gt3rs

Seems a really good camera, probably the best hybrid at the moment.

It makes A1, Z9 and R3 look overpriced compared to this. Really good that Nikon is aggressive with the price/features pushing Canon and Sony. 

Only odd thing that apparently it cannot record video on both cards...and personally I don't like the screen as is a pita on gimbals...

On 5/2/2023 at 1:50 AM, D Verco said:

What's the benefit of the Z9/ Z8 for video over the Canon R5. I don't know enough about the canon, but I thought it was meant to be a good video hybrid?

The main difference is Z9 8k 60 vs R5 8k 30 (R5c has 8k 60) but at the end imo what it counts is what leans you have. 

Flip out screens are great especially for gimbal use as they don't interfere with the motors/arms!  

A cam R5c, B cam R5, 3 insta360 (R, 1 inch and GO2) and an iPhone 13 (that I truly hate for photo and video with s..ty file system, worst workflow ever)

High definition in term of "sharpness" or you mean overall image quality (sharpness, dr, noise, rolling shutter, etc)?
Do you need high-quality  slow-motion or not?

Highest definition is one out of the 8k cameras R5, R5c, Z9, A1, REDs or BM 12k. The only kind of option in this price bracket is a used R5. 

4k there are quite a bit of choices now.

If you need AF, and for modelling is imo very useful, and photo, buy either Sony or Canon and a good used 24-70 or a couple of primes 35/85. Investing in the nice L mount not sure it is wise. Panny is a nice player in the photo/video business compared to the big boys. You want to move up or down in chain Panny has not much to offer with the same lens mount... so you need to sell and buy lenses. Now they finally have a better AF but they dropped in the quality.... 

 

53 minutes ago, Django said:

Ah.. I see in the fine print of "Power Saving Mode" the restrictions (RAW, 8K mp4, XF-AVC Intra etc). 

So what does that leave you with? up to 4K60p mp4 & 8K XF-AVC Long GOP ?

As I read is "XF-AVC Intra Slow and Fast" not normal fps, my bet is any XF-AVC (24,25,50 and 60) will have the power saving. 
Unfortunately there is no 8k XF-AVC on the R5c, is either RAW or MP4.

39 minutes ago, ntblowz said:

From that announcement it look like they have quite a few feature updates planned for R5C, this is just the beginning!

Will Canon pull ahead vs other brand in terms of firmware update this year as they have released all the mirrorless camera they want to release this year, all that left is using firmware update to expand the feature even more.

 

Great, so there is still hope for LUT on RAW playback!

I wish (hope) that the power saving would be also in place when the camera is not recording as this is a real battery drain, going to "media play" solves the issue but if you forget to do it you loose a lot of battery for nothing.

Photo/video switch speed is for sure good, the waveform for me is a big improvement as this small thing is hard to read, and I'm very curios to test the AF improvements especially with helmets being a normal situation in my subjects.

Overall I'm happy that they try to improve the camera.

3 hours ago, Ty Harper said:

Oh man, these are pretty much all the FW updates I had hoped for!

"Improvements to the EOS R5 C include support for the EF-EOS R 0.71x Mount Adapter, faster switching time between photo and video modes, a power saving mode, 2x magnification during 8K MP4 recording and a digital-teleconverter option, maximizing flexibility by providing a quick way to increase the telephoto capability of the lens used."

https://www.newsshooter.com/2023/04/02/canon-cinema-eos-firmware-updates/?fbclid=IwAR3gafIkHuTszqC19mYmhmtG9l7H3i8U2hXb_tAwIx7NVgjY-QYm_vt9TgQ&mibextid=Zxz2cZ

Cool, let's see how it turns out, really looking forward on the power saving mode.

I wish they would also add:
- Apply LUT on RAW playback. This seems so basic!
- AF face tracking in 4k 100/120 
- 8k 50/60 RAW with AF and IS with internal battery even if it last only 15min
- Move the waveform around as you wish.
- Program a button for deleting video in playback mode that requires a simple confirmation and not 300 button press...

