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30 minutes ago, MountneerMan said:

I am confused... From what I understand this experiment would work with JPEGS but not for a RAW file.

I do it with RAW. But to see the effect, it works also with JPEG - because of the compression, of course not so great. You can stack multiple images with RAW / JPEG, etc. to get a much better result than with a single image, but you can get the maximum of DR with multiple RAW images only. Sorry of probably beeing unclear.

2 hours ago, Arikhan said:

just try it: Go with your camera and shoot in quite dark conditions JPEGs in burst mode (even without EV change). Stack them in post to a single image together. Do some post work on it and compare this result with a edited single picture...By far more details and DR...Have fun...

You can test this effect - as I said - with JPEG and RAW. It's up to you...But you will get the most when shooting RAW.

BTW: When shooting RAW at base ISO of 100 (NX1) under ideal conditions, you don't need to stack - because at these settings you touch the maximum limits of DR of the NX1. It makes sense to stack with ISO 200+...

When stacking JPEG it makes always sense to stack multiple images, because of generally decreasing compression artefacts and detail loss in your resulting image...

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42 minutes ago, Arikhan said:

But you will get the most when shooting RAW.

It makes sense but what i do not understand how it is possible stack 2 RAW images to one DNG 25x per second. You have also mentioned that such a 16bit DNG files has 'convenient amount of data' - I think it It would be ground-breaking not just for NX1 community but maybe to whole industry. I hope you will be able to upload such a DNG here - that would be nice.

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Last post now: I see, there are many questions and much to explain. My programming skills also seem to be better than my technical explanations. But one of the forum members offered me help and it would be better letting him to help me. It's not simple to explain technical stuff I'm involved with to other people.

I wrote many assumptions/questions of forum members down, so I can answer them accurately after exams and after posting some examples, so people could see, what we talk about. "Abstract talk" only can get stodgy sometimes...

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12 hours ago, Pavel Mašek said:

(NX1 is running on Linux-like OS Tizen)

Not sure that Tizen is "Linux-like" -- I think it actually is version of Linux.

 

 

4 hours ago, Arikhan said:

As the processor of the NX1 is very powerful, I invented a workflow called IDOB - Image Data Optimization Blocks. It can combine 2 RAW images and output a single DNG file (16 bit) with a convenient amount of data (much less than a single RAW) but with a tremendous amount of DR. And it fits in a modern workflow with Premiere or Davinci.....

This ground principle is not my invention: When putting (stacking) more images together (even shot under same conditions = similar EV) you will get a single superiour image with great DR and tremendous possibilities to work in post.

 

This sounds like the old Magic Lantern HDR video in which alternating H264 frames have different ISOs  (WARNING!  STROBING/FLASHING FRAMES):

 

The trick is that you shoot with the ML HDR video feature at a higher frame rate (50fps or 60fps) and then combine every two consecutive images to get HDR video at half the frame rate (25fps or 30fps).  As mentioned in the video, one can encounter motion/ghosting problems with this method.

 

I wonder if the Magic Lantern HDR option works their 60fps raw video feature on the 5d III (although I am not sure if this HDR method makes sense when shooting raw).

 

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3 hours ago, MountneerMan said:

Now I might be missing the point completely but then again I am also convinced that Arikhan is just messing with everyone at this point.

I guess You're Right.

Magic Lantern had a large team of developers who didn't unearth RAW already hiding within the features or capabilities of a camera (ala how Cinelike V and D were unearth on the GX85/80). They created RAW specifically, from the ground up. While the NX1 could be hacked into shooting all sorts of codecs, it would require some seriously intensive work, by a large group, not by some guy who randomly read a reference interview of a Samsung official who outlined the capabilities of the sensor and processor. I don't doubt for a second that a hacked NX1 would be wayyyy more capable than the 5D Mark iii with Magic Lantern. What I doubt is, whether someone in this thread has already done it. 

This was, therefore, a damp squib. R.I.P.

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5 hours ago, Arikhan said:

@Pavel Mašek

It seems to be a misconception out there...You can't increase DR endlessly - this would be a perpetuum mobile and so...impossible. At the end of the day, output DR is limited by the maximum DR-capabilities of the sensor.

By stacking together you can only get more and more near to the DR limits given by the sensor - and get more maleability in post by gathering useful information to work with in highlights, mids and shadows. So, that's a kind of optimizing and NOT increasing. Only sensor manufacturers can increase the DR capabilties of a sensor...

Not true. You can get beyond the inherent sensor dynamic range by stacking images acquired at different gains and/or ND settings to get a final image with a DR much greater than the individual images.

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14 minutes ago, sanveer said:

I obviously missed the 1st April deadline. I guess the fact that it co-incides with April Fool's Day makes it more intriguing. 

Wasn't ML released on April 1st? 

I've been in contact with Arikhan. If this is a joke he's been rather convincing both publically and privately. If it turns out to be a bluff, it is what it is, we got played, that's the tradition of April Fool's. 

I think whatever the situation, you can't denie this has many of us intrigued, including yourself. A great many of us have felt through out the years of onwership and use that the NX1 had more technical potential then Samsung enabled. I think our very own Andrew Reid would agree. This possible revelation plays right into the hands of these speculations, and if true, its not only good for existing and potential NX1 owners, but the broader mirrorless market altogether. This would perk up the likes Panasonic, Sony and Fuji for sure. It would be a serious call to action. 

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20 minutes ago, Mattias Burling said:

Its just classic spolied kid behavior. He clearly said april 1st. If its true or not doesn't matter, thats the date.

But some just can't accept that they have to wait for things. They instead try to provoke, debate, etc.

I am not trying to provoke debate. I am just saying that given all the information we have todate the logical thing is Arikhan is just yanking you for a ride.

Also, personally I would much rather be wrong then be played.

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1 minute ago, MountneerMan said:

I am not trying to provoke debate. I am just saying that given all the information we have todate the logical thing is Arikhan is just yanking you for a ride.

Also, personally I would much rather be wrong then be played.

We all want our suspicions to be wrong on this one. Hopefully, I'll have some good news for everyone soon.

"Arikhan" is a young man from Germany and he doesn't feel strong with the English language and has asked for my assistance in fielding the information as it becomes apparent. Right now, he's focusing on his studies/finals for school and we need to give him that space. The goal here is to address any technical questions that will inevitably crop up in a sort of FAQ when Arikhan is ready to reveal this to us. There's also a legal component to this and we want our friend to be protected here. 

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17 hours ago, Arikhan said:

But for now...I'm fighting with Keynesian & Marxian economics, globalization BS, European integration and so on for my exam tomorrow. Not funny at all...


Oh I dunno.... I find Keynesian and Marxian economics to be quite funny indeed! ha

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4 minutes ago, IronFilm said:


Hope it works for the NX300! haha

To my knowledge I think only the NX1 and a Nikon (can't remember the model) are being tested so far.

Also, it doesn't seem Arikhan has any particular bias to the NX1, nor does it seem to be a hack or a mod in the traditional sense of how we know those terms, at least that's how I'm hearing it explained. There could be a slight language barrier at play, I guess all will become clearer as time reveals. 

From my vantage point the motivation here seems to be academic, but I have limited in-depth insight at this point, and I would only share with his blessing. He seems focused on school and that's good enough for me.

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