Super8

My bad. I thought they were for the Z-mount.

30 minutes ago, Trek of Joy said:

Plus there will be no Zeiss, Tamron or Sigma lenses for the Zed mount anytime soon. I'll stick with the known quantity for now and reassess in a couple years when their next gen cameras are out and the lens lineup is more comprehensive with (hopefully) 3rd party support.

Sigma does make lenses for the Z mount.  And reviews say they work great.

https://www.sigmaphoto.com/lenses/standard-lenses?sigma_format=7063&sigma_mount=12003

14 minutes ago, Eric Calabros said:

Very unlikely. Nikon tends to pay the least amount of money for license fees. 

Nikon never really upgraded items through firmware either. 

They already paid one for Pro Res RAW.   It kinda defeats the purpose of getting the Pro Res RAW license.

The market in 2020 is dictating 4K60P.  Nikon didn't follow the market with 4K 10bit external.   I don't follow your logic about Nikon's decision making process.   2018 said they were thinking differently.

9 minutes ago, Trek of Joy said:

I have used the Z6, before the big update, it was ok but nothing that would make me want to drop the a73 or a7r3 and buy into the Z-mount.

This is weird because image quality and color should be a big issues for content creators that do what we do.   Apparently not for a lot of people.

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Seems like they're still trying to not step on their DSLR's with their mirrorless lineup and they're not accelerating new model cycles when everyone else is. They're getting left behind.

More false information

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The raw video update was a complete blunder and didn't help their cause at all. If it was going to be a couple hundred dollars and require you to ship them the camera, they should have been up front about it instead of teasing it for a year and a half then dropping the bomb.

The RAW update was messed up.  Nikon missed how they should have marketed that.  They were also late, very late.   I still don't know the quality upgrade you from Nikon RAW since it skips lines or whatever and it not a full sensor readout.

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They were too late to the game.

They are not too late to the game.  This is another Sony You Tube brainwash.   You have GH5 users, Nikon DSLR users and a lot of other creators that are ready to jump to FF. 

Quote

I'm not giving Sony a free pass, but I'm still buying the camera and will work around its flaws, just like every other camera I've owned.

You kinda are giving them a free pass.  It human nature to do this for a brand you love.  But be honest, how do you fix Sony color issues with the A7S3 ?  The color issues seem to be worse than the previous models.

57 minutes ago, Danyyyel said:

And work in harsh tropical conditions with very hard light, high temperatures and monsoon rains. Until now zero shutdown or any malfunctions. From all the Nikon bodies this is my most preferred body, at worst I keep it in its cage even for photos As I prefer a little bit larger bodies. Because it serves me so well in photos also even when I worked on Film set as set photographer, shooting between it and d810, I had no problem thinking I was looking in an actual viewfinder.

 

 

 

Is that your footage?  Good work if so.

My prediction for Nikon is 4K60p 10bit internal.   120p external and full sensor readout RAW external.    They already have great AF in photo's and video.  They already have great color science and great glass. 

49 minutes ago, BTM_Pix said:

Erm....yes, that is precisely what it does so there is absolutely no falsehood involved.

There is a TempStatus property in the firmware that causes the camera to react in various scaled responses.

These are :

• Normal
• Warning Indicator
• Reduced Frame Rate
• Live View Prohibited
• Shooting Prohibited
• Degraded Still Image Quality
• Restriction Of Video Recording

At some point, all of these different responses will be triggered if the temperature begins to increase.

The reason the different record times and behaviours are seen by different "testers" is that the temperature of their camera is different so different ones are being triggered at different rates but at some point they will all trigger.

This status is externally readable on the camera so Canon could easily provide the simple test tool to these "testers" to create a real structured test instead of the scattergun ad hoc ones that are happening now.

I have got no idea why Canon continue to let these unstructured random tests play out in public without doing something official about it.

The only reason I can come up with is that the noise generated by these contradictory "findings" is giving them cover while they work away in the background to remedy it.

The TempStatus pre-dates the R5/R6 and has been part of the Canon firmware for a long time and is there for a reason for that so none of this is new for them in testing so it begs the question why more seemingly wasn't done to test it in simulated real environments.

 

Of course.  I agree with your breakdown of Canon's tempstatus. property.   What's being reported is the R5 is not overheating by temperature but being controlled by Canon's cripple hammer software that shuts down the camera based on record times so that they protect their cine line-up.

