webrunner5

Well one of the deciding factors might be the availability of these two cameras. EM1mkii is scheduled for this year whereas GH5 for summer 2017. 
Also if the rumor of EM1mkii 10bit output is correct, then that will complicate things even more  

Yea, D5 is the only flagship DSLR with 4k 4:2:2 HDMI output at the moment, but its not enough in 2016. Moreover, its not like the expected features need rocket science. Its already done by others. I'm pretty sure Nikon engineers are capable of delivering the best 10bit log profiled image with most refined color science, efficiently encoded. The problem is their boss doesn't ask them to do it. 

This. The NX1 showed what could be done. Yeah, it's flawed in some ways, but for a first time outing, it's one badass camera. 
I actually own a Nikon Super-8 camera. For the era and the media, it's pretty badass. Great mix of value and features. Nikon could easily do a sub-$2k cinema camera. Not holding my breath. 

More and more younger people as young as middle school kids getting into videos, I would think it would hurt them more in sales by not including more video features. what choice do I have if I want 4k, IBIS, swivel screen, all under $1k? G80/85. Just a few more opens up if you can do with one or two of the three. I started stills with D70, than D90 with 720p. After that I moved to Cannon with T2i with 1080p. I'd love to come back to Nikon, and still have a couple of lenses, but not in its current state. it is, indeed, baffling.

It's as easy as making the pro video options a 100$ payed firmware update, the senior citizens from dpreview wouldn't be distracted.

Having mic & headphone jack is still worthwhile for those ultra lowbudget or ultra fast turnaround jobs, or even just simply so you can stick a little shotgun mic on the camera and get better scratch audio for syncing than use the camera's own microphone.

A couple more tidbit.
http://www.mirrorlessons.com/2016/09/22/olympus-om-d-e-m1-mark-ii-extra-information
There is no sensor crop for both UHD and Cinema 4K unless you activate digital stabilisation in addition to 5-axis IS (8% crop).
Continuous AF will be available with the same features as for stills. You can vary the exposure while recording.

6.5 stops of stabilization with their sync lens(es). 4K video.  Seems too good to pass up.  Unless they botch the IQ tremendously (which they most likely won't) I'll be considering it when released.

I'm wondering if there isn't a difference between the degree of stabilisation that is effective for stills and what you would need for smooth video movement. For a start, I don't think IBIS will help keep your horizon straight...
 

The quote is "one stop better and IS"
I think "one stop better" is referring to ISO. They claim the G7 replacement, combined with one of two current optically stabilized lenses- but they plan on making the dual IS compatible with more of those lenses over time, is good for 5 stops of stabilization. Which is pretty remarkable. I imagine the GH5 will at least be able to equal it. Still, looks like Olympus has the edge unless Panasonic can step it up for the GH5. 5 stops is incredible. 6.5 stops is just unbelievable. 

It is very hard to please people these days. When one company finally brings 4K 60p and at the same time 4K 10bit 422 internaly to the masses (that we all whined about for a few years), now all of a sudden it is not that important. Sorry Panasonic we were just kidding, we don't actually need better image quality, we need autofocus that is connected to our brain so we can shoot, read magazines and drink coffee at the same time.

The more I am reading about Olympus, the More I am convinced this is the sensor that will take on the APS-C DSLR brigade. Especially for photography. 
Source:
http://www.amateurphotographer.co.uk/latest/photo-news/exclusive-interview-setsuya-kataoka-olympus-95731
 
"AW: What was Olympus’s main point in mind when designing the E-M1 II?
SK: The primary point is speed, which is increased dramatically, not just the continuous shooting but also the autofocus and viewfinder refresh rate. The sensor readout is faster, and the data processing speed has dramatically improved.
 
AW: In its launch presentation Olympus said the E-M1 II would offer a better value proposition than APS-C. Can you expand on that; for example did it mean both DSLR and mirrorless?
SK: In a sense it’s both, but more about the conventional APS-C DSLR than APS-C CSCs. With the E-M1 Mark II we have surpassed the speed and image quality of APS-C DSLRs.
 
AW: In what way was is IQ surpassed?
SK: In particular, we’re better than our competitors at mid-range ISOs around ISO 6400, with better noise reduction and resolution.
 
