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gethin

D850 released. Nothing to see here, move along

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From DPreview:

"Video capabilities

In terms of video the D850 becomes the first Nikon DSLR to capture 4K video from the full width of its sensor. The camera can shoot at 30, 25 or 24p, at a bitrate of around 144 Mbps. Our initial impression is that the video is pixel-binned, rather than being resolved then downsampled (oversampling), but we'll be checking on this as part of the review process. This risks lowering the level of detail capture and increases the risk of moiré, though it's a better solution than line-skipping. There also seemed to be significant rolling shutter, but again these are only first impressions from a camera running non-final firmware.

At 1080 resolution, the camera can shoot at up to 60p, with a slow-mo mode that can capture at 120 frames per second before outputting at either 25 or 24p. The 1080 mode also offers focus peaking and digital stabilization, neither of which are available for 4K shooting"

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focus peaking in 1080 only. Just where you need it most, eh? 

$5400 stinking australian dollars (http://www.vanbar.com.au/catalogue/product.php?id=117355).  Really all Sony need to do is get within half a stop of their dynamic range in stills and I'm gorn...

I saw a second or so of 4k vid, in this and the 1080 slomo

https://nikonrumors.com/2017/08/24/nikon-d850-product-tour-and-promo-videos.aspx/

Heres a few nuggets:

The electronic shutter operates at up to 6 fps (AF/AE locked) at full resolution, while an additional mode enables 8.6-megapixel capture in DX image area mode at up to 30 fps.

No word yet whether this is the 12bit raw (I doubt it). 

It does not look like there is a DX video option at all. (which is barmy seeing as it can record 30fps, but we'll see). 

Yes dx crop mode (about 8 mins in). (but still no peaking.  Stupid stupid stupid)

 

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EOSHD Pro Color for Sony cameras EOSHD Pro LOG for Sony CamerasEOSHD C-LOG and Film Profiles for All Canon DSLRs

It's a great stills camera though, if I were looking at a FX camera, this would be it. Not a Sony, but this.

59 minutes ago, gethin said:

No word yet whether this is the 12bit raw (I doubt it). 

12 bit raw in video? Nope. 12 bit raw in stills? Definitely. In fact there should be a 14 bit option.

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24 minutes ago, leeys said:

It's a great stills camera though, if I were looking at a FX camera, this would be it. Not a Sony, but this.

12 bit raw in video? Nope. 12 bit raw in stills? Definitely. In fact there should be a 14 bit option.

stills; electronic shutter 6fps full frame, 14 bit.  All sRAW are at 12bit.  No word whether then 30fps is sRAW or jpeg.  If its sRAW then the burst length is the next question.  If I can shoot for 10 seconds then I can get 4K 12-bit raw video at 30fps.  This would be interesting. 

Some bits of video in here. High iso looks OK (from what you can see from youtube). 

personally I am increasingly primarily a video shooter who also shoots stills, when I got the D800 it was the other way round. As Leeys said a good still camera, but thats not why we're 'ere, eh?

Good info here (see #8):http://www.imaging-resource.com/PRODS/nikon-d850/nikon-d850A.HTM

Looks like buffer allows 200 frames in sRAW, however this was not talking about the burst function. Could be less than that. So 5-8 seconds of raw vid a possibility.

Sensor designed by nikon. 

 

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19 minutes ago, gethin said:

If I can shoot for 10 seconds then I can get 4K 12-bit raw video at 30fps.  This would be interesting. 

If you need RAW for video, buy a dedicated video/film camera shooting RAW. There are many options out there starting as low as 1.000 USD or even less (used). The D850 is a DEDICATED PHOTO CAMERA with some nice video features. But - at the end of the day - it is and remains a capable photo camera. A Ferrari can hardly cross a river through 1,50 deep water. Therefore you have to buy an Ural...Bashing the Ferrari won't get it into the water and bashing the Ural won't get it to win races....:grin:

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Don't be a silly sausage. No one here would buy this camera for it's raw capabilities. (But if you had it, and could shoot raw bursts then that would be a great thing to experiment with.  As it is it's probably useless, But at 10 seconds a can think of scenarios that I face with every shoot where having say 13 stops of dynamic range, and very little sacrifice for boosting the beejesus out of the shadows would be useful.)  

 

 

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1 hour ago, gethin said:

In terms of video the D850 becomes the first Nikon DSLR to capture 4K video from the full width of its sensor.

Good! Means all future Nikons won't have crop for 4K

Good news about finally having focus peaking too! (pity only in 1080.... firmware update??? Please!!)

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13 minutes ago, gethin said:

But if you had it, and could shoot raw bursts then that would be a great thing to experiment with.

Nope. If I need RAW for video, I buy a dedicated RAW-Video-Camera. "Experimenting" for backyard video shooting is useless, when you can get immediately what you need (RAW video) for an affordable price. The sub 2.000 USD FF hybrid photo/video camera with 14 stops of DR (video AND photo), 40+ MP, 10+ burst, 50+ buffer, RAW and 422 10bit option, no need for external audio, no noise up to ISO 100.000 - THIS is silly sausage...But endlessly discussing on this and bashing all cameras not corresponding to these requirements is much more comfortable and easier than getting out and shooting...

