Video Hummus

31 minutes ago, independent said:

Wow. Industry disrupting actually. Nikon stole the competitive advantage of Red’s ridiculous patent. I’m wondering how fast they can implement this—how much time I have to liquidate my canon gear. 

A few years. I have been disappointed with Canon’s third party lens fiasco, lack of mid-range quality L-glass, and some other things. My R5C is sold off. I kept the R5 for photos but might sell that off.

It says “wholly-owned subsidiary” of Nikon. So my guess is key technology will trickle from Red to Nikon (global shutter sensors, raw compression on high end Nikon gear, etc…) Red probably continue to do what they do but with Z-mount ecosystem integration.

I also wonder if this is a way for Nikon to break free from Sony Semi-conductor in a way with global sensor technology, which seems to be the direction the industry is going. 

Big moves against Canon. This has to be related in someway to the settlement as it was extremely hush-hush.

The corporate culture couldn’t be more different between the companies. Very interesting. I think they will be run separate with some co-branding happening here and there and of course technology sharing.

Red fanboy panties will be twisted hard if Nikon is slapped on their camera. 

I have the R5C and the R5 and I prefer the R5C setup over the always on IBIS in the R5 for video. At least with the RF 24-70 the OIS + EIS combo has worked amazingly well for hand held static and controlled handheld pans and tilts in my experience.

IBIS wobble is horrible. I come to really notice it and hate it.

10 hours ago, gt3rs said:

In what settings?

Fully charged lp-e6nh in XF-AVC shows 67min 

LP-E6NH give me on average about 30-35 minutes of actual record time with occasional waveform and false color usage, 4K XF-AFC, Continuous AF, Lens IS. If you are running and gunning you can use the media button hack and extend standby battery life considerably probably even more if you flick the IS Off on the lens as well.

On 7/28/2022 at 1:37 PM, Ty Harper said:

Anyone on here with R5C experience that can tell me how the battery life compares to say a 5D MKIII?

It sucks ass.

- A R5C owner

I enjoy using the camera though and just carry 3x more batteries with me than if using just my R5. You can rig and shoot for hours but I don't like using cables if I don't have too. I would have gotten a C70 but would prefer FF with RF glass I have.

On 7/22/2022 at 5:25 PM, Andrew Reid said:

So it was a fake timer then.

It seems so. Kinda shady, for sure. Although the camera and cards become really hot. I would say the CFExpress becomes so hot it can cause burns if taken out of the camera too fast.

On 7/22/2022 at 8:32 AM, PannySVHS said:

R5 in 8K RAW has less latitude in the shadows than a Lumix S5 in downsampled 4K, has half the battery life, triple the price of the S5. Worlds best camera it is not, though for your needs it might be of course. But that I wouldnt be able to know, of course.:) Now let´s test the camera running in the sun of current climate change days. I bet it will not look good, since the hardware is the same, with lack of any kind of sufficient cooling. @FHDcrew

Class leading latitude in the shadows by the Lumix S5. R5 has impressive resolution and looks great up to ETTR -5.

I would say the R5 does respectably well for a 45MP FSI sensor compared to those other cameras in that test. S5 definitely is a goat, if you don't need reliable video AF.

I really, really want a XC15 style camera with internal ND and a newer 1" sensor with 10-bit CLOG3. If they could improve the lens and make it a 24-240 f/2.8-4...I think it would be a killer little "bridge" cinema camera for pretty much anything.

I have a R5C and I have been enjoying the 3K s16 RAW mode on the RF 24-70 and especially on the RF 70-200. But honestly it renewed my crazy want for a new XC style camera even more.

Fuck it. I'm going to rent a XC10 next month and pretend its what I want 🙂

7 hours ago, KnightsFan said:

They just applied existing algorithms to bayer data, the way photo cameras did, instead of RGB data.

This is it.

All the other language about "greater than 23fps" and "4K or higher" or "internal, visually lossless" is all written to broaden the patent intentionally as a, in my opinion, blatant "idea" smash and grab.

They only came up with a method and instead they got a patent for essentially: "visually lossless compressed bayer data in a camera at greater than 23fps and 4K and up resolution".

Ford invented a novel form of locomotion via a box ("vehicle") with 4 or more wheels, powered by an internal combustion engine (as described in prior patent XYZ), moving at speeds greater than 23mph.

Ford is calling it a "motorized vehicle" and will sue anybody that tries to use wheels and internal combustion engines to go faster than 23mph.

Looks like their new LiDAR device on the top of that picture.

I was actually interested in a Pocket 3 for various things. It does so much better than a GoPro/Action in lower light conditions since it stabilizes with a gimbal and not electronically with fast shutter.

My guess if there is a pocket 3 it will have the Mini 3 Pro sensor and gimbal.

I only see LUMIX surviving if they implement PDAF on par with Olympus or better. That is the bottom line. It's 2022 and every camera out there worth a damn is track focusing fairly well (except Fujifilm).