AW: Can we talk about the E-M1 Mark II’s new IS system. How well does it work with and without IS lenses?
SK: The in-body stabilisation itself gives 5.5 steps, and the Sync IS gives 6.5 steps with OIS lenses. 6.5 stops is actually a theoretical limitation at the moment due to rotation of the earth interfering with gyro sensors.
 
AW: What were the main challenges making the E-M1 II and getting it to work at such high speeds?
SK: The improvement comes from AF speed and accuracy, with the 121-point sensor. But this means image recording and autofocus need to be matched at high speed. This was very difficult, to maximise the performance of the E-M1 II’s new image sensor.
 
AW: Is the sensor related to the one in the PEN-F just with PDAF added, or are there more differences?
SK: It’s a totally different sensor, two times faster, with totally different construction. On-chip phase detection is also incorporated."
 

Whoa !!! In some ways, I feel the co-operation between Olympus and Panasonic needs to be more.
Also, I am curious whether the new 20MP sensor is another off-the-rack sensor, or one that Sony has SPECIFICALLY made for Olympus.
Either ways, in many ways, Panasonic needs to concentrate and work on its Photography limitations. Especially in comparison to APS-C DSLRs. 
 

Oh boy! I was afraid they were going to put all the focus on stills and keep its video capabilities on the very down-low... (keeping the E-M5-line more video centric), but it seems, on paper, this might have it all... the only thing I'm scared for now is like crazy shot ruining moiré or something. This seems like a hybrid dream. Hopefully I don't have to wake up to a cruel reality. I'm loving it! New sensor tech. Superfast readouts/processing. 4K. Dual cardslot, improved AF, vari-angle screen, mic in+headphone jack, timecode even, flat profile, legendary Oly stabilization. It's all there. The only reason to get the GH5 is the cinema application shooting with stuff like LOG and anamorphic ratios and de-sequeeze. Super exciting!

60 FPS RAW stills with no AF. Holy poop. 

Micro 4/3 is not a sensor size.
It's a lens mount.
4/3" is an image circle size.
4/3"  4:3 is a sensor size.

It means it's now APS-C. !

Nice post Cinegain! Yeah I too was hoping for a better form factor on the GH5. Surely they know not many still photo people buy GH cameras?? So why keep it the same way! I would pay more for a better body, I think lot of us would. Maybe not 3 grand, but 2 thousand ish sure. For 1900 bucks surely you can make a better form factor.
This video stuff is taking off like a rocket right now. And Panny has been a leader for the lower end. Seems to me other than the JVC LS300 you stated, nothing really exciting is there. Panny listen up and fill that void LoL! But I guess this stuff is changing so fast they have no clue which way to go. The GH series has been a cash cow for them. Hard to give it up I guess.

