Panasonic S5 II (What does Panasonic have up their sleeve?)

[eatstoomuchjam]

I hope there are some pretty decent small/light lenses for L mount.  With that (lack of a) handgrip, that thing is an ergonomic nightmare for any sort of handheld shooting with a lens over 300g or so.  If that size comparison is accurate, adding a handgrip pretty much puts one in a "just buy an S5II which puts an EVF in the little bit of extra vertical height" category.

(If it's decent resolution, it could be a dream camera for M mount lenses)

[John Matthews]

6 hours ago, eatstoomuchjam said:

I hope there are some pretty decent small/light lenses for L mount.  With that (lack of a) handgrip, that thing is an ergonomic nightmare for any sort of handheld shooting with a lens over 300g or so.  If that size comparison is accurate, adding a handgrip pretty much puts one in a "just buy an S5II which puts an EVF in the little bit of extra vertical height" category.

(If it's decent resolution, it could be a dream camera for M mount lenses)

The word has it that there's a 18-40 and a pancake coming with it. If it does have a proper shutter and IBIS, I'll probably get it, but I need more info. I would have rather had a flip-up screen and no hotshoe though because it's just more fun (like the GX850).

If Panasonic doesn't release more pancakes and smaller affordable bodies for M43, there won't be many people going to it.

The problem is that cameras like the GM1 were too small to operate with adult hands whereas the GX85 was just big enough. The S9 looks about the same size as a GX85.

[MrSMW]

6 hours ago, eatstoomuchjam said:

 

I hope there are some pretty decent small/light lenses for L mount.  With that (lack of a) handgrip, that thing is an ergonomic nightmare for any sort of handheld shooting with a lens over 300g or so.

 

Two issues right there for me, not that this camera is really anything that is designed for my needs, but always worth at least a look.

As a Nikon Zf user, even with the aftermarket grip by Smallrig, it’s in no way as ergonomically good to use as my Z6ii and when any Z6iii appears, I will move over to those for sure.

Unless old Panny Boy throws me a curveball with either a S1R or S1H replacement.

But it still leaves me with a lens dilemma that I won’t bore anyone with again, so I will leave it there!

This ‘S9’ sounds like the Panasonic love child of the Sony ZVE1 and the Leica Q2?

[ac6000cw]

IBIS has been mentioned on l-rumors.com - and personally (given that competition like the a7c ii, ZV-E1 and X100V1 has it) I think it might be a bit suicidal not to include it.

[John Matthews]

51 minutes ago, ac6000cw said:

IBIS has been mentioned on l-rumors.com - and personally (given that competition like the a7c ii, ZV-E1 and X100V1 has it) I think it might be a bit suicidal not to include it.

I think as a product, some sort of image stab is going to be important. The G100 didn't have it, but it was quite usable EIS. The conundrum is that it's such a small, light camera, it would be really hard to handhold, but if IBIS adds 200g and bulk to the product, it would make sense to go with EIS. Given the competition and Panasonic's strengths, I think it'll be included (and it'll be up to snuff).

[ac6000cw]

1 hour ago, John Matthews said:

The G100 didn't have it, but it was quite usable EIS.

Yes, but there were quite a lot of adverse review comments about the level of cropping it used, which probably had an adverse effect on sales (for a vlogging targeted camera needing a wide angle of view).

I'm sure the S9 will have at least EIS (which Panasonic do very well). If the new 18-40 zoom lens has OIS that might be enough in a dual-IS combination.

[John Matthews]

6 hours ago, ac6000cw said:

I'm sure the S9 will have at least EIS (which Panasonic do very well). If the new 18-40 zoom lens has OIS that might be enough in a dual-IS combination.

We'll see. The rumor has it as being IBIS, but who really knows. The G100 had that exact same system. Most of the reviews were hard on the G100 because Panasonic had a serious case of putting its head in the sand when it came to AF and massively overpromising with every release. Then when they didn't include proper IBIS, I think the poo hit the fan. Still, that camera sold really well according to Panasonic USA. It's also interesting they replaced it with a G100D which was almost the same. People really wanted a GX85 with PDAF, a flip-out screen and mic jack- that was all they needed to do. In fact that's all what people still want; instead, we're getting a low-light camera without a shutter. My guess is that the problem will be rolling shutter in photo and video. Actually, RS was also a problem on the G100.

