crevice

6 minutes ago, Timotheus said:

Anamorphic Store products are very pricey for what they are. Their single focuser is rather crappy (see the anamorphic shooters FB group). I would avoid.

Rapido has a much better deal. The single focus solution is much better and has wider coverage.

You could also consider putting several parts together yourself. Cinelux ES goes for 300-400. FVD 16 is 550. Then you will need some clamps and a support (let's say 150-250). In other words, 1000 dollar gets you a lot.

I am definitely leaning toward the rapido all in package. I just dont know the quality of the schneider lens and there are not many examples online

Rapido and the Anamorphic store both sell full kits and the rapido full kit has the schneider cinelux 2x and one of the anamorphic store kits has the isco micro. Has anybody compared the two and can somebody please give me their opinion on which is better? I will be using contax zeiss and leica R as taking lenses.

On 12/9/2019 at 7:21 PM, Sage said:

That could be done; granted it wouldn't be tailored to the sensor. I'd like to support it directly, and I think there may be some rental options that would make that feasible.

That would be great. I can help with footage if you need as well and I'm sure others would also

Alex - would I be able to use the pocket 4K version on the URSA mini pro, if I used a color space transform to get to the pocket 4K first. Or does that not make any sense? I’m very eager to see how good URSA mini footage would look with this. 

@Sage I know you have a lot of cameras on your list, from pocket 6k, to Panasonic s1/s1h but is there a chance you would ever make one for an Ursa Mini Pro? I would imagine since the image on the UMP is so good out the box, that your LUT would make it look real close to an Alexa.

I was thinking of picking up a pocket 4k again, just because they are dropping in price in the used market. This may push me over the edge. I know you spent a lot of time and effort on this, nice work! In your opinion do you think the pocket 6k image quality and color science is better or worse than the pocket 4k? I noticed a difference between the two when I had them. 

1 hour ago, currensheldon said:

I've been following it pretty closely and have been wondering that myself. I thought it was going to be sensor size, but that proved to be incorrect. As far as I can tell, the main differences will be:

- High Frame Rates - Most Red cameras can do 96fps in 6k (Komodo will top out at 40 or 50fps) and 120-150fps in 4k. The specs haven't been released yet, but I'd be surprised if Komodo matched this.

- Modularity - All of Red's other cameras can be built out based on the production. Whereas Komodo is pretty much just itself - it can't really be anything more than what it is, which probably means it won't be used as many A-Cams on most of the shows/movies that Red cameras are used on now. They need all the extra inputs and outputs that DSMC2 provides.

- Fixed Mount - Totally fine with me since I love the RF Mount, but having an RF Mount and not user-swappable PL and EF mounts probably means many bigger productions will opt for DSMC2 and not use adapters. 

But really that seems to be about it, all of which is fine for small crews, owner/operators, small production companies, etc. 

Also, with a global shutter mode and Red IQ, I bet they will sell dozens of these to action movies and tv shows to use as crash cams and b, c, d, e, f, g etc cams. 

Yeah I think modularity is a big one. I have been lukewarm on RED and their shadiness as of late - with their mini mags and their whole patent issues - but I do have to admit, the modularity of a RED is very appealing to me. Being able to just grab a camera with everything attached and with no cables dangling everywhere is what has always attracted me to them. Obviously, Komodo's price makes it something that hobbyist like me might be able to actually afford - but the lack of modularity doesn't make me as excited of owning a RED as its bigger brothers. 

2020 is shaping up to be one of the more exciting years for cameras in recent memory - if a majority of the rumored cameras come out. We know for sure we will have the FX9, Canon C500 mark ii, Red Komodo, and Canon 1DX III. And there is a chance we get a good chunk of these rumored cameras finally released, being the FX6, A7S3 (finally?), Ursa Mini 8k, Fuji XT4, and GH6. I haven't heard many rumors of a Canon prosumer mirrorless camera with IBIS and good video specs - but if they continue to let folks like Red use their RF mount - that is a good start for their new mount. I am curious if folks like Blackmagic will start using it as well. The more competition the better, since all of us can reap the benefits.  