Why would you "buy" an APS-C lens for A7IV? If you already own it maybe for video, but buying it make no sense to me, for photo is meh as you loose a lot of res and for video is questionable.

Buy a good FF used lens, you will resell it with no too much loss if you want to change.  

I mostly buy used lens and if you find a good priced one you may end up selling for almost the same price that you brought.

On 3/25/2023 at 12:39 AM, Django said:

FX30 has much chunkier (ALL-I) codecs going up to 600mbps vs 200mbps on S5ii. It has 15ms RS vs 22ms on S5ii. It's AF is class-leading. And I believe it is Netflix approved which is always something to consider.

FX3 is Netflix approved FX30 is not or not yet: https://partnerhelp.netflixstudios.com/hc/en-us/articles/360000579527-Cameras-Image-Capture-Requirements-and-Best-Practices#h_01G6KEYFG76GRKVMJS382H5638

I would take FX30 or FX3 over Pana S5ii for the lens selection alone.

On 3/31/2023 at 11:25 AM, Django said:

amazing shots as usual! are those stills or frame grabs?

I would thing IBIS would be a huge benefit when shooting handheld at such focal lengths but I guess there are the odd hiccups which you can't afford to miss in your extreme shoots. 

Thanks!

All frame grabs, the only exception is the last one that is a photo from a timelapse sequence.

IBIS is known to be way less effective on long focal lens, not enough travel space so far back. The RF 100-500 is rated 5 stops IS and 6 stops when combined with IBIS and probably at 100mm, in practice I see zero difference other than the annoying reset that IBIS seems to be doing.

IBIS should be fully lockable and independent from lens IS, then we would have the best of both world.

Regarding IBIS I can confirm that with long lenses > 100mm (70-200, 100-500) the R5 sometimes jumps (kind of reset itself to the middle) and it is something that the R5c does not do.

I was filming in Alaska and the first day I opted for the R5 instead of the R5c due to the power consumption, in that environment I would not use and external battery, cables etc.. But I got a few shots ruined by IBIS so for day 2 I switched to the R5c and 6 batteries 😲 .

Is definitely a special use case mine where I do film a lot handheld at 300-500mm.... 

Not that I personally care but the R5c is now Netflix approved.

Nevertheless a firmware update that improves the standby power is long due.

Really a meh release….

And 12 Mpix only, imo is overpriced.

Where are all the “R8 is overpriced because it has only 1 card” naysayer? This one has only 1 card too for 700$ more…

8k 60p DCI RAW vs 8k 30p 10bit not really a blowing away…

Plus S35 6k 60p RAW… and for 2100$ less than the A1.

Z9 is better priced and more competitive than the A1 for video.

14 hours ago, BTM_Pix said:

Meanwhile, far from handing out cease and desist notices, Nikon are absolutely thrilled with a 3rd party releasing lenses for their system.

Hopefully this might see Canon reverse their policy?

Nah, me neither.

 

Apparently Nikon is deciding which lenses 3 parties can license or not, basically only non competing lenses. Not a coincidence that these are ASP-C lenses. Not really open but better than Canon.

11 minutes ago, herein2020 said:

 

No I didn't just go by what Andrew said, I looked at it for myself, and the R8 is missing the back wheel around the joystick which I use on literally every single shoot, they moved the photo/video switch to the left side which means I would need to let go of my side handle to flip the switch vs the R7 which is on the right side and right under my thumb allowing me to instantly switch from photos to quick video clips during events, and last but not least it is even smaller and lighter than the R7.

 

On the switch this is really nitpicking... R5c has the switch on the left side. R5 does not even have the switch but you need to program a button and imo is worst as you can hit it by mistake as I do sometime and I hate it. So imo on the switch R8 > R5.
R7 has two wheels one for the index finger and one on the back but place much higher .... R8 has two wheels too one for the index finger and one that you can reach with your thumb on top like the R5, R5c, R3 and so on... it seems to me that the R7 is the strange one here.... if the R7 would have had 3 wheels maybe but it again it only has 1 joystick more....
 
