Trek of Joy

The event is expected to last more than 20 mins. Just a heads up for any R5 shooters at the event.

This is a mix of EOS R (first time I actually used it) and a 5dIV that I can't stand. Most was shot at 1080p, but some is 4k. The only lenses I used are EF, the 16-35, Sigma 24-105 and 35/1.4. Most of the R stuff was with the 35/1.4.
https://youtu.be/_7jOTHHvSIQ
I have another video about wakeboarding that should be up in the next couple days, I used the 5dIV a lot less and the R a lot more.
Chris

Everything that Trek of Joy said re DPAF! You can trust it with both RF and adapted - R5/6 look even better for focussing. I too use touch to focus - and the drag to focus is excellent for controlled pulls. Touch screen and EVF best I’ve used - you can even use them in tandem: eye on the EVF, finger on the LCD to change focus.
I can’t compare with Sony but can give you a rundown of the R’s AF performance with specific lenses:
RF - quickest AF overall but it’s lens specific. The RF35mm STM for example is slow - behaves a lot like the EF 50 1.8 STM - whereas the RF 15-35, RF 24-70 and RF 24-105 are more responsive, smoother pulls due to the nano USM motor. They are also the quietest - silent. Note though that these RF lenses breathe a bit, so they’re not ‘cinematic’ in that sense, par for the course with standard zooms.
For cinematic breathing and pulls it’s got to be the Sigmas. They don’t snap too quickly into focus with DPAF. Very smooth transitions. 24-35 f2 is limited range but outstanding, virtually parfocal with no breathing. If you’re up for shooting crop, the 18-35 is still the one to beat - I’ve never seen it autofocus better on any other camera. Talking of crop, EF-S STM lenses (10-18, 18-135) are also very responsive and smooth focussing, breathing pretty well controlled, and almost silent. But they have aperture penalties. The EF 24-105 STM is just the same, silent, smooth pulls, actually a decent video lens but variable aperture.
As for EF, very mixed bag. Still to find a standard zoom that ticks the boxes. Canon’s own 24-70s are probably the quickest and smoothest but quite old (not designed with video in mind), noisy and no IS - no prob for the R5. I still think they’re better with DPAF than third party. Sigma 24-70 OS is also noisy, breathes heavily, but focuses smoothly. Tamron 24-70 VC very noisy, breathes, focussing far too snappy - opposite of cinematic - but locks focus better than its Sigma counterpart. Very ‘sticky’, so a lot depends on use case.
Least breathing (zero breathing) is the Tokina 28-70 f2.6-2.8 (Angenieux design) and it’s almost parfocal, but so noisy that even lavs pick it up, so it’s manual focus only. Good news is the RF cameras also have a great manual focusing system. Eye tracking still works ie. you still get a focus box automatically around the eye, tracks wherever it is in the frame. Just adjust the focus ring until box goes green.
Best primes for smooth AF  - again the Sigmas, though they occasionally back focus. Just adjust AF settings to make them more sticky. Or tap to refocus. Some of the older EF hold up surprisingly well: 28 f1.8, 35 f2, 85 f1.8 - but all are noisy. Overall the RF lenses will tend to perform better than EF in terms of speed and smooth transition.
More generally I prefer the well-performing EF over the heavy RF so I can use the drop in ND or speedbooster. I actually like the 4K crop mode on the R, so the Sigma 18-35 and Tokina Angie 28-70 are my go-to pair for cinematic focussing in crop mode - with EF-S STMs for versatile plastic video backups. For FF, I say RF first for all round video performance, and Sigma for smoother cinematic narratives. I’d favour Canon EF primes and their standard zooms over the Tamrons but not by a huge margin.
Hope this is useful. The R5 may be a different animal of course, so I say rent lenses / buy-to-return and have fun experimenting.

I enjoy his channel but if ever there was a wrong camera for him it is this one as it would have overheated by the time he got to his second point.

