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Ursa mini...is this the end of blackmagic?


Ed_David
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I have looked into the crosshatching for several different cameras down to identifying the source of it in the raw file itself.

It is not a scaling issue, either in camera or in post. 

Scaling can make it appear better or worse but that is just a side effec of the pattern already being there.  Maybe it can be fixed via firmware but for now BMD is allowing RMA's for it. Firmware does seem to affect it since I have looked at one camera that was worse with version 4 beta 2 but still had it to a lesser degree in version 3.3.

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On 9/15/2016 at 2:06 AM, Michael Coffee said:

Well, E mount does seem the best supported for aftermarket active adapters, nice short flange distance - who says E mount is not available? EF was, so why not E.. do you know that Sony won't license the mount?

Yes we do know Sony won't license E mount. 
And Canon EF mount has been around long enough it no longer has the same level of IP protect as E mount has, thus others can use it. 

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As someone who is currently shooting on a Ursa Mini 4.6K I've had a great time shooting 4.6K ProRes 4:2:2 at 800 ISO at 24 fps. The image is incredible to work with, but it does not like it when you push it outside of those settings, and you never EVER want to underexpose your blacks, you will not be able to recover them in post. The more light you give the image the better.

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23 minutes ago, Geoff CB said:

As someone who is currently shooting on a Ursa Mini 4.6K I'm shooting 4.6K ProRes 4:2:2 at 800 ISO 24 fps. The image is incredible to work with, but it does not like it when you push it outside of those settings, and you never EVER want to underexpose your blacks, you will not be able to recover them in post. The more light you give the image the better.

Agreed. Shooting raw gives a bit more latitude i've found but it is still a very light hungry camera no matter what. It's even more difficult to manage when the sensor is windowed. 

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  • 3 weeks later...

Another nail in the Ursa Mini coffin (at least in my view), yesterday in forum discussions about corrupt clips it came to light that Ursa Minis no longer officially support Windows 7 and it was heavily implied reading Ursa footage on Windows 7 could possibly lead to clips becoming corrupted, due to the way Firmware 4's file system works. 

https://forum.blackmagicdesign.com/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=53174

And thus I have completely stopped considering a Blackmagic product as the successor to BMCC. Time to look elsewhere.

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23 hours ago, Ehetyz said:

Another nail in the Ursa Mini coffin (at least in my view), yesterday in forum discussions about corrupt clips it came to light that Ursa Minis no longer officially support Windows 7 and it was heavily implied reading Ursa footage on Windows 7 could possibly lead to clips becoming corrupted, due to the way Firmware 4's file system works. 

https://forum.blackmagicdesign.com/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=53174

And thus I have completely stopped considering a Blackmagic product as the successor to BMCC. Time to look elsewhere.

So, I read the thread and your interpretation of it is misleading. 

Captain Hook

Quote

FW4.0 is all new including the file systems and there is a chance of a corner case that wouldn't bother Win 8 or 10. Not being supported means we don't officially test with it, and we haven't heard of this issue on Win 8 or 10. Since this is hard to reproduce we're trying to narrow down the variables. We don't even know if this is an issue with 4.0 or something else yet.

Nowhere was it heavily implied that reading Ursa footage on Windows 7 could possibly lead to clips becoming corrupted, due to the way Firmware 4's file system works.

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On 11/3/2016 at 9:56 AM, Ehetyz said:

Another nail in the Ursa Mini coffin (at least in my view), yesterday in forum discussions about corrupt clips it came to light that Ursa Minis no longer officially support Windows 7 and it was heavily implied reading Ursa footage on Windows 7 could possibly lead to clips becoming corrupted, due to the way Firmware 4's file system works. 

https://forum.blackmagicdesign.com/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=53174

And thus I have completely stopped considering a Blackmagic product as the successor to BMCC. Time to look elsewhere.

Why do you still use Windows 7 anyway? That OS came out in 2009 it's 2016 already. Upgrade.