The BMD Micro CC was marketed with global shutter... in the end... they couldn't deliver on that promise and pulled it from the (seemingly finalized) specs (which made me order it). I was rather bummed when I found it was going to ship without the feature, which goes to show I'd rather have them release specs that they know they'll do, rather than making a prediction as a hard statement and then hopefully manage to pull it off somehow. Also... Craft Cinema Camera...
But yeah, I do get that they had to say something at Photokina. I was expecting them to! We all want to know: is it in the making? When should we expect it to hit the market and what can it roughly do?
I do think it's going to be a significant step-up in the way the m43 crowd shoots video! Like the hacked GH2 and GH4 were! In between the GH4R and (paid) firmware upgrade... and the G7 and GX80... I think we're going to be in for a treat. But you've got to be realistic. The GH5 is going to be the most productive and allround video tool in the DSLR and mirrorless market and have the best bang for buck. Yet sensorwise... it's not going to rival fullframe. Then again, that's only logical. Light gathering ability for each pixel is just not the greatest. But you know... isn't that the case with actual movie cameras either? If you look at Blackmagic and Kinefinity for example... you're expected to light your scenes and manage. Shooting ISO6400 is just not something you would/could go and do. That doesn't make fullframe options less interesting, especially for the run-n-gun type who shoots a night scene with just the camera on little to no budget... because then you can't deny the benefits of its flexibility. You can put it in any lighting scenario and it will cope with the conditions (to a certain degree). If that's the most important thing to you, look no further and get one of the Sony A7 series cameras (with their own issues; really comes down to the game of: pick your poison). I think it will be another one and a half year perhaps (2017?) before we see the new tech (organic photoconductive film (OPF CMOS) sensor with global shutter) hitting the market. That you may rightfully call a 'gamechanger'. But we're not there yet. It's a step up, as said, with V-LOG L and an anamorphic mode as firmware upgrades... with the GX80 sensor performance and stabilization however... we've seen that we can expect the GH5 to be a significant up from the GH4. And that is just how you need to see it. Still gives you struggle for wide focal length lenses. Isn't magically going to see in the dark with no noise or create crazy shallow depth of field by itself. But it is great value for the money and it certainly will be a treat to use stand alone as well as rigged up.
Secretly I was hoping for something between the GH-line and the Varicam, because getting a cinema tool step up from the GH4 and end up between 2999~9999 you'd be looking at the Sony FS5/FS7 (or something older 2nd hand), Blackmagic URSA Mini/Production Cinema Camera, Canon C100/300/500, Kinefinity Terra, (2nd hand RED package perhaps). In other words... a lot of people learn with the GH-line and when it's time to step up, their native lenses are probably useless and they have to look at different brands. If I were Panasonic, I would want people to stay in my eco system (and keep their money coming my way), hence create something Kinefinity/Blackmagic style that keeps in mind users coming from a GH4. Something like a true successor to the AG-AF100 but adhering to the modern standards and expections as well as being more compact and affordable. I mean, at around 3000 USD you buy a body only A7SII or A7RII. Can you imagine the things Panasonic would give you for that kind of money?! Something like JVC did (somewhat out of the blue) with the LS300... but done the Panasonic way with the GH heritage. Unfortunately the GH5 won't be that. I thought... ok, the G80 is now roughly the ultimate hybrid camera for stills and video. Maybe they make the GH5 really premium and focussed on video like that. But from what it seems, this is another ultimate hybrid camera... instead of what I was hoping, something in between the GH-line and Varicam (or as I've called it before 'the VC5' (a more serious cinelike approach to the stills hybrid GH5)). Doesn't make me less excited for the GH5 though. Might tick all the boxes anyways (with features that are now well implemented, ditching the YAGH-brick for a more viable solution and still being nice to use as-is, as well as being discrete on the streets and affordable to purchase).

Very likely. I have a feeling the Panaspnic GH5 and the Olympus OMD EM1 Mk II may have the same sensor, one geared towards Photos and one towards Video. 

Jvc's LS300 is a super 35, native m4/3 camera. It is not rocket science, and JVC is very close to Panasonic, anyway. There are speedboosters already for that cam, also. A sensor like this, could have made the GH5 the ring to rule them all.
Panasonic have to realize that this is a video camera, with the form factor, and a little bit of a photo camera. Just the right count of megapixels for better low light capabilities would be a check mate.
It is too early for anything meaningful though, I don't see myself discussing X-Files theories for a camera that I am going to see, probably in a year.I just hope for Panasonic to take the right choices, until then.
 

Discussion on Newsshooter 13 comments
Photokina 2016: We ask Panasonic all the questions about the GH5
 