I've been impressed with the R's video AF, the only RF lens I've used on a shoot is the 35, other lenses I've used are the EF 16-35/2.8 III, Sigma 35/1.4, Sigma 24-105, EF 100-400 L II and I just scored a deal on a used RF 24-70 but haven't shot anything with it yet. The last FW update really boosted the R's AF, after watching a few videos I decided to try one and see how I liked it to get back to Canon colors. I sold my a73 shortly after getting it and made the R my main video body. I still shoot Sony for stills, but the 45mp R5 will likely change that unless the a7s3 is something special. Anyway, stuff closer than arms length is a little fuzzy so I need reading glasses - meaning I have a hard time judging critical focus on the LCD or EVF - reliable video AF has been a life saver for me. Vloggers love it, need I say more LOL!
The a73's tracking is probably a little better, eye af seems to be a notch above the R but the R5 looks to be on par with Sony's newest bodies. With the a73 your subject can be further away before it switches to face tracking and it seems to lock onto faces a bit quicker, but the interface just isn't as good and IMO the touch is laggy. Canon's touchscreen is just more responsive (makes focusing and navigating menus so much easier) and I like the flippy screen over Sony's tilt screen. Both can slow the AF speed for more natural focus pulls, that's a push IMO. I use the touchscreen on the R for pretty much everything and I've had no issues with the AF box leaving my subject. Its just so easy to tap the screen and go.
I've done a couple hours worth of interviews with people sitting and standing using all the lenses I listed above - they always move, its natural - focus stays glued to them. Servo AF does the job nicely. I shot wakeboarding with the 100-400 and it had no problem tracking them coming at the camera, when I was panning, and when they were moving away from the camera. Gimbal shots are a breeze, I just tap the LCD and focus on framing and not tripping over stuff. The only hiccups were quick zooms, it takes a second to refocus but it stays locked onto the subject. The a73 and a7r3 always did the same thing. After watching a few R5 videos, Canon has made significant improvements to the DPAF capabilities over the R, it definitely looks next level with the amount of processing power the camera has. I'm looking forward to testing it out.
Chris

Meh.. fairly standard practice from them. Pre-pandemic this type of launch would have warranted a big hoopla press event in a staged environment with media card doors sealed but instead they went with sending preproduction cameras with NDAs on footage etc.
We’ll have to wait for production units to get more than the “hands-on” review.. 

Yep, they are grouped 24,25,30 - 50,60 - 100, 120 

For this kind of specs they usually go for the most demanding recording modes. I think that the limitations on 4K30 applies to 4K24 as well.

Highly likely. Fair warning, don’t go into the comments section unless you really want to live first hand the scene in Star Wars where they fall into the garbage compactor.
Taking a shower now.
Gems like “The slow drip of rumors of the A7SIII is actually pp on canon”.
You’ve been warned.

Fair enough.
Thanks.
You CAN print at that size from even a 8mp camera though with decent upsizing software though yes, if you do print that large, more MP to start helps.
Not sure that would apply to many people though.
My photos are mainly just for me now and family and friends but have had normal photos (IE not something unique) from the A7s taken at isos like 102400 in newspapers, something I would never have imagined even sending them with any other camera I have used even if they COULD have taken it.    Pre Covid, I have had a lot of bands using my photos and in the last few years, mainly just for the likes of Facebook or website use and for that a 4mp camera would possibly be overkill.     Photos I had on a major label CD years ago where tiny (taken with a 6mp DLR...would have LOVED an A7s back then). 
Even things like most photo contests when asking for entries will usually have a size limit (often something like 2500 pixels on the longest side) so even A7s files have to be downsized to enter and for judging.
Ye, we all have our requirements.
 

Sony's new AF system seems to be a given, if the plastic fantastic a6100 got it, I'm sure the new a7s will too. I don't think there's anything wrong with the a7s for photos, I've traveled with one extensively (though I've always had a r2/3 as well). But I find 12mp limiting because once you do even small things like straighten horizons and adjust crop for framing or a little perspective correction - at least for me - there's just not a lot of pixels to spare. My output isn't strictly for social/web, I shoot stuff that does get printed large on occasion. I shot part of a campaign that covered walls and a train in Toronto's metro as well as busses in London - the smallest file I had was about 4200px wide, they asked if I had a larger version. The a7s is a fine stills camera, but with no real difference compared to downsampling higher mp Sony cameras, its easier for my workflow to shoot with higher mp bodies. Plus when shooting landscapes - which is most of my stuff these days -the additional details just adds more punch to the files, I prefer the look. I've started printing my own stuff in larger numbers through Printique too, I just marvel at the level of detail from the a7r bodies. If I need any more DR - which is rare - I just bracket and combine in post. YMMV.
Cheers
Chris