I always wondered what exactly Leica contributed to the L-mount alliance except for the mount. They jointly (perhaps) help with development of the LUMIX PL lenses but beyond that Leica SL and SL2 internals are all from Panasonic with the color engine done by Leica.

Perhaps Leica agrees to invest more of their profit from their $7000 re-skinned S1R into the alliance going forward. 

ProRes internal is great momentum going forward. Seems like more and more companies are adding it.

IBIS looks like it is not the best even just static hand holding. Not sure what is going on there.

I've seen a lot of people complain about CF Express being expensive in reviews. You can get a Angelbird 512GB card that will handle 8K for $179. Prograde 256GB SD card is 62% more expensive for half the space.

Prograde 256 SD   = $1.12/GB
Angelbird 512 CFX = 0.34/GB
Angelbird 1TB CFX = 0.48/GB
Angelbird 2TB CFX = 0.48/GB
Angelbird 4TB CFX = 0.45/GB

4 hours ago, mercer said:

I honestly don't understand how people who create things get angry with a company that created something and want to protect their work.

If you went online and found someone on YouTube that decided to use one of your videos and put their name on it, I'm sure you would flag it.

That's entirely different to a highly nuanced technology discussion.

11 hours ago, Andrew Reid said:

It may sound excessively broad now, but someone has to be first with the round wheels and going over 50mph.

Not defending RED, just think there is probably a valid reason why Graeme's work keeps beating a lot of big companies in expensive patent lawsuits.

Where was the almighty Sony in 2005 with their lossless compressed RAW codec?

I'm not doubting the work of Graeme's work. Patent the hell out of it. But they can't claim they have exclusive rights to "'visually lossless' compressed data derived from raw, stored in camera memory at greater than 23 fps."

Precisely define visually lossless. Precisely define "in-camera". Precisely define "data". RAW Bayer CFA? What is stopping Fuji from using its X-Trans sensor layout (not bayer) and doing the same thing? Can they sue Fuji for that? Does RED's patent apply to every possible sensor layout not invented by them because they have patents over words like "camera", "raw", "data", "compression"?

There are lots of patents for data compression 'methodologies', which is what Graeme's work truly is, as applied to cameras. He did not invent "camera", "raw", "data", or "compression", or "greater than 23fps capture".

35 minutes ago, TomTheDP said:

RED is sometimes used on big production

So I guess dealing with 1:1 4.6K RAW is worth it over using a RED camera just for the compressed RAW.

I have no problem with RED's innovation and them making money off it and protecting it. 

However, the way that patent is written is complete and utter bullshit. It's like someone claiming they have exclusive rights to any vehicle using round wheels going over 50mph.  It's excessively broad.

If RED's compressed RAW matters so much why is everybody who has the money shooting on ARRI cameras?

On 2/24/2022 at 11:07 PM, newfoundmass said:

Things seem so bleak right now. 

yeah.

23 hours ago, sanveer said:

So it isn't a Sony sensor for a change(?). It wouldn't be TowerJazz Semiconductor/ Tower Semi, I am guessing, either. Like someone on some rumours blog suggested (photorumors/ 43rumors?), it's probably an ONSemi sensor.

There isn't any 25MP MFT sensor leak or Information of any kind. Usually there is some kind of Sony product paper out there. So my guess was it could be manufactured by Canon. Why? It's most probably BSI and it has a form of DGO of some derivative. Unless Canon isn't manufacturing their own BSI sensors? Is the sensor in the R3 a Canon manufactured sensor or Sony (there were rumors they were perhaps having Sony do the fab)?

On Semi doesn't have any 4/3 sensors listed on their product page. I doubt they are the provider.

That leaves Samsung as a possibility.

10 hours ago, Davide DB said:

BTW this guy tests and uses a bunch of gear but basically he is a Sony A7 guys. 

Well, by his own admission, GH6 images are way better under most conditions. While images sucks for both cameras at 6400 already, GH6 surrenders to A7SIII at ISO 12800.

Repeat with me: I - S - O  1 - 2 - 8 - 0 - 0

my question is: who shoot at ISO 12800?

Hereafter some bookmarks for GH6 Vs A7SIII:

• 9:05 onwards GH6 resolution is better.
• 15:20 onwards ISO test. GH6 wins hands down up to ISO 6400.
• 27:00 onwards DR test. Again GH6 is better.

I feel like the A7SIII was hyped to the max but it honestly performs pretty badly between its native ISOs. Kinda weak codec mushy stuff as well. Side by side against the GH6 it looks like crap as far as useable detail. GH6 has the detail without being over-sharp looking. Honestly, the image looks pretty damn good. I wish it had better AF because it would be on my shortlist.

What in the actual fuck

2 minutes ago, mercer said:

One of my next purchases is an M1 Mac... I cannot wait. Do you have a MacBook Pro?

M1, M1 Pro, and M1 Max will eat H265 all day everyday. It's basically a non-issue for those computers. Just get as much RAM as you can afford.

