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Andrew Reid

Panasonic GH5 - all is revealed!

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20 minutes ago, Stab said:

My first couple of tests with the GH5 show that Natural is the best picture profile, as it was on the GH3 also. When everything turned down -3 or -4 (contrast / saturation), there isn't much difference with it's close contender Cinelike D. Mind you, Cinelike D is flatter but also some color tonalities are lost. Especially in the greens.

Cinelike D might show a small improvement in DR, but never more than a (0.5) stop. With Filmconvert applied with it's standard curve, the difference in dynamic range is lost and Natural wins with better colors. Some grass for instance has a yellow tinge to it in real life and on Natural, which just becomes a single colored green on Cinelike D.

So for me it will be Natural as the way to go. Like709 has the best colors out of the box, but not the best DR without tweaking every shot which I'm not going to do when shooting weddings. I didn't get the V-LOG update though so I can't comment on that.

Forget about Portrait, Standard, Vivid, etc. I see no reason to shoot in those profiles as they don't offer any more 'natural' color over Natural and no improvement in DR or gradeabillity whatsoever. 

Then the stabilizer. I'm using a Sigma 18-35 with a SpeedBooster XL, so not supported by the camera. I have to manually input the focal length and naturally I can not make us of Dual IS. My findings are that it works fine for handheld shots which are pretty steady or make a small movement or pan. However, I tried to walk with it on and it mostly gave pretty poor results. Similar to warp stabilizer, it was warping all over the place on the side of my screen. Don't expect miracles if you don't have native lenses is my take on it. Oh yea, and it DRAINS your battery. With the GH3 I could go for hours on a single battery. Today I almost went through a full charge in like 90 minutes.

What else? The 4K at 50p is astounding. The image is chrystal clear without being oversharpened. It's not lacking DR unless you start pushing it with very contrasty situations.The VFR is very fun to play with. 120-180 fps is astounding. It's as sharp as a GH3 / GH4 at 1080p, but more prone to moire and aliassing. You have to make sure you have the background (bricks, buildings, trees) out of focus and then you're good to go. Instant production-value.

The camera feels sturdy and professional. The full-sized HDMI is the finishing touch. Recording simultaneously to dual SD cards is a blessing, especially when shooting important events like weddings. No more nervously taking the SD-card out of the camera and put in my computer with shaking hands praying to God that the footage is okay and the card is undamaged. 

Cons I've seen so far:
- Incorrect exposure when having VFR selected in combination with shutter-angle. You aren't shown the correct exposure of the shot until you press the record button. This needs to be adressed. 
- Not as impressed with IBIS as I had hoped for. 
- Battery life decreased. Probably due to Stabilizer and or dual card recording
- Image needs heavy grading to be 'filmic'. But this is the same for all Panasonic camera's and I've learned to deal with it

Great step-up from the GH3 which I've used for 4 years with great pleasure. If the GH5 proves to be as reliable as the GH3, I'm a very happy customer.

Here's the one of the first films I've shot with the GH3. I'm still surprised with what that little camera can do. If you don't have the money, you don't need a GH5 or an upgrade. But if you do, it's great fun and you feel like the future is here.

 

According to Paul Leeming, V-Log has two stops more dynamic range than Cinelike D on the GH5.

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EOSHD Pro Color for Sony cameras EOSHD Pro LOG for Sony CamerasEOSHD C-LOG and Film Profiles for All Canon DSLRs
24 minutes ago, jonpais said:

According to Paul Leeming, V-Log has two stops more dynamic range than Cinelike D on the GH5.

That would be great. Very great even.

But for my line of work, I prefer not to work with V-LOG. Could be great though if it's true.

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9 hours ago, lmackreath said:

quick try with filmconverts new gh5 profile

Hmmm... which film stock was this? The reds and blues are still very Panasonic looking to me.

I'm not sure how much effort FilmConvert really put in to optimising their profiles for each camera or even each set of camera settings. The same scene shot in different picture styles with the relevant FilmConvert profiles applied should look similar, yet they often don't.

 

2 hours ago, Stab said:

Like709 has the best colors out of the box, but not the best DR without tweaking every shot

Paul Leeming said on FB:

Quote

Dynamic range results, best to worst:

1. V-Log by about two stops.
2. Cine-D (just a bit better than Like709, but not by much)
3. Like709

Basically, with the knee control set to Point: 80 and Slope: 99 (showed maximal gains), it looks very similar in curve to Cine-D, only with a touch less dynamic range in the shadows. I mean, a really little bit of difference.

If you like 709L colours the most, try adjusting the knee to get more DR (and report back!). Did you record your tests? It would be great to see samples.

 

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So here's a test of the GH5's AF. I used the 709 Profile, 14-140 lens and center area AF. Focus was set for CAF to see if any hunting occurred and if so, to what degree. I've shot in this same mall with the Sony A6300 & A7Rii with results that weren't as good. At times these other cameras would lock on to areas and objects behind the subject. 

Given all the things I've read on some sites, the AF has been far better than I expected. I've really had excellent success. Yes, if you look closely you'll see a bit of hunting in a couple of clips, but nothing really disturbing. If I wasn't testing the AF, but still wanted to use AF, I would probably have used 'lock on AF'. 

 

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6 minutes ago, Ken Ross said:

I used the 709 Profile,

I have the same request for you Ken,

33 minutes ago, hyalinejim said:

If you like 709L colours the most, try adjusting the knee to get more DR (and report back!).

 

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Not for me, because that's surely not the results I've gotten. I think if 100 owners posted perfect AF results, some would still fall back on Max's test. I wonder why Max gets the worst results of anyone I've read?