Sony's new AF system seems to be a given, if the plastic fantastic a6100 got it, I'm sure the new a7s will too. I don't think there's anything wrong with the a7s for photos, I've traveled with one extensively (though I've always had a r2/3 as well). But I find 12mp limiting because once you do even small things like straighten horizons and adjust crop for framing or a little perspective correction - at least for me - there's just not a lot of pixels to spare. My output isn't strictly for social/web, I shoot stuff that does get printed large on occasion. I shot part of a campaign that covered walls and a train in Toronto's metro as well as busses in London - the smallest file I had was about 4200px wide, they asked if I had a larger version. The a7s is a fine stills camera, but with no real difference compared to downsampling higher mp Sony cameras, its easier for my workflow to shoot with higher mp bodies. Plus when shooting landscapes - which is most of my stuff these days -the additional details just adds more punch to the files, I prefer the look. I've started printing my own stuff in larger numbers through Printique too, I just marvel at the level of detail from the a7r bodies. If I need any more DR - which is rare - I just bracket and combine in post. YMMV.
Cheers
Chris

I'm sure this will make the R5 popular with porn directors.

I'm sure this will make the R5 popular with porn directors.

I'm sure this will make the R5 popular with porn directors.

Crazy indeed. Look closely at 0:51. The AF cannot distinguish an eye from a butthole.

 
 

I left the a7s2 behind the moment the a73 arrived because of the jump to 24mp. Not going back to 12mp unless the video is really something special, like @wolf33d, I want to shoot stills and video in the same body, 12mp is jut too far of a step back for me. I hope this rumor is wrong, because a stacked 12mp sensor would be a disappointment for me. I say for me, not you. Not cancelling my R5 order just yet Sony, still not convinced Sony has solved thermal issues that have plagued their bodies in the past as 10-bit 4k120p will need a lot more processing than the current low bitrate video all their bodies spit out.
Chris
If you downsample the Sony 42mp files to 12mp, there's no noise difference at useable high ISO's, I don't count the 100k and above ISO's as useable because there's no detail in the files.

No. The whole point for me and for millions of FF mirrorless owner in the world is to have a do it all camera. I hate to carry 2 body with me on 60 miles trek at 3000m in the mountain or on summit attempts. Granted, not millions of shooters are mountaineers, but millions of them are travelers, and hate traveling with 2 cameras if one could do it all. 

So not only I want to carry 1 body, but I want great IBIS. It remains to be seen if the A7SIII IBIS is the same shit as the A7RIV, or excellent like the R5. It remains to be seen if they included Venice color science, and completely changed the body ergonomics and buttons and menus. 

Since I never shoot more than 1 min clips I do not care about the overheating. BUT, if Sony could have a quad bayer that gives me 12mpx video and 48mpx stills, with much better ergonomics / buttons / menus, better color and better IBIS (basically matching the R5 on those aspects) then I would stay with Sony for 2 reasons: I am already in the ecosystem and I would rather have 12mpx video / 48 mpx stills with the obvious advantages it brings (rolling shutter...) than having just 45mpx. 

However, I value MUCH more having great IBIS, great body feeling and pleasure of using the camera than having a quad bayer only. It's not like Canon is much behind in spec like always before.

I remember an article from @Andrew Reid about how important having a camera with a good body and interface is, that it gives you the will to actually go and shoot and that bodies with poor ergonomics do not inspire you. I kind of agreed at the time. It seems you do not take this into account anymore in your R5/A7S III comments Andrew. I understand the frustration you have with overheating and your pro work that requires long recording, but I am sure you have plenty of gear for that job already and I am sure you will very much enjoy shooting a lot with the R5 for creative short videos. 

Having pre-ordered both the R5 and R6 as a tiny deposit, while i decided to get them or not, I have to say as someone who make a living with video, so far I'm concerned. 
This post includes some negativity, so I just want to make it clear that having pre-ordered them for very specific reasons I want these cameras to work well.
 
