Alt Shoo

This is not 2008 anymore. 4K is 4K, I don't care what the hell it is shot on. The average person doesn't even know what the hell DR even is. 3/4 the people on here acts like Netflix is going to pick them up. Good luck with that happening. Shoot something, anything with anything and be happy.  You have in your pants pocket 90% of what you ever need camera wise. Made it so. Jesus like a bunch of little kids on here. OHH I'm going to buy this, no I am going to buy that. Ohh I will wait until next year when the Panasonic FF comes out, Yeah right. They haven't made a camera in the last 6 years you can't make a feature movie with, including a Smartphone. Make it so. You can buy Cine cameras you could only dream of for less money now than most of there new Mirrorless stuff is. Make it so. This whole forum is turned into a QVC shopping channel.  Shoot something, Christ.

I can see in-camera gimbals making a revolution at some point. Sod camcorders

Here are some screen grabs from a project I worked on using the Z Cam E1. This camera actually has the same sensor as the GH4. 

@kye
 
In relation to @thebrothersthree comment about the title of this thread, I replied with this: 
As you can see, in context, I used the word 'many' in "many seem to agree". Also, "is this the way things are going" is also a fairly general term. How did you take this so personally? If you did, I have no qualms in apologising so, I'm sorry if you felt personally attacked. 
My question was, are people who expect 'cinematic' images really too lazy to focus a camera or use some kind of support because these contribute to the 'cinematic' look just as much as IQ (and lighting). 
 
 
 
I mean the point of this thread is not to critique any individual shot and tell you how you could have achieved similar without IBIS. If you do want personal critique, PM me and I'll happily give you some other ideas if you so wish.
Exactly, there will be a lot of users here that come to this site for information on purchasing a camera who might be new to the whole game. Your advice that a particular camera is 'useless' because it doesn't have AF or IBIS gives false information in two ways. It suggests that you can't shoot good images unless you have both those features and it suggests that those two features will ensure that all your footage comes out rock solid and sharp.
I'm here to provide some context in that if you want to really use a cinema camera (or even mirrorless camera) well, and get great shots out of it, be prepared to use a monopod/ tripod or similar and be prepared to learn how to focus manually if you really want to further your skills. While AF is great, it can hunt around if it can't decide what to focus on and no one wants to see AF hunt in a 'cinematic' video. 

Calm down Kye I wasn't calling you lazy if that is what has made you aggressive. I was talking in a general term.
You could have shot that shot differently, who knows, it could have turned out better, or worse. I could list a few different ways you could have got that shot or something very similar without IBIS but that's not the point of the thread. Sometimes limitations cause us to think more creatively.
  Was this a slider shot? It doesn't look like it....but if it was and you pulled it off smoothly, well done.
What I wall say is that while no features on your list is essential to everyone, there are some that are a lot harder to workaround if you don't have them. Ive never had a director or producer say that my camera had to have IBIS or AF, whereas I have had them request we shoot 4K, or 50p or that it had to be a 10bit codec. If your camera can't do it, it's hard to work around that. No not everyone works professionally or on demanding productions, but then Im not the one making black and white statements that a camera is unusable if it doesn't have IBIS or AF.  
Im not here to pick on individual shots, yes IBIS and AF can be useful. I just don't think that a camera without them is unusable and the notion that it is kinda perplexes me hence the thread. Let's not forget that you can add stabilisation via a lens too. Just because it's not in the body, doesn't mean its a bad camera. X-T3, GH5's will still shoot great images and be used successfully by many. 
My FS700 had face detection too. I agree, it's nice to have if implemented well but no DP using a cine camera (as you are referring too) is going to say that an Alexa, Red, F5, Varicam etc are "useless"

Try enabling CineLikeD on the flight deck!

@Alt Shoo Luckily you can read all about it here. It's been posted in some em5ii discussions before.
 
 

It was shot in Zlog at 60 p and I recorded internally but monitored through a BlackMagic Video Assist 4K on a Zhiyun M gimbal.  
The ZCam E1 has all the components a cinematographer needs (besides IBIS). Actually the BBC used the E1 for three years as an in the vehicle camera for “Top Gear”. Truly impressive! I’ll be using two of the E1’s I own for some other projects, but I’m going to start shooting more with the Eva1. I’ve  had it for months and only filmed with it once. I’ve been using the LS300 because it’s just so easy to pick up and go, plus the images I get out of it is one of the best!

That video is the first on my playlist dedicated just to foley videos! Check out my whole playlist:
 
 
https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLoGsUEnlZzUIFJ523qScw8DTzX0xh-yz8
 
It is one of the tougher areas in production sound to make a full time living from. 
But yes, would be fun to do! Would be one of my idle dreams as well to have. 
 

The 1080/60p is really detailed. I noticed that in my test. Upscaling it to 4K works very well.

