Chrad

I always like to think of David Lynch shooting Inland Empire on the Sony PD-150 with the autofocus on. He started shooting the movie not knowing it would be anything more than just a scene, using the cheap little DV camera, but then finding it creatively liberating. I wouldn't buy a Red or Alexa, even if I could afford it, for this reason. Digitial started out as this new, creatively liberating medium where you could just pick up a small camera and start making a movie without the need of a big crew, using a heavily rigged cine camera or camcorder just kind of defeats the advantages of the medium (for me anyway). My favorite shoots are the ones where it's just me and one or two actors. 

Shot on the GH5 in 3 days. A concept trailer done having a zero budget for our upcoming first feature film.
I really like what I can squeeze out of the internal 10 bit V-Log footage. DR, lowlight and colors are really good.
Everything was shot with sharpening and nr set to -5 and a Tiffen Black Pro Mist filter applied in front of the lens (12-35mm 2.8 V1, 20mm 1.7, 42.5mm 1.7) to make it smoother. Colorgrading done in Davinci Resolve. Drone shots by the DJI Mavic (the internal sharpening is hideous tbh...).
 

You're going to spend more money on CFast 2.0 cards than the actual camera.

100% Fact you have no idea what you are talking about.......
 
C200 looks like video (especially when that is it;s intended market), GH5 I would say in-between and more cinematic now using anamorphic mode with lenses. Panasonic Varicam LT resembles film and if this new camera will provide the same image it will be amazing and one of the best cameras at this price range in the market. I easily put Varicam footage right next to Amira and in many situations much better when shooting at higher iso's

Boy do people like to complain. A camera is announced two days ago with a feature and you expect every other camera to have it? We're also talking different recording media than the C200 and Blackmagic. Different ecosystems can support different things. It seems like they're trying to push as much into this ecosystem as possible, while keeping the "real" costs of a full kit as manageable as possible. And everyone's losing it over the internal raw of C200, yet the reality is that 98% of the time that raw is used will be in a controlled environment where external monitors are the norm and an external recorder isn't a big deal. And if you start factoring in the difference in SSD costs vs cfast... well, cost-wise the playing field starts to even. The weirder thing would be building a small camera that's perfect for doc and indy uses, shoving raw internal into it, an old ass 8 bit codec, and nothing in between... and no way to get non-raw 10bit... even from the output...

Yeah, electronic that is. Probably not just some plain warp stabilizer, but perhaps actually a gyro and accelerometers to guide the processing a little better, but yeah, actual sensor stabilization that is not, expect some motion artifacts and such. Agreed with an earlier comment though, I didn't expect physical sensor stabilization either and do agree that it's not a must in these type of cameras.
Exciting camera though. I was indeed hoping for GH-users to get a natural upgrade path type of camera and indeed, this at sub-$5k with 'shittier' tech and MFT mount sounds amazeballs. Yeah, poor JVC. Basically giving you all that and getting no love... tough crowd we must be to them! But yeah, this does sound like an ARRI Alexa Mini for the less fortunate. Super dope! 43rumors mentioned some specs earlier and a pricetag of 6499. If that's true, then it's still super exciting... tho entering the segment where Canon, Sony and Blackmagic are already well established, might be tough to break into.

Sucks so bad the Panasonic EVA1 lacks a Locking Micro Four Thirds Mount (like a baby made from the union of the JVC LS300 & Sony FS7 mk2 mounts).
Panasonic has blown a massive opportunity to provide an upgrade path for their GH users as they progress through their career, & was an opportunity to grow Panasonic GH5 sales at the same time.
However credit can be given to Panasonic for blasting out of the water the C200 which Canon just announced, but that fact should surprise exactly no one.

Idk, if I were a GH5 owner I think I'd be pretty damn happy right now... by the end of August's FW update, for more than half the price, you're getting the same 400mbps 10bit with 5-axis IBIS. 