1 hour ago, newfoundmass said:

Is it impossible to do DfD without the pulsing back and forth? Because even if they could just eliminate that, they'd go a LONG way with their critics when it comes to AF.

By definition Depth from Defocus (DfD) achieves focus by this pulsing of focus. I’m not sure you can completely eliminate it…except for…you know…using phase detection instead.

45 minutes ago, Roger said:

Interesting answer on the autofocus question by Panasonic's Matt Frazer.

Matt also had good answers on the livestream about how the fan is engineered. The fan doesn’t have a traditional motor and drive shaft but instead uses magnets to spin the fan from inside the case without any connection. Pretty neat.

5 minutes ago, PPNS said:

also expecting internal prores raw is goofy.

Why? It has hardware in it to do ProRes encoding. Not that much of a stretch to think ProRes RAW is in there too.

6 minutes ago, PPNS said:

has anyone tried to make anything resembling something a well lit and good looking short?

11 minutes ago, Caleb Genheimer said:

I know Gerald is apparently in vogue as the reviewer to bash, but honestly I got a lot more from his preview than from the others I watched (including Media Division).

 

1. He had that shot out a window that clearly and concisely showed the impact of engaging DR Boost

 

2. He whacked the camera around to show how good the RS performs

 

3. Sure, his “is dead” statement is clickbaity, but heck, he laments even having to drop a video at embargo lift. He knows what he’s doing, it’s just how it has to be done to a certain extent, and most importantly, if you pay attention to his justification for personally declaring that, HE’S RIGHT.

 

Anyone who follows sensor tech and the signal processing along with it will recognize that he gave grounded reasons. For what it is, the performance is incredible, but they can’t cheat the physics of smaller sensors. I think the GH6 will serve many serious creators well, just like every other GH before it, but we’re now at a juncture where Panasonic has larger sensors in the game as an alternative. On paper, I think what most (if not all) the reviewers have missed though is its strengths versus the S-Series, which fill in some (not all) gaps, making it a VERY attractive B-Cam. Most importantly, they’ve managed full V-Log, so matching should be a breeze. And secondly, where DR is M4/3’s Achilles Heel, RS is Full Frame’s! The GH6 has piles of VERY high quality HFR AND low rolling Shutter. 
 

If you have an S-Series body, and need a second camera, I think the GH6 adds more flexibility to your arsenal than a second S-Series body would.

I think he kinda missed the entire point.

It is fine to compare it to a FF camera competitor. I don't have a problem with that.

It is however kinda like comparing a compact suped up Hatchback to a sports car. Sure, it won't be as fast and have a bigger engine but people still really enjoy driving the hatchback for many reasons and thats the entire fucking point!

I honestly think the tone of the video was very weird. He was lamenting that a MFT camera wasn't a FF camera. He wasn't excited at all that a MFT camera could keep up with FF. He didn't even touch on the subject of what this kind of tech in a FF Panasonic camera could do. It was just this odd, apparently painful, review of a product. Why didn't he just objectively review it like all his other product reviews?

I think the ending was just painful to watch. Claiming MFT is dead FOR HIM and then titling his video with LAST MFT camera is just fucking ridiculous from Gerald and flys in the face of all his other great videos that don't have shitty clickbait titles like this one. I mean, what was he expecting?...The GH6 to fold out a FF sensor with 15 stops of dynamic range to best the mighty A7SIII?

Potato Jet did a much better job of just showing footage and comparing it to other cameras with excitement and objectivity. Gene was pretty excited it kept up with a A7SIII, which is amazing for a sensor that small.

Will I buy this camera? Probably not right now. But kudos to Panasonic for basically improving on almost all aspects of the GH5, including that damn DfD AF. It looks like they revamped the entire imaging pipeline from hardware to video file.

• Way better screen design
• Better lowlight
• Better highlight retention with DR boost (looks like a respectable 11.5 stops in H265 modes).
• Internal ProRes! (and I suspect ProRes RAW in future firmware)
• Improved IBIS performance in video (it looks damn good without very little wobble)
• Ability to punch-in zoom while recording
• 200 FPS in FHD with autofocus without VFR
• 48 FPS

I'm sure I'm missing a few. If it had PDAF I would be considering the GH6 over something like the R5C for sure.

1 hour ago, newfoundmass said:

I'm not as knowledgeable about sensors as a lot of folks are, but could it possibly be Samsung? Or is that dumb/unlikely?

I mean Samsung could be one of the few companies to make something like this. I'm not sure though. Hopefully someone with some knowledge can clear it up.

Also, in the official Lumix launch video Matt was talking about in the USA they will be offering free CFExpress Cards with preorders. He was very specific about telling people that the cards will support all recording formats (so it isn't some cheap card) and all FUTURE recording formats that are coming and he was hinting that there was more to come. He also misspoke about being able to shoot ProRes RAW and then caught himself.

I honestly think this camera is going to get Internal ProRes RAW recording in firmware update down the line.