Will ; a reply to Mark Ellsworth 4 days ago
"Right, but the micro43 standard is rather open about sensor size and aspect ratio. Crucially, the standard requires that the imaging area of the sensor be a specified diagonal measure. All Micro43 cameras but two have featured identically sized 4:3 ratio sensors. The GH1 and GH2 featured larger sensors that covered that diagonal in 4:3, but also 16:9 (and necessarily, 3:2 as well). Because lenses produce a circle, standardizing the diagonal ensures that every lens will still cover.
Understand, this is not the same as generating 16:9 or 3:2 imagery from a 4:3 sensor, where you just throw away some of the pixels from the top and bottom of the 4:3 imaging area. This involves using fewer pixels on the top and bottom, but also additional pixels on the sides. So your 16:9 image is both shorter AND wider than a 4:3 image taken with the same camera.
As regards video, this means that the effective sensor size is actually bigger, and the "crop factor" is thus less. The "crop factor" of the GH4's full sensor is 2, but the 4k video in the GH4 uses only some of the full width of the sensor, so the crop factor ends up being close to 2.3. In the GH1 and GH2, the larger 16:9 imaging area resulted in horizontal crops closer to 1.8 or 1.9, if I recall correctly.
So the GH5 may be a return of the multi aspect sensor. And if it is, this would explain a few things. Namely the 6K photo mode. Nominal 16x9 6K (not full DCI spec) is 5760 x 3240, much like we call 3840 x 2160 4K. A 4:3 sensor with 5760 pixels wide would be 4320 pixels tall and thus a 24.8 MP sensor, quite different than any yet seen in Micro43. But if that width is only in 16:9, the 4:3 imager would be 20.9 MP... slightly more than half a megapixel more than in the GX8's sensor. So with a minimal reduction in pixel size, this theoretical multi-aspect sensor is possible.
In addition to the benefit of 6K photo mode, there's more magic in a 5760x3240 16:9 imaging area. That size is exactly 1.5 times wider and 1.5 times taller than 3840. 1.5 is a kind of magic number in this regard. Oversampling by a ratio of 1.5 allows for computationally easy downconversion with improved color accuracy at each output pixel. Don't take my word for it either: you can look at the specs for every different version of the Arri Alexa, which generates its 1920x1080 from a sensor with 2880 x 1620 pixels (which it now allows you to record all of, a compromise in the original design that attempts to eke more resolution out of the sensor at the expense of color accuracy).
In summary, it doesn't take much of a leap (basically, just Panasonic returning to multi-aspect sensor, and developing a new sensor design with pixels only marginally smaller than their current generation) to arrive at a possible GH5 with internal 10-bit 4:2:2, a horizontal crop factor of 1.8 or 1.9, vastly improved color accuracy in video (in addition to the greater color sampling rate), and a true 16:9 6K photo mode with no interpolation or computational trickery".
Pretty interesting post by Will on Newshooter. He might have sort of a answer on sensor size of the GH5. Food for thought..

Discussion on Newsshooter 13 comments
Photokina 2016: We ask Panasonic all the questions about the GH5
 
Will ; a reply to Mark Ellsworth 4 days ago
"Right, but the micro43 standard is rather open about sensor size and aspect ratio. Crucially, the standard requires that the imaging area of the sensor be a specified diagonal measure. All Micro43 cameras but two have featured identically sized 4:3 ratio sensors. The GH1 and GH2 featured larger sensors that covered that diagonal in 4:3, but also 16:9 (and necessarily, 3:2 as well). Because lenses produce a circle, standardizing the diagonal ensures that every lens will still cover.
Understand, this is not the same as generating 16:9 or 3:2 imagery from a 4:3 sensor, where you just throw away some of the pixels from the top and bottom of the 4:3 imaging area. This involves using fewer pixels on the top and bottom, but also additional pixels on the sides. So your 16:9 image is both shorter AND wider than a 4:3 image taken with the same camera.
As regards video, this means that the effective sensor size is actually bigger, and the "crop factor" is thus less. The "crop factor" of the GH4's full sensor is 2, but the 4k video in the GH4 uses only some of the full width of the sensor, so the crop factor ends up being close to 2.3. In the GH1 and GH2, the larger 16:9 imaging area resulted in horizontal crops closer to 1.8 or 1.9, if I recall correctly.
So the GH5 may be a return of the multi aspect sensor. And if it is, this would explain a few things. Namely the 6K photo mode. Nominal 16x9 6K (not full DCI spec) is 5760 x 3240, much like we call 3840 x 2160 4K. A 4:3 sensor with 5760 pixels wide would be 4320 pixels tall and thus a 24.8 MP sensor, quite different than any yet seen in Micro43. But if that width is only in 16:9, the 4:3 imager would be 20.9 MP... slightly more than half a megapixel more than in the GX8's sensor. So with a minimal reduction in pixel size, this theoretical multi-aspect sensor is possible.
In addition to the benefit of 6K photo mode, there's more magic in a 5760x3240 16:9 imaging area. That size is exactly 1.5 times wider and 1.5 times taller than 3840. 1.5 is a kind of magic number in this regard. Oversampling by a ratio of 1.5 allows for computationally easy downconversion with improved color accuracy at each output pixel. Don't take my word for it either: you can look at the specs for every different version of the Arri Alexa, which generates its 1920x1080 from a sensor with 2880 x 1620 pixels (which it now allows you to record all of, a compromise in the original design that attempts to eke more resolution out of the sensor at the expense of color accuracy).
In summary, it doesn't take much of a leap (basically, just Panasonic returning to multi-aspect sensor, and developing a new sensor design with pixels only marginally smaller than their current generation) to arrive at a possible GH5 with internal 10-bit 4:2:2, a horizontal crop factor of 1.8 or 1.9, vastly improved color accuracy in video (in addition to the greater color sampling rate), and a true 16:9 6K photo mode with no interpolation or computational trickery".
Pretty interesting post by Will on Newshooter. He might have sort of a answer on sensor size of the GH5. Food for thought..

