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jasonmillard81

1080 vs. 4K: What is REALLY necessary?

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On ‎7‎/‎8‎/‎2017 at 11:49 AM, Trek of Joy said:

Best Buy sells in the US only, I'd suggest looking at things globally.

As far as sales numbers, 2017 will not be dramatically different from 2016, things shift slowly, all projections are flat. Smart TV's are dominating, most being sold - about 2/3rds - are still 1080p. Last year only 40 million of more than 200 million tc's sold were UHD. Don't know why some of you guys can't seem to understand actual numbers instead of making assumptions based on your opinions.

This discussion is going in circles, I'm exiting it.

Cheers

That is weird. I was not aware that Canada had joined the US then, since we have Best Buy stores here. Guess they just forgot to change the flag.

I don't give a rats ass what sells in Burkina Faso (or whatever other third world shithole). What sells in the developed world is what I care about, and what the companies selling these products care about. 1080p sets sell like hotcakes in Burkina Faso no doubt, because that is all they can afford. Profit margins for manufacturers are minimal in places like that however - their profit comes from developed world markets.

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EOSHD Pro Color for Sony cameras EOSHD Pro LOG for Sony CamerasEOSHD C-LOG and Film Profiles for All Canon DSLRs

A "Clear Look at the Issue of Resolution" comparison by Steve Yedlin, ASC. He offers an intriguing demonstration on how capture formats, pixel counts and postproduction techniques affect image quality and why simply counting Ks is not a solution when selecting a camera." End quote.

https://ascmag.com/articles/a-clear-look-at-the-issue-of-resolution

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@cantsin Cantsin already started a topic with this. It's aimed primarily at shooting for theatrical release, as well as home theater. Things Yedlin does not discuss are consumer cameras like the a6500s, X-T2s and GH5s, where shooting in 1080p might not be such a great idea, since there might be unsightly aliasing and moire, or the image won't be as clean and crisp as one shot in 4K. Nor does he discuss issues with horrible compression on video hosting sites, which makes shooting and delivering 4K preferable for those of us who will never walk the aisles at Cannes. 

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On 17/07/2017 at 6:03 AM, tugela said:

I don't give a rats ass what sells in Burkina Faso (or whatever other third world shithole)...

Since we have forum members from a broad range of countries, I might suggest you use the preferred nomenclature of 'developing world'. Otherwise you run the risk of looking more like the myopic troglotyte that you most probably are.

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6 hours ago, User said:

Since we have forum members from a broad range of countries, I might suggest you use the preferred nomenclature of 'developing world'. Otherwise you run the risk of looking more like the myopic troglotyte that you most probably are.

I guess to make it even less “offensive” instead of using the ‘developing world’ nomenclature, they moved on from that last year. It was then decided that it would be more appropriate to now use the phrase ‘emerging (market) economies’ instead for such locations, so there is less confusion about what is being described or discussed going forward. I know it’s a lot to keep up with all these changes, along with all the other things going on in the world at this time, but it is what it is.

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22 hours ago, User said:

Since we have forum members from a broad range of countries, I might suggest you use the preferred nomenclature of 'developing world'. Otherwise you run the risk of looking more like the myopic troglotyte that you most probably are.

 I prefer to use the term "shithole", having grown up in such a place. That is the trouble with you first world types, you have no idea what the rest of the world is really like.

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3 hours ago, tugela said:

 I prefer to use the term "shithole", having grown up in such a place. That is the trouble with you first world types, you have no idea what the rest of the world is really like.

I've passed 10 years in South Asia with adventures in 40 countries.

Nice try.

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I for one don't really care for 4k outside of the relatively clean image it brings you when downscaling to 1080. I think companies like youtube should work on providing better 1080p + compression at higher bitrates vs. pushing for 4K streaming and neglecting everything else. I can see 4k being important for someone who shoots for a theatrical release but for someone like me who shoots for the web and hopefully for a content distribution network like netflix (one day fingers crossed lol) a good 1080 deliverable is what I need

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49 minutes ago, kidzrevil said:

I for one don't really care for 4k outside of the relatively clean image it brings you when downscaling to 1080. I think companies like youtube should work on providing better 1080p + compression at higher bitrates vs. pushing for 4K streaming and neglecting everything else. I can see 4k being important for someone who shoots for a theatrical release but for someone like me who shoots for the web and hopefully for a content distribution network like netflix (one day fingers crossed lol) a good 1080 deliverable is what I need

It's funny, I spent a good portion of yesterday watching old hacked GH1/GH2 videos and it's amazing how close these manufacturers were to perfect FHD and then just abandoned it for 4K... some of which is still kind of thin and brittle. I agree the downscaling does help to create better 1080p, but I often wonder if that wouldn't be better done in camera like the C100. I'm no tech guru, so I'll leave the intricacies up to others, but I am curious why video from a GH1 looks better, to me, than the video from a modern 4K camera?

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2 hours ago, mercer said:

It's funny, I spent a good portion of yesterday watching old hacked GH1/GH2 videos and it's amazing how close these manufacturers were to perfect FHD and then just abandoned it for 4K... some of which is still kind of thin and brittle. I agree the downscaling does help to create better 1080p, but I often wonder if that wouldn't be better done in camera like the C100. I'm no tech guru, so I'll leave the intricacies up to others, but I am curious why video from a GH1 looks better, to me, than the video from a modern 4K camera?

Dude I was looking up videos from the bolex anamorphic & ran into a guy using it with a hacked (flowmotion) gh2. I felt incredibly stupid about wanting to "upgrade" my camera body. 1080p from a hacked gh2 STILL looks on par with some of these "4k" cameras which is crazy to me. Color depth, dynamic range and the rendering of the lens is more important to me than 4K. Someone mentioned it earlier 4K is just new tech for manufacturers to capitalize off of. They no longer are racing to get the cleanest supersampled 1080, they are more interested in low bit rate 4k just to turn a profit

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5 minutes ago, kidzrevil said:

Dude I was looking up videos from the bolex anamorphic & ran into a guy using it with a hacked (flowmotion) gh2. I felt incredibly stupid about wanting to "upgrade" my camera body. 1080p from a hacked gh2 STILL looks on par with some of these "4k" cameras which is crazy to me. Color depth, dynamic range and the rendering of the lens is more important to me than 4K. Someone mentioned it earlier 4K is just new tech for manufacturers to capitalize off of. They no longer are racing to get the cleanest supersampled 1080, they are more interested in low bit rate 4k just to turn a profit

I think I may have watched the same video. If you want to see some cool, surreal video from the GH1... I'm not even sure it's hacked check out this video... and others from him. 

And then there's Martin Wallgren's videos... he's great too but I love his old GH2 stuff...

 

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2 hours ago, mercer said:

It's funny, I spent a good portion of yesterday watching old hacked GH1/GH2 videos and it's amazing how close these manufacturers were to perfect FHD and then just abandoned it for 4K... some of which is still kind of thin and brittle. I agree the downscaling does help to create better 1080p, but I often wonder if that wouldn't be better done in camera like the C100. I'm no tech guru, so I'll leave the intricacies up to others, but I am curious why video from a GH1 looks better, to me, than the video from a modern 4K camera?

I think Panasonic just had a nice sensor with the GH1 and especially GH2. Great 1080p cameras. Even the 720p was more detailed than the canon 1080p offerings at the time. 

They also had noticably less crop compared to a GH4 in 4K. Enough to make a difference with DOF. Lots of factors, really. 

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