[hoodlum]

19 hours ago, John Matthews said:

The word has it that there's a 18-40 and a pancake coming with it. If it does have a proper shutter and IBIS, I'll probably get it, but I need more info. I would have rather had a flip-up screen and no hotshoe though because it's just more fun (like the GX850).

If Panasonic doesn't release more pancakes and smaller affordable bodies for M43, there won't be many people going to it.

The problem is that cameras like the GM1 were too small to operate with adult hands whereas the GX85 was just big enough. The S9 looks about the same size as a GX85.

The rumor site confirmed today that there is no mechanical shutter and the pancake prime is a very slow lens cap lens. 

[John Matthews]

5 hours ago, hoodlum said:

The rumor site confirmed today that there is no mechanical shutter and the pancake prime is a very slow lens cap lens.

Yes, that's right. No fan either. The hot shoe is actually a cold shoe. Also, it's much chunkier than previously though to believe IMO but still rather small. For video and for the price, I'd think the FX30 which is only marginally bigger would be a better choice as there are so many video features on it (4k 120fps, for one) that this camera will not have. It's really too bad they didn't go with the flip-up screen; invariably, there are as many or more people wanting the flip-out one. We'll see on the 22nd what this thing is really about.

[Thpriest]

I think the price will decide whether this is a success or not. Priced right with Panasonic's usual feature set, reliability and ease of use, this could well open up the L-Mount to the masses. If not it'll probably be a waste of time.

[BTM_Pix]

At least the real time LUTs are confirmed.

https://x.com/photojoseph/status/1791337358216077501?s=46&t=5rTDhHeUafLdFmL78MFFYQ
 

https://x.com/photojoseph/status/1791337382324900303?s=46&t=5rTDhHeUafLdFmL78MFFYQ
 

 

[John Matthews]

So, I guess the pancake is a 26mm f8 manual focus lens. What were they thinking? I guess I'll stick with my GX800 + 14mm f/2.5 as it's probably better in every way if the goal is "small".

[hojomo]

On 5/17/2024 at 6:55 AM, John Matthews said:

So, I guess the pancake is a 26mm f8 manual focus lens. What were they thinking? I guess I'll stick with my GX800 + 14mm f/2.5 as it's probably better in every way if the goal is "small".

Nikon has a 26mm 2.8 pancake lens that seems to have gotten positive reviews for its price/performance.

It's $400US, which isn't nothing and I'm sure could be sold for cheaper.  I too am baffled. Typo or they want a FF starter lens for $100ish?

[John Matthews]

44 minutes ago, hojomo said:

Nikon has a 26mm 2.8 pancake lens that seems to have gotten positive reviews for its price/performance.

It's $400US, which isn't nothing and I'm sure could be sold for cheaper.  I too am baffled. Typo or they want a FF starter lens for $100ish?

We'll see what this lens is all about in a few days. The term "pancake" can represent many different ideas. I think the Panasonic 26mm is going to be a truly small, but it's MF and F8. Maybe it'll just come with the camera as I can't see how they could make into a real product.

[John Matthews]

Apparently, l-rumors.com/43rumors.com bans you if you question why, after his seeing and shooting the camera, he can't say any more information. To know any answers, you need to sign up for his BS newsletter, subscribe to his BS YouTube channel, watch his incessant ad-copy, self-promos, and BS clickbait several times a day. Those sites are clearly milking info for personal profit at all costs. I sure hope Panasonic isn't working with him as it will be a dealbreaker for me if I find out (and I'm fairly sure they are). I will no longer be going to any of that guy's websites ever again for any reason.

[PannySVHS]

S5 (2) without the hump and no evf? No, thank you. Clickbaiter getting infos from Panny before release of the camera? Please, no!

[PannySVHS]

The leaked images look a bit ugly as well. Maybe the released camera is much prettier. No mechanical shutter? Yikes. That and no evf are very unappealing to me. GX8 has a great design. It should be big enough to house a full frame camera inside.

[John Matthews]

34 minutes ago, PannySVHS said:

S5 (2) without the hump and no evf? No, thank you. Clickbaiter getting infos from Panny before release of the camera? Please, no!

I can understand the reasons for not having an EVF, especially if there's a super-bright panel on it (there's not). I've had a fairly decent experience with the GX800 by putting a non-glare screen protector on it, but it's still not ideal. I will definitely be asking Sean of LUMIX USA the question if they are giving info to l-rumors.com or 43rumors.com. I know he's commented on those websites in the past, saying they had "wild and incorrect" information. My message: don't work with those website!