@IronFilm

Quote

Means all future Nikons won't have crop for 4K

This.

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4 minutes ago, Arikhan said:

 

@IronFilm

This.

 

Fingers crossed the D5600 successor doesn't have crop for 4K (and has focus peaking in 4K!). As I'm certainly not buying a D850! But a D5x00 series camera is one I can easily afford if I wish.

I guess a slim possibility that the D5600 successor might be so low end they'll keep the crop for 4K with that. 

But I feel 100% confident that all new cameras that are higher end than D5x00 series will no longer have a crop for 4K. :-) 

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Why are you heading from sausageville to jerksville?  Can't I discuss what I like?  On a forum setup for video shooters using DSLRs?  I shoot a couple of times a week with these things. This stuff is damn relevant. Any time I can save using the same sodding camera to shoot decent stills and video improves my profits.  Expecting a camera to not have some compromises is ridiculous I agree. But please refrain from pointless bashing of people who have reasonable expectations and a specific requirement: especially when 422 10 bit for instance already exists in a ~$2000 camera. 

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Seems to be an awesome camera. Really pushing the envelope. But we will have to wait and see, since specs doesn't mean jack.

Native base of iso 64 is a big deal. As a film shooter I've always hated that most cameras bottoms out at 200 without using expanded. 

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1 hour ago, gethin said:

stills; electronic shutter 6fps full frame, 14 bit.  All sRAW are at 12bit.  No word whether then 30fps is sRAW or jpeg.  If its sRAW then the burst length is the next question.  If I can shoot for 10 seconds then I can get 4K 12-bit raw video at 30fps.  This would be interesting. 

Some bits of video in here. High iso looks OK (from what you can see from youtube). 

personally I am increasingly primarily a video shooter who also shoots stills, when I got the D800 it was the other way round. As Leeys said a good still camera, but thats not why we're 'ere, eh?

Good info here (see #8):http://www.imaging-resource.com/PRODS/nikon-d850/nikon-d850A.HTM

Looks like buffer allows 200 frames in sRAW, however this was not talking about the burst function. Could be less than that. So 5-8 seconds of raw vid a possibility.

Sensor designed by nikon. 

 

Ah right, you were talking about the 30 FPS output in live view. I have a suspicion that will be JPEG, since sRAW goes down all the way to 11mp, not 8.6mp.

Funnily, I'm still primarily a stills shooter, but I've migrated to Panasonic's GH cameras; the stills are good enough and when I do video I get great video, no matter how little I do of it.

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4 minutes ago, leeys said:

Ah right, you were talking about the 30 FPS output in live view. I have a suspicion that will be JPEG, since sRAW goes down all the way to 11mp, not 8.6mp.

Ah yes, I think your'e right. 

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1 hour ago, IronFilm said:

 

Fingers crossed the D5600 successor doesn't have crop for 4K (and has focus peaking in 4K!). As I'm certainly not buying a D850! But a D5x00 series camera is one I can easily afford if I wish.
 

I hope so too!

I got a D800 - and it's easily enough for all of my photography needs. A smaller DX body with 4k and 1080p at 120 fps and affordable price - yes please!

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3 hours ago, gethin said:

Our initial impression is that the video is pixel-binned, rather than being resolved then downsampled (oversampling), but we'll be checking on this as part of the review process. This risks lowering the level of detail capture and increases the risk of moiré, though it's a better solution than line-skipping. There also seemed to be significant rolling shutter, but again these are only first impressions from a camera running non-final firmware.

damn that kind of sucks.. maybe you'll have to switch to DX mode to get sharpest 4K (like on A7R2)? 

but biggest con to me is there seems to be no video AF improvement..

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I don't know what they will do with D5600 replacement but they won't release entry level DSLR anytime soon. The next big thing is mirrorless in first half of 2018.

By the way, it should be embarrassing for Canon that the first DSLR with focus peaking is from Nikon known for its irrelevancy in video market. 

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46 minutes ago, mercer said:

I believe Pentax was the first DSLR to have focus peaking. But I get your point. 

Pentax even beat Panasonic to the punch on that count; they introduced it to their line about five years ago.

In any case, it looks like UK pricing for the D850 is virtually identical to that of the 5Div. You'd think Canon would have to cut its pricing to remain competitive, but somehow I doubt they will. Weirdly enough, it looks like the 5DS and 5DSr are now the sweet spot in Canon's full-frame line-up, as they offer higher resolution than the D850 for a lower price (albeit being worse in terms of dynamic range and base ISO) and have pretty respectable video quality if you can live with only 1080p.

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26 minutes ago, David Bowgett said:

In any case, it looks like UK pricing for the D850 is virtually identical to that of the 5Div. 

well that explains the Aus price too. As the 5div is about $5100 over here (D850 $5300).  But Nikon has traditionally priced its cameras very close to the US equivalent and sometimes better.   So we have the weird situation where the D850 is 60% more expensive than the D810.  What they may not have taken into account is this now makes the A7rmk2 more attractive @$3700.  It makes this scint photographer determined to wait for the next crop of sony cameras, and maybe the nikon mirrorless offering.  The D800 still produces amazing stills, and I dont need most of the D850's bells and whistles (very nice so some of them are).  

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