45 minutes ago, Emanuel said:

To each its own. I feel exactly that about all those complicated menus. A pain in the ass. That simply cuts off all my pleasure to shoot with.

Blackmagic has brought me the feeling of a real film camera back. I love their approach to put the shooter in the focus of their camera design, not just another user in the digital age or ENG field. They have made digital cinema cameras instead. I come back from 35mm and 16mm realm. This really counts to me : ) IQ wise I practically am able to reproduce anything I want. Secondary today IMO : -)

Yeah man, whatever tools inspires you to create - that’s all that matters. All these cameras at this point are great, it’s up to what’s best for the user and their needs. Pocket 6k is a great camera, just not for me. 

1 hour ago, Emanuel said:

So get used to P6K... Its user interface has no parallel with anything else at all : ) I am user of both systems, apples to oranges : -)

Blackmagic's tool gives you back the pleasure to shoot on film again throughout the digital age.

I got rid of my pocket 6k. The battery lasted 15 minutes and I couldn’t hand hold it without micro jitters. I prefer my bmcc 2.5k to the 6k anyways, more organic and filmic look to it. And though its a pain in the ass to use as well, I love the image. For modern cameras and everyday shooting I prefer the S1H even if its not RAW. If I wanted to rig a camera up like the pocket 6k, I would just buy an URSA mini pro, you can find them used in the $3k range and i prefer the image. I probably will get an URSA mini pro at some point next year, depends on what the Komodo and Sony FX6 are all about. 

7 minutes ago, deezid said:

Yep, pretty much.
The color science is far superior, but the codec struggles with shadow recovery.

Cannot wait till ProRes RAW arrives. Better shadow recovery in case it's 12 bit and no more temporal noise reduction (smoothing, smearing, trailing, ghosting and so called after images).
Still don't know if BMD is ever going to implement it into Davinci Resolve though.

I know man. I get excited about prores raw, then I come back to reality and realize it wont work in resolve. I only work in resolve these days and use a Blackmagic mini panel for grading, so I have 0 interest in using any other NLE. 

Slanted lens did a comparison to the pocket 6k, see below. My take away is (my personal opinion, doesn't have to be yours) that the S1H colors look better and skin tones look better. Both cameras are similar and this comparison proves that anybody who claims the pocket 6k "destroys" the S1H just because of its popularity and codec are drinking the kool aid. The fact that the S1H can go toe to toe against a raw format, while also having IBIS, better battery, swivel screen AND almost more importantly for hybrid shooters also be a legit stills camera is a huge selling point. 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rghbaHoVRsk

Lengthy review on newshooter - its crazy how much better the S1H looks than the A7 and Nikon camera in the talking head comparison video. Also, not sure I agree with him on the "Sterile" look, pocket 6k seems just as sterile if not more to me. Though, to his credit I have seen lots of footage with the S1H that can look sterile in the wrong hands. 

https://www.newsshooter.com/2019/11/11/panasonic-lumix-s1h-review/?fbclid=IwAR2RI5AXLl9Hlbqfir20uerkbnS8IdiI9oVd7ctgsP5WGJDJ-O3zMgJqgN0

4 hours ago, helium said:

Do you guys really propose to assess a camera's "color science" by referencing one highly stylized and heavily color corrected beauty shot, at a complete remove from the naturalistic norms of modern-day dramatic cinematography?

And what's the ideal?  Accurate color or stylized color?

 By tomorrow morning, the forums will be full of people insisting that the S1H is as good as the Red Dragon and the skin tones on the BMPCC 4K are crap.  I read it on the internet.....