6 hour delays is not a "firmware or Canon cripple hammer feature".    Running with this information as fact and shouting from the rooftops is negative hit piece fan boy miss information.  I could repeat it 100 times on Facebook if I disliked Canon.  This is what is done and what causes camera companies to go under.   So pick your sides I guess on who you support.  I can't stand Sony because of the culture they create.  It's the CNN of journalism.  Report the news, do a good job at that, opinion pieces become a problem because people take opinion for fact.

I have seen some really great looking S1H footage this weekend.   Hope everyone is doing well in whatever part of the world you live.  Cheers.

16 minutes ago, Emanuel said:

Seems crippled by the firmware in order to protect their high-end, so let's be optimistic they will stop to be jerks and give us what the technology is able for to begin with. This cat-mouse game does NOT dignify the brand.

As good customer of theirs (aside cameras, we are currently using a C500 in a feature film + three short films to be shot in Santander, Spain and I still have 2x units of a large format printer as workhorses, let alone another half-dozen of Canon units around), I expect a change.

No it's not the firmware causing the issue.  Do you really think firmware would cause cameras to stop recording at 17minutes with an overheating icon warning and then go 21 minutes for someone else. 

Let's stop this rumor and false statement from spreading NOW.

In this thread the S1H, R5 and A7S3 are all given outside temp readings and they are all around the same temp except the S1H comes in with the lowest temp.  

You wonder how hit marketing works, now you know. 

How many cameras disguised heat issues with recording limits or recording externally.   If Canon can give 30min solid record times with quick recovery times then no one should have an issue with the R5.

3 hours ago, Zeng said:

Amateurish af on z6? I don’t know why this myth continues. AF in video mode is actually excellent. And native s lenses don’t breath (almost). Strangely, Nikon somewhat showed they really cared and understood the needs of video shooters, and then sort of left things in the middle of the road. Lenses need linear focus mode as an option (was mentioned they were to get it, but when?), z6 was the first with prores raw, but the wait was too long, processor appeared to be too weak (they had to compromise it a bit with pixel binning, although the quality is still great), internal rec was just 8bit. Could they fix all this with z6s? Somehow they don’t know how to market their products. Z6 is a much better product than is presented on youtube, etc.

You are 100% correct.  The Z6 is much better than what's portrayed on YouTube.  People on the EOS don't know what they're missing.  It's all marketing.  This is what I hate about Sony marketing.  It's to the point that it's false and hyped up.  It's great for the Sony side but it takes down a company like Nikon.  That's the dishonest part.  Have people lie about the Z6 camera so it has a poor reputation.

Nikon pushed the limits of video quality that we expected, no reason they won't do it again.

1 hour ago, Trek of Joy said:

I'm with you. Still waiting for that unicorn to appear, for a brief second the R5 was it and I had one that would have been delivered Thursday. Then it literally went down in flames. Given that we really won't see anything significant for another couple of years now that Canon has gone all-in with the R5/6, Nikon is drunk and passed out with the rumored Z6s/7s, all Sony has left is the a7IV which will be hit with the cripple hammer compared to the a7s3, and nobody else is making significant headway - I've accepted the fact that the one camera hybrid solution isn't happening anytime soon. One body will shoot mostly stills, one mostly video, lots of lens changes, and lots of damn sensor swabs since Sony's 3rd/4th gen cams attract dust like no other camera I've used. Holy shit the a73/a7r3's are a dust magnet compared to the a7r2/s2 I carried across six continents!

Anyway, needing to go two cameras means I've ordered the a7s3 and I'm now looking to shift my a7r3 to a a7r4 so AF and accessories are mirrored (pun intended) between the two with grips, underwater housings and so on. This will cover me for the next 2-3 years until someone gets it right in the next round of updates.

Cheers

Chris

Nikon is hardly drunk and passed out.  They produced a better camera than anything Sony has released so far (the A7S3 is not out yet).  This tells you how far Sony brainwash has seeped into the cine world.  You can't argue AF / No AF or BM IR pollution / color science and then give Sony a free pass on everything above.  People talk about Nikon full sensor read out Pro Res RAW external and get caught up in line skip binning / recording to Atomos or whatever but then Sony gets a pass on external RAW. We talk about image quality, color science and Sony gets a pass. You can't always fix Sony color, in fact you can't fix Sony color.  Sony does not produce a NR FREE, sharpened FREE cinematic moving image.  Sony does great PR and marketing and this is evident in the You Tube producers that we dismiss but now look to for reassurance that the Sony A7S3 is better than the Canon R5 because it records longer before over heating.  Everyone has forgot the R5 does 8K RAW internally.  At the end of the day the best produced image wins. 