What it looks like.
We can only speculate, but it looks like these cameras will be either transformational or a disaster depending on their use. 
I think both @Neumann Films and @Andrew Reid have good perspectives - this is how I see it. 
The R5 (and the R6) look like a marvel on paper - finally the hybrid that supposedly does everything and potentially makes creating professional video very, very liberating. Very well done Canon for waking up. 
But is it a kick in the balls? 
A couple of years back, I was using the A7SII and A6500 in my camera bag. They overheated twice (amongst many many shoots), and it was annoying as it stopped the shoot and made us go behind schedule. 
With 4k60p and 4k120 being a staple feature on many brand and music video shoots, the question is how many bursts can it handle on a fast paced shoot? I do think it will be mostly fine, as shots come in short bursts and there's gaps between setting up a new shot, the potential issue is still there. Although my EVA1 doesn't have DPAF, IBIS or a full frame - it doesn't even flinch on a shoot and I have no worries. Same with the GH5. The potential of overheating in the back of my mine is certainly not a worry i want to have. Especially with client money on the table. 
I think the issue is that when people are spending a few grand on a camera, with very expensive lenses and accessories, they expect it to work for most scenarios and not have to worry about the camera having a tantrum. It's one less camera to buy and carry if you wish to do longer form content like interviews. I see people saying "buy a C300". For many, it's just not realistic. 
For most things that are not very short bursts, the R6 looks like a complete write off. On paper, there's no chance that camera could keep up with multiple, consistent takes. 
Also for those expecting to shoot continuous 8k RAW, go and see your Doctor. 😉
 
Questions?
As some of you may know, having an external monitor at least on the hot shoe during a professional shoot is pretty much essential. Also, recording to an edit friendly codec like ProRes is sometimes a great necessity. External recording would be a fine "workaround", if you could still get the benefits of the EOS R bodies (as long as you have a HDMI lock) This will be the pressing questions for most professional shooters intending to use this system.
How long can it go in continuous bursts shooting 4k60? Someone with a body needs to test this. 
 
Usage
The R5 will be fine for a lot of things, but I think it will be very popular on big movies as a crash cam with that 8K RAW in such a small body.  It's very much a speciality mode that I'm sure will be used on many movie sets. 
The R6, I'm not so sure. 
There's other cameras out there (Zcam E2-M4 - £1300 camera with 4k160fps 10 bit), although nothing will match the R5 if overheating can be managed.
Let's hope the climax to this story is a good one.  
Tets, tests, tests. 
 

This thread is insane. All this over a chart without any actual tests.
I remember buying the a6300, a7s2 and a7r2 despite the internet overload about overheating, single card slots that no professional would ever use, 8-bit 4:2:0 video with blotchy zombie skin tones, crop on everything that's not 24p, only 4k30p and so on. I live in Florida and never had any issues despite using it on a gimbal all the time in the sun and shooting longer takes, it doesn't take much to swap batteries or turn the camera off when not in use, or not leav it sitting out in the sun all day. I took them to Africa on safari shooting thousands of frames and hours of video, also took them to Dubai, Egypt and Israel in August when it was upwards of 125f. Now we have a camera that shoots 8k raw, 4k120fps with amazing AF, class leading IBIS and can even shoot 45mp stills with bursts of 130 raw images or infinite jpegs if that's your thing, and its trash because you can't shoot an entire wedding in one take?
Wow.
Can't wait for the shitstorm with Sony's cripple hammer on the a7s3 and the pendulum to swing back to the R5/6 and how "I can work around the issues, its worth it for raw and 120p." This reads like a Sony Alpha rumors post.
LOL!

This thread is insane. All this over a chart without any actual tests.
I remember buying the a6300, a7s2 and a7r2 despite the internet overload about overheating, single card slots that no professional would ever use, 8-bit 4:2:0 video with blotchy zombie skin tones, crop on everything that's not 24p, only 4k30p and so on. I live in Florida and never had any issues despite using it on a gimbal all the time in the sun and shooting longer takes, it doesn't take much to swap batteries or turn the camera off when not in use, or not leav it sitting out in the sun all day. I took them to Africa on safari shooting thousands of frames and hours of video, also took them to Dubai, Egypt and Israel in August when it was upwards of 125f. Now we have a camera that shoots 8k raw, 4k120fps with amazing AF, class leading IBIS and can even shoot 45mp stills with bursts of 130 raw images or infinite jpegs if that's your thing, and its trash because you can't shoot an entire wedding in one take?
Wow.
Can't wait for the shitstorm with Sony's cripple hammer on the a7s3 and the pendulum to swing back to the R5/6 and how "I can work around the issues, its worth it for raw and 120p." This reads like a Sony Alpha rumors post.
LOL!

