Panasonic offer (LG made) OLED panels as well, and they all sell very good. For cheaper TVs, I would say Samsung, for more expensive ones, the LGs are the best value for money right now.

 

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Kisaha while I value your response, based on your reply,  im not sure how the intent of my post was interpreted.

How about this.   If I were using "the frame" as a reference panel and and you asked my advice "Sam would you recommend the gh5 or a sony s7iii? would you trust the advice about the IMAGE I might give you? (With my best intentions) 

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Of, course I did, but I didn't find the whole concept relevant with reality. Monitors for our job and that size, cost tenths of thousands of dollars. Even the small Sony ones that we mostly use in various editing rooms (NOT 4K, and definitely NOT HDR) are more than 5000 euros, and we can not hang them on the wall either!

This is more a luxury and design item, certainly not a reference monitor, but not even a good TV panel (I referenced some above) of today's standards, but the better ones, and probably the worthy ones, - especially for us that really care about image - are even more expensive to be honest (probably the cheap LG OLEDs are the best bet right now, and relatively future proof, as it seems the OLED technology has been slowing down a bit the last few years)!

There are a lot better, and cheaper, smaller PC monitors that can do basic jobs right now, especially if color calibrated, and an LG for HDR. I wouldn't expect from a consumer product anything better. @jonpais can show you the way!

 

 

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10 hours ago, Axel said:

This whole image quality theme is much less about purism than it is about subjective preferences.

You could apply that to my fireplace! 

Its my job to review the performance of live orchestras and  I depend completely upon a hearing aid. I have my entire life.  The sounds I hear are this devices own rendition and interpretation of the original source.  The aid I use can only pass through 6 different frequencies and plays some extra loud and  even changes some frequencies altogether (although I have no way of knowing this) I just traveled to a small town in Alaska last week. It was so cold the musicians had to wear gloves! To me the orchestra sounded amazing! I write up a glowing review.  This small community orchestra with only 5 members and all under the age of 10 are easily on par with the last orchestra I reviewed, the new york philharmonic! 

Did I mention I got into making reviews just 2 years ago,  when I left my country western band because of difference of opinion.  They liked acoustic and I like electric. To be honest I cant tell which is which,  but my guitar just has this mojo I cant really explain.   But im thinking ill trade it in for one of those new tiny violins anyway, you know the ones so small you play with just your thumb and finger. I think they are called the worlds smallest violin.  I hear if you play a song on them, its just like hearing an entire orchestra.   But keep in mind alot of other orchestra reviwers are claiming you need 10 strings at least.  Watch out for the 8 string ones.   In fact I think ill write my next review on this.  But first I have to go visit JCS. I thought this stuff was supposed to wear off by now. 

 

 

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On 3/9/2018 at 2:17 PM, sam said:

Turned off all the typical motion, sharpening,  contrast,  etc...  Still horrible. Oversharpened with terrible motion. If this is the type of image folks are used to viewing,  no wonder no can ever agree on what cameras look good. Drastic difference in the look of shows I know and you tube camera tests.  Shocking a $1400 panel can look this bad in comparison.  

I read an article about a year ago that Samsung has done extensive user testing/research on the "Samsung look", and they found that "most" consumers prefer the image "sharp" and really punchy.

To the untrained eye I could see why ppl would latch on to these qualities, they give off the impression of "high tech". THIS is why Samsung crams these characteristics into their display technology. Some like it, others don't. 

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When watching films,  I can usually tell at the very least if something was shot on film or digital.  If digital,  more often than not I can guess the brand of the primary camera . Sometimes the glass as well, but not as easily.    As hyperbolic as my posts have been,  I honestly cannot tell what is what on this panel.  

Image making is what this entire forum revolves around.  From film purists to smartphone ground breakers.  So why is there so little discussion about arguably the most important part in the image making chain.  Without a way to watch,  digital cameras are pointless afterall. 

 

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 How about those who have a so called "reference monitor"  and "calibrated it" or maybe a beautiful apple screen? 

Do you think its technically any better than the supposedly 10 bit wide gamut  panel I just criticized?  

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On 3/9/2018 at 4:17 PM, sam said:

Just hung this up in the living room.   A 4k Hdr tv that looks like a picture/art frame on the wall. It displays an image  as long as motion is detected and adjusts its brighness to the ambient light.

I think that is a bit ecologically irresponsible.  The proliferation of always on or stand by electronic devices in the home is getting ridiculous.  Each one might not be a huge draw but across millions of homes?

We've had perfectly good nonelectronic ways of looking at art for thousands of years.  Reminds me of this...

article-2206940-15227FFD000005DC-442_468

Just some statistics from wikipedia...

Quote

In Britain in 2004 standby modes on electronic devices accounted for 8% of all British residential power consumption.[5] A similar study in France in 2000 found that standby power accounted for 7% of total residential consumption.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Standby_power

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