Go away already

It’s odd - I get fanboy will be fanboys - but why is everyone on Facebook and reduser saying this is such great news? I mean even if you own a red, why wouldn’t you want to see compressed RAW in other products? Competition is a good thing and it gives consumers more choice. It’s like me celebrating that my S1H won a case that will allow them to be the only camera that can record to an SD card. Why would I celebrate that? 

Here is an interesting one. For those of you that have an external recorder with an S1H, do you have the option to set 10 bit in the "HDMI Rec Output" menu, as shown in this video below? Me and another user from the facebook group don't have that option at all, doesn't even show up in the list. I am using the super expensive atomos HDMI 2.0 cable as well. 

31 minutes ago, AaronChicago said:

Gtx 2070 on windows 10

hm, you have a better GPU than me and I can playback fine in 6k. I am wondering what your playback resolution is within resolve? Maybe that could be causing it

On 11/3/2019 at 8:48 AM, helium said:

If folks really want their footage to look like this, you have to wonder why they'd bother to agonize over camera choice.  Just about anything will do.

firmware announced, but oddly no mention for S1H. Update notes do mention a fix for blue clipping in vlog and a fix for afterimage, which I believe is the ghosting issue seen by some. 
 

https://m.dpreview.com/news/0778308148/panasonic-adds-features-with-firmware-for-gh5-gh5s-g9-s1-and-s1r-with-particular-boost-for-g9-video

3 hours ago, helium said:

If folks really want their footage to look like this, you have to wonder why they'd bother to agonize over camera choice.  Just about anything will do.

This is a creative art form we take on as filmmakers - I see nothing wrong with the approach by the filmmaker or the grade, if that was their vision.

Found this on the FB group. Shot on S1H with Leica R glass. The low contrast/low sat grade was the intention it seems. Dynamic range looks really good 

4 hours ago, mercer said:

Thanks for posting this. I’ve been following this film for a while and posted the trailer a few months back in another thread. Not only was it shot mostly with one lens, they shot it on ProResLT. The BTS is a great story as well...

For anybody that isn’t following this film, these guys ended up getting a US theatrical and VOD release that opens next week. Here’s the official theatrical trailer...

Their success is a testament to DIY filmmaking that proves talent, imagination, hard work and perseverance can lead to great things.

Being an FCPX user, this film is actually one of the reasons I decided to buy another Micro and give it another try. Of course, I haven’t really used the camera for more than a few minutes. Every time I go out to shoot, I reach for my 5D3, but I hope to get out and give it a thorough test sometime this Fall and hopefully produce something with it this Winter.

Or I may just follow their lead, and continue shooting with my 5D3 and sell the Micro. In the end, the camera is just a minor ingredient.

Either way this is a great story for aspiring filmmakers and I wish these guys the best of luck with their film.

Hey Mercer - hopefully you can keep it and make something. I have recently come to the conclusion that buying and selling is having a negative impact on my creativity. That may seem obvious, but I am slowly starting to just keep all my cameras and various systems and use them as tools for what they are good at when the time comes. I used to be really paranoid about having more than one camera brand - but now, I don't care - obviously if finances allow. 

Not mine, but this was 90 percent shot on the original bmpcc with 1 lens

23 minutes ago, thebrothersthre3 said:

I think by organic he just means natural colors and no in camera processing (noise reduction). 

Possibly, but he praises the S1H colors and says he isn't fond of the pocket colors earlier in the thread, so not quite sure. Not trying to start a war and trying to keep things positive. But hearing the same issue brought up over and over again is constantly steering this thread into the same direction - one that none of us can do anything about. 

2 hours ago, deezid said:

ehm, ok?
There's nothing wrong with the source file. No oversaturation or even clipping in your example.

Also in sequence settings. At least in CC2019 the issue with both settings being set should be gone.

That's great news.