And here's another one.    You're missing the point.

https://petapixel.com/2019/11/01/canon-patent-shows-detachable-fan-for-cooling-1d-x-like-dslr-through-the-viewfinder/

25 minutes ago, Cliff Totten said:

For all the people that believe that Cine camcorder markets and mirrorless markets don't overlap. I'm a perfect example that the DO. I sold my Sony FS7 and was literally 2 days away from buying a Panasonic EVA-1. Then Lumix announced the S1H and that stopped be cold in my tracks. I wound up buying the S1H instead and I'm perfectly happy about replacing my FS7 and (almost) EVA-1 with the S1H. I pre-ordered the A7S-III because I want one of my cameras to have PDAF and will add it as B-cam to my S1H. 

The rumored Sony FX6? Sounded tempting at first....but with the A7S-III, I no longer have any use for an FX6.

Yeah...the mirror less and pro camcorder markets DO overlap....substantially.

How dose your S1H footage the FS7 ?  And where do you think the A7S3 will line up to the S1h ?  I'm asking this because you're mixing two different color theories into the mix. 

Cine camcorder DP's haven't crossed over is the issue.   It seems like you have a few that use mirror-less with cine cams but if given the choice their going for cine cams. 

2 hours ago, Trek of Joy said:

Nobody is buying the a7s3 or a Pocket 4k for that matter to shoot the next season of Ozark. 

 

Right because they can't use the A7S3 or Pocket4K to shoot Ozark because they're not Netflix approved.  

If your work will never be considered for Netflix then invest in the A7S3 or Pocket4K all day.  

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As to the a7s3, if you need reliable AF, cameras like the Zcams, the Blackmagic's and likely the S1h are not something people are considering, its a completely different type of camera and shooting experience. Nothing is ever going to change that until they have reliable AF. 

The S1H is relevant.  I have issues with the AF on the S1H but my guess is it's not as bad as people make it out to be.  I need to rent the camera and find out for myself.

In that Sony footage I'm seeing pink faces in some scenes and Florida tan faces in other scenes with the same people.

Didn't BMP4K and Sony's A7III all sell out after their first shipment release?

It should be easy to find out if B&H received fewer R5 / R6 than originally promised. 

24 minutes ago, Emanuel said:

I see lot of people have a romanticized idea how the distribution or the film production is made.

One thing is the 'Originals' label, the other one is the content previously produced.

 

If you're luck enough the aggregator you hired got success to gather their interest, they will hardly care about the technical specs of your piece other than how you'll deliver it to them.

That's the quality of the craft they're looking for, definitely not the camera.

 

It's just strictly from a geek option route starting cult.

Any reality to back it? Makes little sense to none.

It depends on the content being delivered and what they're paying.

If you're pitching an original series like Stranger Things then your A7SIII is not going to cut it.   If you go in an pitch an original idea with 100% original content then no you can't get away with my "idea is great" so I'll shot with an unapproved camera.  

You're talking about a mix of original in the can content that can't be reshot and new content mixed in.    This is classic Tiger King content. 

So yes you have already created original content vs to be created original content.  

The reality is Netflix has it's approved camera list.  In your next pitch to Netflix you can ask them how bogus it really is.  I'll let you know how my pitch goes also.

8 minutes ago, Emanuel said:

In Netflix, their executives look for pictures from aggregators who pitch the content, not cameras.

This is not-variably just a mere fuss from a bunch of camera geeks, who keep dreaming to be the next discovery to be found directly within their catalogue.

It's called being prepared.   If you shoot new original content for a Netflix pitch and you use the A7SIII you'll look like an idiot when they ask for production specs.  Netflix camera list is a form of quality control so Netflix doesn't look like You Tube.

Just now, Nezza said:

Has somebody somewhere made a pilot for netflix using this camera. I'm sure they have. Do the vast vast majority of netflix prods use a prosumer body with a tiny screen and limited lens line up as their cam. Absolutely not. I'd stop digging.