23 minutes ago, PannySVHS said:

The leaked images look a bit ugly as well. Maybe the released camera is much prettier. No mechanical shutter? Yikes. That and no evf are very unappealing to me. GX8 has a great design. It should be big enough to house a full frame camera inside.

Although I've never tried the GX8, there are so many people that simply love it, even after having the GX80/85, and the GX9 available with newer everything. One of these day, I'm going to have to pick one up. What exactly was the feature that you loved so much about it?

[PannySVHS]

2 hours ago, John Matthews said:

... My message: don't work with those website!

Although I've never tried the GX8, there are so many people that simply love it, even after having the GX80/85, and the GX9 available with newer everything. One of these day, I'm going to have to pick one up. What exactly was the feature that you loved so much about it?

I second that notion, leaving these rumor sites outside the activity of Panny staff.

I have been an admirer of the GX85, the usuabiltiy, the strong 8bit 4k codec in sufficient light and the great colour science for color work in Davinci Resolve. I also like the tactility.

The GX8 is a pretty camera to hold and to look at, seemingly the true m43 leica whereas the GX85 is compromized by its size in that regard and in comparison. I only had a chance to play with someones camera for a few minutes but it was very enyoyable. On a sidenote, when I was checking out the classy GX7 in a store about eleven years ago, it was the prettiest of all digital cameras in my eyes but with a big design flaw. The grip heigth was too much shortened so that my fingers got easily in the way of the AF light. The succeeding GX8 solved that issue but lost some of the sheer beauty in appearance.

I also love the GF1, though very slippery. The GX1, a more modern version and true successor, much more than the GF2 ever was, has the much better 16 MP sensor that's also inside the G3, GX7, GM1/5, G6/7, GH3, GH4, GX85... Still a nice sensor capable of stunning color and results. The GF1 12 MP sensor was a bit of shyte even in 2013 when I bought mine.:) Still got an Olympus EPl1 and EP2 with the same sensor.

You know what, talking about sensors, I never owned a GH2. Wondering how that sensor would fare me for photography. Too bad flickr is not any fun anymore to browse through.

[John Matthews]

47 minutes ago, PannySVHS said:

I second that notion, leaving these rumor sites outside the activity of Panny staff.

I have been an admirer of the GX85, the usuabiltiy, the strong 8bit 4k codec in sufficient light and the great colour science for color work in Davinci Resolve. I also like the tactility.

The GX8 is a pretty camera to hold and to look at, seemingly the true m43 leica whereas the GX85 is compromized by its size in that regard and in comparison. I only had a chance to play with someones camera for a few minutes but it was very enyoyable. On a sidenote, when I was checking out the classy GX7 in a store about eleven years ago, it was the prettiest of all digital cameras in my eyes but with a big design flaw. The grip heigth was too much shortened so that my fingers got easily in the way of the AF light. The succeeding GX8 solved that issue but lost some of the sheer beauty in appearance.

I also love the GF1, though very slippery. The GX1, a more modern version and true successor, much more than the GF2 ever was, has the much better 16 MP sensor that's also inside the G3, GX7, GM1/5, G6/7, GH3, GH4, GX85... Still a nice sensor capable of stunning color and results. The GF1 12 MP sensor was a bit of shyte even in 2013 when I bought mine.:) Still got an Olympus EPl1 and EP2 with the same sensor.

You know what, talking about sensors, I never owned a GH2. Wondering how that sensor would fare me for photography. Too bad flickr is not any fun anymore to browse through.

I won't list all the cameras, especially M43 I've had over the past years, but it's a lot and I'm rather embarrassed about it. Your assessment of the GX8 is probably right. It is significantly bigger than the GX85 and would be able to accommodate the all four fingers on the grip. It looks chunky.

I've got the GX800. It's just so fun to use. I've always felt the G100 and GX85's viewfinders were sketchy and I almost never used them. I briefly had the GX7 for a month and loved the 1080p image off it, but I felt the GX85 would have been a better purchase; so I got that. The GX800 has a decent image, but suffers from moiré in 1080p (but could be worse and the same could be said about the others too). Recently for video, I've been shooting so much with my VX-980 camcorder. It's just so easy to use for video as it's made for it (no moiré). The image isn't as nice as the any of the above 4k images and it cannot take photos, but the fact of having a smooth zoom from 30-630mm is really incredible.