If they were to do that I think it would be in a DSLR/Hybrid format. This won't eat into their Pro Camcorder sales, but a $4000 version would. 
I predict that JVC will add internal Raw to the LS300 and it will look and work amazingly, and no one will care. 

LS300 with internal 2K RAW. Great idea. Instant buy!

It would have been nice if Panasonic had applied their 5 axis IBIS tech to the new, larger sensor but I think it's probably difficult to have a sensor bobbling around behind an ND filter wheel and remain cost effective. Also with the sensor moving around they could have well run out of image circle with EF-S and Super 35mm lenses, some are quite marginal at the edges of the sensor.
Not much point having one on the back like the FS5 does, when you can put a proper one on the top handle offset to the side so it's in the right position. It's really uncomfortable having it on the back and impossible even to use it when camera's on the shoulder.

Why no in between? I would disagree that CLog doesn't need 10 bit. That was my biggest complaint with the C100mkII is the weak codec.

Switching from Premiere CC/Resolve to FCPX is the best decision I ever made. Over the last year I must have saved at least six months in editing and render times
(Btw, today I downloaded a 30 day trial of Capture One Pro 10. Took me about 20 minutes to realize that it's time to dump Lightroom as well. So, "Buy buy Adobe. Loved you from CS5 to CC but you have lost the mojo.")
 

For what its worth.
 
Some cut and paste from a Larry Jordon Blog on NAB:
"While Apple released a minor bug-fix update two weeks before NAB, the more interesting news came from an announcement and two employment “leaks.” The announcement, occurring during NAB, was that Apple Final Cut Pro X now has more than 2 million users. This equals the number of Final Cut users during they heyday of Final Cut Pro 6/7. This is a significant number and not to be minimized.
But, to me, the really exciting news from Apple wasn’t an announcement, it was a “leak.” As NAB started it was discovered that the Final Cut team had added Wes Plate and Tim Dashwood to their ranks............
....................It is impossible to overstate the impact these two people could have on FCP X. Wes Plate ran Automatic Duck for years, specializing in moving projects between applications. A few years ago, he was hired by Adobe for the Premiere team, where he helped redesign how Premiere imports media; basically integrating most of the features of Prelude into Premiere. Now that he is working with Final Cut, my expectation is that the application will start to improve how it moves media and projects between applications. FCP X has always been weak on this score, relying on a host of third-party plugins.
Tim Dashwood also ran his own development company – Dashwood Cinema Solutions – for a long while. I first became aware of him with his utilities to allow Final Cut Pro X to sync and edit Stereoscopic 3D video. Since then, he’s been working with virtual reality and related media.
While Stereo 3D is still relevant, my guess is that Tim will be looking at how to improve Final Cut’s ability to handle 360-VR, ambisonic audio and extend that into AR (Augmented Reality). Especially since, when it comes to VR, Final Cut is running a distant third behind Adobe and Avid.   It is now a four horse race: Adobe, Apple, Avid and Blackmagic Design."
 
https://larryjordan.com/blog/thoughts-and-highlights-from-the-2017-nab-show/

Why not just be happy to keep the A7S rather than waste emotional energy "wanting" a sports-journalists still camera? The A7Siii might offer more of what you require for a video upgrade but until then you have a camera you "love" so it's a good place.

Yes, but I mentioned it when I asked, if you think M43 looks 'robotic' in the out of focus transitions, where does S16 come into it for you? A smaller sensor, so the transition between focused and unfocused areas should be more sudden than even M43, but no one would call it 'robotic' or say it isn't cinematic.
There's no reason for the 'robotic' thing you're talking about. M43 is nothing but dimensions for the size of a sensor. 
I challenge you to point to footage that exemplifies this look you're talking about.

This is a situation where you should actually trust the specs. There is literally no reason that M43 should look more 'robotic' than say, super 16mm, in terms of the look of transitions between in and out of focus. It's total nonsense. 
Maybe you're looking at images produced with lenses that don't have much of 'pop' in terms of subject separation. That would make sense and could be attributed to optical design. But there's a solution - pick a different lens. 