@Alt Shoo would love to see your footage with your beast:)

While a good camera, personally I’ll forget the Olympus and go with a more feature rich Z Cam E1. Don’t sleep in that little beast of a tool!

That footage looks almost too good to be true. I must admit I never heard of that mod, but I was using ENG cameras at the time, so off my Radar. Just goes to prove how good Raw footage really is. Speaking about Raw footage, My son just got a Canon 5D mk III. Has shoot a little with ML on it yesterday. He was impressed to say the least. Have not been down to his house to see it.

@Alt Shoo The gyls300 has been out for 3 or 4 years. 

If the cost of the XF705 is a bit rich for your blood the new JVC GY-HC500 at half the price (£3395+tax) might be for you. It also has a 1" sensor & can record 4K@50pHDR 4:2:2 10-bit video plus has a 20x power zoom. Interestingly it can record to SSD.
https://www.newsshooter.com/2018/09/11/jvc-gy-hc500-gc550/
https://cvp.com/product/jvc-gy-hc500-connected-cam

I'm interested in these, I'd like for the thread to stay open so we can talk about them as more info emerges / reviews start to trickle in. 
JVC honestly might be the camera company that gives you the most bang for your buck, in terms of features and stuff. My biggest issue with them is their menu system feels ancient and bloated. My LS300 still has the ui of a 90s camcorder and just feels ancient. But I love the picture! 

This camera has no mojo. Imagery bores me. 

Unfortunately my best video can never be released publicly due to a fall out between myself and the band, but that didn't stop me from completing the video and showcasing it for my skills.
Shot on hacked GH2 (Flowmotion) with a set of vintage Nikon AI/AIS lenses. No budget, simple gear and a couple of friends.

PW: MyVersion
 
 

Thanks for the comments. It is basically the Jlog with a tiny push on the colour but hardly anything so I appreciate some may like it and some won't. The full documentary will be done by next year. The audio mix is not me as I would still be here next year trying to get my levels right! I pulled in a favour from my mate who is brilliant sports features editor.
 
cheers

I just found this. If you go to page 12, there's a lot of info on what the LS300 does with the RAW data from the sensor, and the various ways the camera lets you process/record it. However they seem pretty adamant that nobody wants RAW, and say in large red font 'RAW access is NOT needed (or wanted) in the broad-market television world.'
http://pro.jvc.com/pro/pr/2015/nab/JVC_4KCAM_WhitePaper.pdf
Perhaps their stance will change, and they'll add an update once ProRes RAW gets tested properly and is released. It'll then become more accessible and a feature many would look for in cameras of this range.

Just to jump back on the Jlog flatness thing. Here's an interview I shot today as an ungraded and graded frame (only 5 minute grade, but it looks nice to me)
This had 3 lights, in a more or less traditional 3 point setup. 
Feel free to give it your own colours and share

thanks for all the comments guys, here some more from the same place (but adult event): 
 

If you're hiring people who you can't trust to keep their phones from ruining takes, then you need to ask yourself why -- not to treat crew like school kids. If I've caught up on what I need to do and I'm ready to roll at a moments notice, but we're just waiting for one thing or another, I see no reason why I shouldn't check my email. Besides the fact that quick responses to emails gets you more work, I wouldn't work for a producer who can't trust me to know when I should look at my phone or not. 

Also, if you see the time you pay as "your time", then it's your responsibility to make sure that there is as little down time as possible. If you can't keep your crew occupied, then that's your fault, and it's frankly unreasonable to demand your crew not check in on the state of their own business when they have nothing else to do.

I don't think so.  In addition, it is often helpful for crew to be connected to the world outside the set, as, for instance, they might be expecting delivery of gear/expendables or waiting on the arrival of other crew, or if they are consulting a technical expert on a new piece of gear outside the set, etc.
 
 
Are you certain that  they have not consolidated gear nor prepped for the next shot?  With pro crews, a lot of that work is built-in to the process and is muscle memory.  Would you rather have pros who do their job without thinking and who, consequently, have free time to deal with any unexpected eventualities, or would you rather have inexperienced crew who must constantly focus on every detail and might miss something important or strike out when thrown a curve?
 
If you are genuinely concerned about whether or not they are prepped for the next shot, you can merely have your AD remind the department heads what's coming next.  If you do so, you will probably find out that the crew is several steps ahead of you.
 
By the way, consolidation of gear is usually automatic and built-in, because it it makes the work much easier for the crew and makes it easy to deal with unexpected problems,  and, most importantly, wrap goes much faster!
 
If you see a pro crew sitting around on their phones or twiddling their thumbs, it's probably because everything is done, dressed, staged and prepped, and they are waiting for the department head to give them their next order -- it's usually a good sign.  Also, if there are any sudden, unexpected changes, there is a free pro crew on hand to roll with the punches.