Discussion on Newsshooter 13 comments
Photokina 2016: We ask Panasonic all the questions about the GH5
 
Will ; a reply to Mark Ellsworth 4 days ago
"Right, but the micro43 standard is rather open about sensor size and aspect ratio. Crucially, the standard requires that the imaging area of the sensor be a specified diagonal measure. All Micro43 cameras but two have featured identically sized 4:3 ratio sensors. The GH1 and GH2 featured larger sensors that covered that diagonal in 4:3, but also 16:9 (and necessarily, 3:2 as well). Because lenses produce a circle, standardizing the diagonal ensures that every lens will still cover.
Understand, this is not the same as generating 16:9 or 3:2 imagery from a 4:3 sensor, where you just throw away some of the pixels from the top and bottom of the 4:3 imaging area. This involves using fewer pixels on the top and bottom, but also additional pixels on the sides. So your 16:9 image is both shorter AND wider than a 4:3 image taken with the same camera.
As regards video, this means that the effective sensor size is actually bigger, and the "crop factor" is thus less. The "crop factor" of the GH4's full sensor is 2, but the 4k video in the GH4 uses only some of the full width of the sensor, so the crop factor ends up being close to 2.3. In the GH1 and GH2, the larger 16:9 imaging area resulted in horizontal crops closer to 1.8 or 1.9, if I recall correctly.
So the GH5 may be a return of the multi aspect sensor. And if it is, this would explain a few things. Namely the 6K photo mode. Nominal 16x9 6K (not full DCI spec) is 5760 x 3240, much like we call 3840 x 2160 4K. A 4:3 sensor with 5760 pixels wide would be 4320 pixels tall and thus a 24.8 MP sensor, quite different than any yet seen in Micro43. But if that width is only in 16:9, the 4:3 imager would be 20.9 MP... slightly more than half a megapixel more than in the GX8's sensor. So with a minimal reduction in pixel size, this theoretical multi-aspect sensor is possible.
In addition to the benefit of 6K photo mode, there's more magic in a 5760x3240 16:9 imaging area. That size is exactly 1.5 times wider and 1.5 times taller than 3840. 1.5 is a kind of magic number in this regard. Oversampling by a ratio of 1.5 allows for computationally easy downconversion with improved color accuracy at each output pixel. Don't take my word for it either: you can look at the specs for every different version of the Arri Alexa, which generates its 1920x1080 from a sensor with 2880 x 1620 pixels (which it now allows you to record all of, a compromise in the original design that attempts to eke more resolution out of the sensor at the expense of color accuracy).
In summary, it doesn't take much of a leap (basically, just Panasonic returning to multi-aspect sensor, and developing a new sensor design with pixels only marginally smaller than their current generation) to arrive at a possible GH5 with internal 10-bit 4:2:2, a horizontal crop factor of 1.8 or 1.9, vastly improved color accuracy in video (in addition to the greater color sampling rate), and a true 16:9 6K photo mode with no interpolation or computational trickery".
Pretty interesting post by Will on Newshooter. He might have sort of a answer on sensor size of the GH5. Food for thought..

If that is the case, I may mess myself a little.
But wouldn't downsampled DCI 4K require even more horizontal pixels?

I think that may be for a C100 type shoe connector with XLR ports.