I didn't realize shooting in UHD is the wrong shooting mode.

I know where you're coming from. I started in this industry in the shipping and dubbing room which meant quality control from one format to another. All I looked at for years was vectorscopes and waveforms, and they are burned into my brain. Still, these days I shoot personal stuff with my iphone, old nikon, and a rx100 iv, and it's easy to use auto-iso and auto-focus everything that I know my images are worse for the wear, but I actually enjoy shooting more. Now when I do professional stuff I have to deal with a camera crew and sometimes they are younger and don't even use a light meter anymore which to me was just insane a few years ago. Now I see that it's much easier to dial in what you want from just looking at the monitor and using new tools like false color.
Still, I think we see the flood of crap online because a lot of people who are "pros" never learn the basics of image making because things are so easy these days. You really do like you say need a good foundation to be able to convey a mood or sentiment instead of the latest trend.  But I was also taught by older filmmakers that it was important to keep up with the times when I was dubbing tapes all day. This was in the mid 90s and these guys were in their late 50s to early 70s moving their workflow to Avids. It was interesting because I wasn't even an assistant editor but I was teaching them how to use macs, adobe and avid, setting up the computers. These guys were old award winning filmmakers, and it didn't matter to them if it was a flatbed, or tape to tape or a mac they were using as long as they could get the footage they needed and cut it. I remember sitting with them and showing them what the icons meant in Avid and that was it. They were editing tv shows, national spots and films in minutes. They didn't know the shortkeys like I did, but I still can't cut a story like they did back in the day. It showed me that when you master a craft the tools are just that and nothing more. But you need the tools to master that craft, but I think a lot of people are in a rush today because of the nature of how much content is needed and delivered these days, so the focus gets placed more on the means and the trends than on the craft. To me, the most interesting thing to film is a face telling me something, showing me something, an emotion, or hiding something, perhaps a secret. And what do we really need to do that? A decent camera and some lights? Is that it?

Im not hoping on any new camera's, there is a lot of good choice already atm.
But I hope somebody finally releases some decent budget single focus anamorphic lenses. At a sub 2K pricepoint per lens or something. 
 

Imho, the thing to do with these cameras to make them look more cinematic, is to shoot with "vintage" (1970's) fast prime lenses. 
You get a 24mm f/2 prime and go to work. Nothing more, nothing less. 
The cohesiveness of shooting just 1 focal length is often dismissed, but I feel it's very important. 
For one thing, it sets the "look".  Good, that's settled  ...now go concentrate on other more important stuff.  Like lighting, acting, blocking, costume design, etc. 
I swear to god, just accept the simplicity of using 1 lens and it will truly help make your footage look better than most...especially if your just starting out and trying to find your way. Keep it basic, clean, and beautiful.  
A gx85, a 24mm f2, and 24fps 4K.  That's all you need IQ-wise. Seriously. That's more than fine. Consider that done. Don't worry about the tech at this point. Go make something worthwhile and compelling with it. 

Ha!  Great thread.  
Over the course of this on line conversation I considered the GX85, mulled it over, bought one, tested it, enjoyed the results, bought another one, began to shoot 6 short documentaries with 'em, learned to resent my producer along the way, clashed creatively like I've never done before, shot a ton of misc corporate stuff, did some time-lapse that one time, finished the documentaries, sold the first one to a woman so she could take pictures of her newborn grand-daughter, sold the second one on ebay, and generally enjoyed using the camera during it all.
Didn't fall in love with the GX85, but liked it plenty.  Still seems like the best value for money on the market if you like smaller-sized cameras.  I'll continue to recommend it.

The nerve of Canon. Telling a lie, and ripping people off. The later is the worse of those to things.
Ebrahim is such a slut.

Since its Sony nothing is ever certain. But I would be hugely surprised if they released an A9s. I just don't see any point in doing that.