I can understand that for your usage or preference you like the ergonomics of the R7 better, but claiming that the R8 has bad ergonomics is a bit of a long shoot.

Is quite surprising that so few power zoom lenses available from the various lens makers. 

Canon only has the 18-135 EF-S plus the PZ-E1 (that I think is even discontinued) or cine servo lenses that quite expensive. I would love to have PZ on the 70-200 and 100-500, I use a wireless ff to create a poor man servo zoom but is a big pita to setup every time.... rails... lens gear....additional batteries and cables and lastly calibration.... or use the DJI Focus on the gimbal for zoom but the same pita to set it up. One small but already good improvement would be to have focus and zoom lens gear by default on photo lenses....

Sony has a few ones with the 28-135 F4 probably the most useful on FF and although expensive more affordable that other options. Some good ones for APS-C... 18-105, 18-200...

Nikon and Sigma not sure they have any...
 

16 hours ago, herein2020 said:

The R8 on the other hand IMO has a lot of real world compromises (battery size, ergonomics, single card slot, etc.) that I feel are more important than IQ to keep it at its current price point with a FF sensor. YT and other social media platforms do far more damage to my IQ than any crop sensor or line skipped footage ever will. 

Battery size I'm fully with you but ergonomics?
It misses a joystick compared to the R7, moving the AF points with the touch screen is better for movies as you are not bumping the camera as with the joystick and is quicker so not really sure that this one omission makes it such a big deal.

Andrew posted that R8 has bad ergonomics and people do not even check 😁 

https://camerasize.com/compact/#903,890,ha,b

https://camerasize.com/compact/#903,890,ha,t

Cards got much more reliable if you buy good ones. I had 2 cards (same shitty Lexar 3400 CFast crap, no more lexar ever since then) failing in 20 years. The biggest advantage that you can store the two cards in different places to avoid thief or loss so you save backup time.
But honestly if you have 1500 dollar camera budget your are probably not shooting the Olympics. Having two cameras is probably more important that two card slots. As you can almost afford 2 x R8 (or maybe even better 1 R8 + 1 R7) vs 1 R6 II it maybe the safest option if you do it professionally.
One thing that most people do not know that dual cards protects of data loss but if 1 card fails the camera stops recording even if it has 2 cards.... it is bad but is like this at least on Canon. 

But I do agree for some IBIS + Longer battery + dual cards  is more important than FF + 4k60 HQ the good thing that you can pick the one that fits you better or stretch the budget and and have it all in the R6 II or 1 R8 + 1 R7 

3 hours ago, newfoundmass said:

 

How is this camera built for speed? 

 

Maybe because it can oversample a FF 24 mpix sensors at 60 fps 10 bit with full AF and can shoot 40fps 12 bit RAW pictures with full AF and AE.

40 fps RAW I believe it makes it the fastest FF RAW camera (with the R6 ii)…. just a few years ago you would need to buy a 1Dx class camera for 12/14 fps RAW….

But I finally find your problem with this camera … is not a Panasonic 🤣🤣

2 hours ago, Kisaha said:

..and I was so enthusiastic..I am seriously considering going L all the way now, I just have to sell so many things it's unbelievable..

Completely personal feeling and not based on any fact, but I'm a bit puzzled why in a shrinking industry people would invest on L mount with basically only nice players with no high-end cinema and entry level consumers camera offering.... Currently the only two pseudo safe bet are Sony and Canon as both have from entry level to high-end cinema camera. Sony has already all in the mirrorless mount and Canon is following, plus you have REDs using the same RF mount.

Nikon has the Z9 that is really really a good camera but is the only one at the moment in their line. They have also some cool lenses so maybe they bounce back hopefully.

On the L mount... Leica and Sigma are really nice players for cameras, Panasonic seems to have dropped cinema cameras, how old is the EVA? and is not really a player in the photo space... Maybe DJI can push on the long term.... but seems a more risky move.