Watch Mark Holtze video.  You can adapt glass to the S1H.  Also being Netflix approved makes the S1H a cine camera.  Yeah it's hard to figure out because it is a hybrid but don't slag the facts about the camera.   Also, if productions have the money they'll use what the DP prefers. 

A buddy was on a Ace Hardware shoot and you wouldn't believe how much wasted money they spend on a 5 day shoot.  They spent close to a million on traditional a tv commercial.

4 minutes ago, newfoundmass said:

What's your name? Resume? 

I really do think @Andrew Reid should require people that talk like this to use their real names so we can judge how much credibility we should give what they say.

Not this again? 

Use your eyes and ears and brain and judge footage first.  Then get into spec's and defend what you see and hear.   We are film makers and content creators and for some reason we ignore the image a camera produces over what brand it is.  

I'm willing to give any camera brand a chance if it produces a great image. 

10 minutes ago, newfoundmass said:

 

Mark Holtze is using a S1H and vintage lenses for a Netflix pilot right now. 

Thanks for posting this video.  Mark makes a compelling point for the S1H for Netflix production quality without making a pitch.

The S1H being Netflix approved is actually great.  You can invest in a Netflix approved camera for a lot less money which is needed in some productions.

Seems like internal recording to Atomos is going to be the thing now.  

2 hours ago, luizhmgoncalves said:

Yes, these EOS R5 footage looks incredible.
I only use the ACES CLog conversion, no grading at all, and already looks fantastic.

Really wish someone upload some nice footage from the A7s 3 like that one, so we can play with it.
And hope that Canon come up with something that doesn't take 5 years to do.
At least sony throw their best codecs into a mirrorless.

But for now I will keep my pocket 4k.
Its not full frame but colors and codecs are really nice to work with.
 

Not fair.......lol

1 hour ago, SteveV4D said:

That last comment sounds like sour grapes.  What a shame Netflix didn't seek your opinion before approving the S1H. 😂😂

I'm talking about image quality you see as the final product.   It's an honest question, right? 

I need to see comparable S1H image quality to the R5 before I by off on the S1H.  Right now S1H footage looks like S1 and Z6 footage.  Same sensor with the same image quality.  If I invest in the S1H I don't want it to be because of paper specs.  I'm still doing my homework on the S1H and maybe Pro Res RAW is the answer I'm looking for.   I don't really understand why it's not the preferred camera with Canon and Sony coming up short with the R5 and A7SIII.  

56 minutes ago, Nezza said:

I'm referring to those blinkered biased, completely unobjective camera fanboys who will give their camera company of choice a complete free pass and make excuses for camera companies shitty decisions. Decisions that impact customers shelling out thousands of $ of their hard earned on flawed product.

If you've actually read my other posts you'd see I actually prefer Canon more broadly over Sony. If the R6 worked as advertised I'd highly likely be buying one. So you couldn't actually be more wrong in your assertion. I'm a Panny shooter at the moment, I have zero brand allegiance and would consider any of the usual suspects. These are just tools.
   

I think you'll find Canon is doing a pretty good job of that themselves. By 'hit pieces' you mean reporting the actual flaws.

How do you know the R6 doesn't work as advertised?  What released R6 has been reviewed that was false advertising?

Both cameras (Canon and Sony) are not reliable pro cameras.  If this was being reported it would be fair.  

10 minutes ago, Nezza said:

This is the problem. Canon marketed it as a video camera from the outset.

The canboys shout 'But, but, but stills!'

Sure it's an excellent stills camera but that's not how it was sold. Canon shouted about 8K from the rooftops.

The level of hate towards Canon and Canon fans is astoundingly obvious with you.    This is my issue with the negative hit piece articles and people making it their life goal to hurt Canon sales.   I understand giving fair warning about Canon overheating issues but to push Sony color, bad NR and the S1H think color look over what Canon offers is weak. 

The S1H seems like the files are thin, the color is thin and lacking real depth.  This is apparent with S1H - RAW to Atomos samples.  You have more detail, better color depth and a color shift to normal with S1H Pro Res RAW footage.  It seems like the S1H is wrapped up in spec only like the Gh5.  Isn't the S1H sensor the same as the S1 and Z6?  I have no clue how it's Netflix approved.