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57 minutes ago, Hanriverprod said:

Max goes over main af settings for 30 minutes. TLDW - conclusion, use manual focus.

After watching the entire video there is no other way to describe this other than damning for the autofocus system in the GH5. The egregious real life examples are in the second half of the video. I promise it is worth your time to view it all.

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6 hours ago, Ken Ross said:

So here's a test of the GH5's AF. I used the 709 Profile, 14-140 lens and center area AF. Focus was set for CAF to see if any hunting occurred and if so, to what degree. I've shot in this same mall with the Sony A6300 & A7Rii with results that weren't as good. At times these other cameras would lock on to areas and objects behind the subject. 

Given all the things I've read on some sites, the AF has been far better than I expected. I've really had excellent success. Yes, if you look closely you'll see a bit of hunting in a couple of clips, but nothing really disturbing. If I wasn't testing the AF, but still wanted to use AF, I would probably have used 'lock on AF'. 

 

Ken - I've been doing a field test this week at the Saigon Central Post office of the Fuji 50mm f/2 with the Fuji X-T2 mounted on the Crane gimbal - practically identical subject matter   - and it looks like some of the handheld shots here have just about the same amount of jitter as mine. Are you seeing it, or is it just me? Sorry to nitpick.

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I was on a documentary shoot yesterday, again and at the end I decided to go with the 12-35 f2.8 for the B-roll with dual IS + AF. I did not set anything before the shoot, just popped on the lens, scrubbed trough the menu to activate focus and that was is. I was shocked. The dual IS was a lifesaver, all my gear, the slider, the tripod, the rigs were packed in to the car, so even with handheld I pulled off great tracking shots and slider-like shots. The CF worked okay, not as a 6500 but kept the focus on my subject all the time. I never thought about investing to MFT glass, but after this experience I am definitely getting a 25mm and a 45mm lens. Will do my best to upload some samples next week.

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I don't know - Max spent the better part of a day using many different settings under different lighting conditions and couldn't get it to work, so I trust him the most. It's the most comprehensive look at the GH5 AF-C I've seen so far. For gimbal work, which begins at around 13'54" in Max's video, the best you could do is use AF-S. The only way anyone could convince me otherwise is to do the exact same testing with the same procedures - same frame rates, same shutter speeds, same settings - and prove Max is mistaken. But I don't think that's going to happen. And honestly, I don't care. 

C'mon, notice my hand. please!

Screen Shot 2017-04-05 at 2.13.37 PM.png

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12 minutes ago, Inazuma said:

Max's gh5 or lens may have been buggy. I have seen much better AF by other youtubers

But he tested two lenses. 12-35mm f/2.8 v.1 noticeably smoother than v.2 at 24p. Were both of them buggy? Sebastian - those videos you watched - were any of them as comprehensive as Max's tests? He can't be accused of bias - just listen to his closing remarks. He spent over ten hours just testing the AF settings. I don't think there's a single reviewer out there who's done such a thorough examination of just one aspect of the GH5.

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8 hours ago, hyalinejim said:

Hmmm... which film stock was this? The reds and blues are still very Panasonic looking to me.

I'm not sure how much effort FilmConvert really put in to optimising their profiles for each camera or even each set of camera settings. The same scene shot in different picture styles with the relevant FilmConvert profiles applied should look similar, yet they often don't.

 

Paul Leeming said on FB:

If you like 709L colours the most, try adjusting the knee to get more DR (and report back!). Did you record your tests? It would be great to see samples.

 

Additional thoughts from Paul:

V-Log in the GH5 ACTUALLY has more dynamic range than Cine-D! Rejoice! :D I'm seeing about two stops or so more dynamic range (this is an estimate, not exact measurement), although with it comes more shadow noise. The good news is, the shadow noise is quite grainy and random, without pattern noise that I can see. So it should be 1. easy to fix with a denoising plugin and 2. easy to leave in place and accept as film-like grain. This is exciting as it means that the jump to 10bit 4:2:2 has really allowed for more headroom, even if it's not quite using all the tonal range of a linear profile. At least with the implementation of 10bit footage, there is no longer a breakdown in chroma blocking. I think I'll be using this as my primary shooting profile from now on with my LUT applied in post, which is quite the change from the GH4 where V-Log was inferior.

Cine-D still appears to be the second best dynamic range and gives a stop or so extra dynamic range over Like709. Like709 seems, well, like Rec709! :DBut at the expense of shadow detail. Much better to shoot Cine-D and apply an accurate Rec709 LUT over the top, and retain the extra dynamic range. For those not wanting V-Log, this is a good solution still.

... Loving it! A lot of the GH4 niggles have been ironed out, and the IBIS and 10bit 4:2:2 makes a real difference. The sensor seems a lot more sensitive to blue which is good, because not only do you get better colorimetry, the extra sensitivity translates into less blue noise at the shadow end. Battery isn't lasting quite as long as the GH4 but that's to be expected given the extra processing power and IBIS. In short, a very good update thus far and for professionals, a must have in my opinion.

V-Log pushed 4 stops:

GH5_BETA_VLOG_test027_4stops_pushed.png

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Moreover, lot of these "reviewers" (dozens of thousands of YT followers won't impede my commas there) when not detractors with a business agenda with other brand(s), they simply forget hybrid focus modes or certain features such as touch to focus (actually, an AF mode too) only in order to make their point.

This is sad when people start to cancel their orders based on BS or incomplete information which has become mere misinformation in the meantime, as matter of fact, precisely 'cause of that. That puzzles and irritates me enough as tech and picture lover.

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