Still not sure about keeping my S1H.
Postives: Great color, works perfectly fine in ACES, no clipping issues, great DR and roll-off, IBIS and battery life, ease of use
Meh: Mediocre Codec choices which may cause issues, but all good so far
Bad: Temporal Noise reduction ruining many shots - barely usable honestly. Even recorded externally to ProRes HQ (tried an Atomos Shogun and Odyssey 7Q+)

Pocket 6K:
Positives: Organic looking image With grain and no artifacts, good dynamic range, great screen, great codec choice with flexibility and no macro blocking nor banding which is also speedy on older machines
Meh: build quality, will put it into a cage anyway
Bad: Battery Life, no viewfinder - needs rigging and can't really use it in ACES atm due to clipping issues and color looking - one dimensional and brown?

On a yRGB timeline I can fix many issues by myself but it's quite time consuming and the next big project coming up soon will rely on many VFX shots, so ACES would be great - like it has been on my other projects before.

On the other hand the temporal noise reduction resulting in ghosting and smearing on the S1H made tracking a nightmare already in another project I'm working on atm. Basically have to do everything manually because the tracker gets confused.

Maybe I should just switch back to the GH5 lol

Your positives about the S1H are everything I would want in a camera. Your negatives, which I have yet to encounter, should be fixed in a firmware update as they seem to be directly tied to VLOG, which is a positive since its something that could be fixed, similar to the GH5. With that said, you have brought up a valid concern - but  you have brought it up over and over and over, to the point where we get it, but we are not Panasonic - you should be voicing this to them at this point in order to actually get it fixed. If you have already and they are aware, then you should give them time to fix it. There has yet to be a first real firmware out yet to even see if its addressed. To be clear, I have no issues at all with you voicing concerns that need to be fixed, nothing will get fixed if we are all silent. But you made your point and now you are just stating the same thing over and over again, in this forum, on facebook, on review sites, etc. I am not sure what you want out of it. Are you hoping Panasonic read and fix it? If so, why not just contact them?

Lastly, I disagree with your notion of the pocket 6k or any of these mirrorless cameras, including the S1H, having an "organic" image. An organic image to me, would be an original Blackmagic pocket, Blackmagic micro, Blackmagic cinema 2.5. Those actually used a Fairchild sensor and had a nice organic look to it. You didn't need to add grain to those those cameras to make them look organic, it was organic out the box. 

7 hours ago, CaptainHook said:

That's an oversight on the Resolve teams part, I alerted it to them last week when a user reported that some options are also missing from the ACES ResolveFX plugin too.

We are looking into it. It's not specific to the Pocket 4K, is happens with the G2 and other cameras. Its how gamut mapping is done - I've seen the same artefact on footage shot with ARRI/Red/Sony/etc from test files with saturated red highlights clipping and also seen it on publicly broadcast tv shows and movies with huge budgets shooting Alexa etc where the gamut mapping is not handled by the colourist (its very common on TV series on Netflix, HBO, Amazon, etc). FYI, Arri Wide Gamut is very similar in size and location of primaries as BMD Wide Gamut Gen 4.

The issue is its a non-linear transform to address the problem so if you apply that correction to footage it's not easily reversible anymore in standard colour science workflows like ACES. So if you applied it on camera to ProRes footage and then transformed it to another colour space "technically" it would be wrong. Same if it were an option in Blackmagic RAW decode and you took that output to VFX workflow etc that requires linear or some other transform. So the user has to be careful about when to use this. But we are looking into it to make it easier. Otherwise for problem shots people can decode into another space and handle the gamut mapping themselves (I personally think this is preferable when possible so it can be tailored to each shot and target gamut but it does require the user to have a certain amount of knowledge and time to address it in post which is not reasonable to assume).

While we have you...are there plans to get prores raw support in resolve? Once the S1H gets support and Nikon (not holding my breath) gets it as well, it’s going to really suck to not have native support for prores raw in resolve. I think that an NLE of this popularity should support all possible codecs, regardless of politics, etc. I don’t want to have to use final cut just for prores raw and I’m sure many others feel the same way.