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GH5 all-i 400Mbs vs ipb 150Mbs frames comparison:


Vesku
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12 hours ago, jonpais said:

@Vesku I can’t, and I’d like to do a double blind test with those who believe otherwise. All this motion cadence talk makes me fall on the floor doubled over with laughter! One claims Sony has lousy motion cadence, another Panasonic... Not once have I heard a director of photography, when talking about gear, mention motion cadence. The ear is more sensitive to changes in pitch, yet five years and over two hundred videos on YT later, several of which I mistakenly  uploaded at the wrong frame rate, not a single person noticed - not even those in which I was speaking! Lumix GM1 1080p 28 Mbps looks lovely to me too, BTW.

Depends what you're shooting. The way a camera looks when it jitters and shakes will change as well. Running with a bolex or a digital bolex looks awesome, looks absolutely horrible on a 5D. These are all obviously extreme settings but DSLR shake is gross. 

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I think what Vesku is trying to say is that there aren't any demonstrations of the advantages of ALL-I over IPB, just talk. But you can't really prove anything by uploading to YT, since it's no longer ALL-I. I think the answer is, if you've got the GH5, just try shooting with it and editing it yourself. 

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1 hour ago, jonpais said:

I think what Vesku is trying to say is that there aren't any demonstrations of the advantages of ALL-I over IPB, just talk. But you can't really prove anything by uploading to YT, since it's no longer ALL-I. I think the answer is, if you've got the GH5, just try shooting with it and editing it yourself. 

I think I will not use 400Mbs. I am just curious if someone can show the benefits. 

The IQ difference should be easy to show with heavily graded and enlarged YT examples. If not why use 400Mbs for better IQ.

If shooting just normal 8bit 4k it was a surprise that GH5 60P has better IQ than 30P (less compression artifacts and macro blocking).

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57 minutes ago, jonpais said:

@Vesku I haven't watched the video yet, but the only way to judge ALL- I is by downloading the original files, right? When videos are uploaded to YT, they are no longer intraframe compression...

This video has enlarged 400% crops of ipb vs all-i. We should see the differences even with YT ipb quality if there is any. 

It is still silly when many user load examples of their 400Mbs tests using normal YT stream without enlarged or "tortured" examples.

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@Vesku Soon, I'm going to have to suspect you of trolling.... First of all, you've already posted several times that you see no difference between IPB and ALL-I. Repeating the same thing every day ad nauseum makes no sense. Everybody knows that YT changes uploaded videos to interframe compression, so the only way to evaluate the images is by downloading samples. Or, better yet, since you've got the GH5, shoot some samples yourself rather than complaining all the time about what random people upload to YT.

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This kind of reminds me of comparisons between 5D3 H264 and externally recorded ProRes.  People would post Youtube videos and look for minute differences in IQ when it should have been fairly obvious that the most significant advantages of recording externally to ProRes were seen in workflow and processing.  Of course, it seems like today's NLEs/CPUs are much more capable of working with long GOP footage than they were a few years ago.

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15 hours ago, hmcindie said:

Less compression usually means more noise. H264 compression smooths out little noises.

Agreed. And it's a good thing.

Both the All-I and Long Gop codec have a beautiful noise structure at -5/-5 sharpening/nr. The 8 Bit codec on ther other hand sucks keeping the fine grain intact and instead leaves you with macroblocking and banding.

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The other Pink Elephant in the room, is that we are approaching the point where any IQ improvement in a camera will become difficult to detect...It's like the days when I was obsessed with sound  systems...constantly needed new speakers or amp or turntable, and the inprovements did not reflect what I was spending on the gear....at some point I started listening to music again instead of my system??...the same is true for these cameras....at some point one has to stop magnifying images  to 400 percent and start doing something with them, or the acquisition becomes about the camera, instead of the content you create with it! There are some guys on DVXUser going through exactly the same quandary with the EVA1 now...the IQ is very good to my eye....the mount is a deal breaker...but these guys keep looking for more footage...and complaining about everything they see, while others are already shooting with the cam...I really believe we're close to the saturation point, where ergonomics, or the lenses you own or whether you light or not, informs which  camera you choose.

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Y

25 minutes ago, Fritz Pierre said:

The other Pink Elephant in the room, is that we are approaching the point where any IQ improvement in a camera will become difficult to detect...It's like the days when I was obsessed with sound  systems...constantly needed new speakers or amp or turntable, and the inprovements did not reflect what I was spending on the gear....at some point I started listening to music again instead of my system??...the same is true for these cameras....at some point one has to stop magnifying images  to 400 percent and start doing something with them, or the acquisition becomes about the camera, instead of the content you create with it! There are some guys on DVXUser going through exactly the same quandary with the EVA1 now...the IQ is very good to my eye....the mount is a deal breaker...but these guys keep looking for more footage...and complaining about everything they see, while others are already shooting with the cam...I really believe we're close to the saturation point, where ergonomics, or the lenses you own or whether you light or not, informs which  camera you choose.

Yep - been there in hi-fi myself. You can get to the point where you are more interested in the 'reproduction of sound' than the music. You stop when you realise that you don't need perfect fidelity to appreciate amazing music. Then again that is essentially what ' the hi-fi world' is about and it's not necessarily a music thing.......

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