This thread is insane. All this over a chart without any actual tests.
I remember buying the a6300, a7s2 and a7r2 despite the internet overload about overheating, single card slots that no professional would ever use, 8-bit 4:2:0 video with blotchy zombie skin tones, crop on everything that's not 24p, only 4k30p and so on. I live in Florida and never had any issues despite using it on a gimbal all the time in the sun and shooting longer takes, it doesn't take much to swap batteries or turn the camera off when not in use, or not leav it sitting out in the sun all day. I took them to Africa on safari shooting thousands of frames and hours of video, also took them to Dubai, Egypt and Israel in August when it was upwards of 125f. Now we have a camera that shoots 8k raw, 4k120fps with amazing AF, class leading IBIS and can even shoot 45mp stills with bursts of 130 raw images or infinite jpegs if that's your thing, and its trash because you can't shoot an entire wedding in one take?
Wow.
Can't wait for the shitstorm with Sony's cripple hammer on the a7s3 and the pendulum to swing back to the R5/6 and how "I can work around the issues, its worth it for raw and 120p." This reads like a Sony Alpha rumors post.
LOL!

This thread is insane. All this over a chart without any actual tests.
I remember buying the a6300, a7s2 and a7r2 despite the internet overload about overheating, single card slots that no professional would ever use, 8-bit 4:2:0 video with blotchy zombie skin tones, crop on everything that's not 24p, only 4k30p and so on. I live in Florida and never had any issues despite using it on a gimbal all the time in the sun and shooting longer takes, it doesn't take much to swap batteries or turn the camera off when not in use, or not leav it sitting out in the sun all day. I took them to Africa on safari shooting thousands of frames and hours of video, also took them to Dubai, Egypt and Israel in August when it was upwards of 125f. Now we have a camera that shoots 8k raw, 4k120fps with amazing AF, class leading IBIS and can even shoot 45mp stills with bursts of 130 raw images or infinite jpegs if that's your thing, and its trash because you can't shoot an entire wedding in one take?
Wow.
Can't wait for the shitstorm with Sony's cripple hammer on the a7s3 and the pendulum to swing back to the R5/6 and how "I can work around the issues, its worth it for raw and 120p." This reads like a Sony Alpha rumors post.
LOL!

This thread is insane. All this over a chart without any actual tests.
I remember buying the a6300, a7s2 and a7r2 despite the internet overload about overheating, single card slots that no professional would ever use, 8-bit 4:2:0 video with blotchy zombie skin tones, crop on everything that's not 24p, only 4k30p and so on. I live in Florida and never had any issues despite using it on a gimbal all the time in the sun and shooting longer takes, it doesn't take much to swap batteries or turn the camera off when not in use, or not leav it sitting out in the sun all day. I took them to Africa on safari shooting thousands of frames and hours of video, also took them to Dubai, Egypt and Israel in August when it was upwards of 125f. Now we have a camera that shoots 8k raw, 4k120fps with amazing AF, class leading IBIS and can even shoot 45mp stills with bursts of 130 raw images or infinite jpegs if that's your thing, and its trash because you can't shoot an entire wedding in one take?
Wow.
Can't wait for the shitstorm with Sony's cripple hammer on the a7s3 and the pendulum to swing back to the R5/6 and how "I can work around the issues, its worth it for raw and 120p." This reads like a Sony Alpha rumors post.
LOL!

This thread is insane. All this over a chart without any actual tests.
I remember buying the a6300, a7s2 and a7r2 despite the internet overload about overheating, single card slots that no professional would ever use, 8-bit 4:2:0 video with blotchy zombie skin tones, crop on everything that's not 24p, only 4k30p and so on. I live in Florida and never had any issues despite using it on a gimbal all the time in the sun and shooting longer takes, it doesn't take much to swap batteries or turn the camera off when not in use, or not leav it sitting out in the sun all day. I took them to Africa on safari shooting thousands of frames and hours of video, also took them to Dubai, Egypt and Israel in August when it was upwards of 125f. Now we have a camera that shoots 8k raw, 4k120fps with amazing AF, class leading IBIS and can even shoot 45mp stills with bursts of 130 raw images or infinite jpegs if that's your thing, and its trash because you can't shoot an entire wedding in one take?
Wow.
Can't wait for the shitstorm with Sony's cripple hammer on the a7s3 and the pendulum to swing back to the R5/6 and how "I can work around the issues, its worth it for raw and 120p." This reads like a Sony Alpha rumors post.
LOL!