If people stick with Sony or Canon and don't continue to switch they save money and get good options from lower budget up to the big guns..... the others not soo much.

The used lens market is also much bigger and you can find really good deal. As EF + adapter works so well on the R cameras you can find some pretty impressive lens at attractive price. You now start to see also quite a bit of RF lenses used although with higher prices...

Then L mount will dominate ad I was totally wrong.... but personally I would not bet on it.

8 hours ago, newfoundmass said:

Yes, I'm serious. And if you don't think a FF camera at a comparable price point with better specs won't be announced in the next 6 to 12 months then you don't follow the camera industry. 

My comments aren't because I'm a Canon hater, they're because it's an average release with one standout feature. The R7 is a better option, and I gave Canon credit on this forum when it was announced. 

If you're fine spending $1500 on a camera that lacks IBIS, has only one card slot, terrible battery life, poor ergonomics, etc. because it has full frame 4K60p then cool. But your opinion is no more valid than mine. 

What ergonomic issue has this camera I don't get it? Compare it to your pointed out R7 it misses only 1 joystick that for video is not super useful compared to the touch screen. I have R5 and R5c and I use the joystick rarely and only for photo. 
So please enlighten me on the poor ergonomics....? or maybe is not too bad that is so small and lightweight that you can use it in smaller gimbal..

IBIS, I wrote so much about the issue that it has at least on Canon cameras that I'm tired to repeat but the summary is Canon IBIS is bad <30mm and if you turn it off you lose lens IS, great between 30-100 especially on non IS lenses, and not useful > 100mm and counterproductive on long lens 400+500mm. What canon needs to do is an IBIS that you can physically fully block while keeping lens IS on.... until then is mix bag....

You are so obsess with one stand out feature but the R8 has many not seen at this price point, FF + great AF + 4k 24 super sampled + 10 bit log + good rolling shutter. I ask you one more time can you point me out another FF camera in the same price range even without your standout 4k super sampled 60? But yes in 6 to 12 months XYZ will have it all + IBIS and for 100$ less so no point in buying this.... or you are one that says great AF is useless as ARRI does not have it 😁, FF is overrated, super sampling what is for I watch on a phone only, but whiteout IBIS is carp as ARRI is 😁. I'm sure you will come with the argument that but XYZ used it has.... but you know what if you keep waiting the R8 will be sold used 😁

So R7 not full frame, really bad RS 32ms!!, no super sampled 50/60p, it is a much better release because it has IBIS and longer battery.... and yes I forget the famous joystick 😉

They are both very good camera for the price but you are not happy that other people are happy with the R8... is a bit sad... it is more than fine that you don't find it a great release but why asking other to stop being happy or praising....  "To be clear, it's not an awful release, but let's stop praising Canon because they're doing more than the bare minimum finally" 

If keep waiting for what comes next makes you happy good for you, but life is too short for keep waiting and complaining ; 😉 .... 

13 hours ago, herein2020 said:

 

I guess I just look at it the other way, I don't consider the crop sensor to be a compromise at all and I use it with FF glass every day; in fact, I did not buy a single new lens for the R7, even my EF-S glass works with it.  I actually consider it a strength since it produces identical IQ as the R5 up to 3200ISO, but with better battery life, better IBIS, and better heat handling.

What I do consider a much bigger compromise is the single card slot, worse ergonomics, no IBIS, etc of the R8 just because it is a FF sensor.

I do agree, no matter who this camera appeals to; consumers win in the end with more choice.

I thinks R7 vs R8 is a much harder call.... R8 has FF, much better rolling shutter 15 vs 30ms "to be confirmed", 4k 60 super sampled but no IBIS and lame battery, maybe worst ergonomics but smaller and lighter.... R7 has IBIS and S35 if you need reach or want to use APS-C lenses but line skipping 4k 60 and pretty severe rolling shutter in HQ.

The good news that they are both available so people can pick the one that fits their needs the most.