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2 hours ago, Cassius McGowan said:

Why do you still use Windows 7 anyway? That OS came out in 2009 it's 2016 already. Upgrade.

Indeed. Windows 7 doesn't even support USB 3.0, a sheer necessity when transferring camera raw files. Conservative folks who prefer to stick with older yet proven OS technology shouldn't expect that it will work with bleeding edge video technology that requires every bit of hardware and OS performance. Upgrading to a newer Windows version is a necessity if one wants to work with Resolve and a highly GPU-accelerated workflow. For a Windows 7 system, better work with software like Avid and Premiere, and cameras like the C300.

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6 minutes ago, cantsin said:

Indeed. Windows 7 doesn't even support USB 3.0, a sheer necessity when transferring camera raw files. Conservative folks who prefer to stick with older yet proven OS technology shouldn't expect that it will work with bleeding edge video technology that requires every bit of hardware and OS performance. Upgrading to a newer Windows version is a necessity if one wants to work with Resolve and a highly GPU-accelerated workflow. For a Windows 7 system, better work with software like Avid and Premiere, and cameras like the C300.

Wrong. USB 3.0, or any other piece of hardware, has nothing to do with the OS, but rather its own unique driver from its original manufacturer. With regards to USB 3.0, it has to do with the motherboard and the motherboard's drivers. If you install the drivers for your motherboard correctly, USB 3.0/3.1 works perfectly fine on Windows 7.

The reason many people use Windows 7, like myself, is due to its stability, simple GUI, and extensive service packs/updates.

Personally, I use Windows 7 64Bit as it can address up to, theoretically, 256TB of RAM (I have 64GB installed). In contrast, 32Bit operating systems can only address up to 4GB of RAM. Hence, a system running Windows 7 64Bit, with, say, only 8GB RAM installed, would trounce a system running Windows 10 32Bit with 4GB installed regarding memory management and overall efficiency.

Also, you are wrong again regarding video performance. Video performance has nothing to do with the OS either. It has do with how many CUDA Cores/Stream Processors your GPU has, the size, speed and bandwidth of its on-board RAM (i.e. 128bit, 192bit, 256bit, 384bit, 512bit), your GPU driver set, and whether or not your NLE supports CUDA/Stream Processing.

Windows 7 64Bit can handle any NLE. And it will for a long time. There is no need to upgrade to Windows 10, nor do I recommend it personally if your main concern is stability and memory management.

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Well, if you are comparing the 64bit edition of Windows 7 to the 32bit edition of Windows 10, you're comparing apples to oranges. Of course I was referring to the 64bit version of Windows 10. And Resolve won't run on Windows 7. With a Blackmagic Camera, you buy into a software/hardware ecosystem consisting of the camera and Resolve. It simply makes no sense using this when you're on Windows 7 - just as it makes no sense to use an end-to-end ProRes workflow without a Mac.

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37 minutes ago, cantsin said:

Well, if you are comparing the 64bit edition of Windows 7 to the 32bit edition of Windows 10, you're comparing apples to oranges. Of course I was referring to the 64bit version of Windows 10. And Resolve won't run on Windows 7. With a Blackmagic Camera, you buy into a software/hardware ecosystem consisting of the camera and Resolve. It simply makes no sense using this when you're on Windows 7 - just as it makes no sense to use an end-to-end ProRes workflow without a Mac.

I used the example of Windows 7 64bit vs Windows 10 32bit to highlight the fact that being "new" doesn't necessarily denote "better".

I am not sure where you are getting your information from - I'm running Windows 7 64Bit, and have DaVinci Resolve 12.5.3 running perfectly.
 

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1 hour ago, cantsin said:

Well, if you are comparing the 64bit edition of Windows 7 to the 32bit edition of Windows 10, you're comparing apples to oranges. Of course I was referring to the 64bit version of Windows 10. And Resolve won't run on Windows 7. With a Blackmagic Camera, you buy into a software/hardware ecosystem consisting of the camera and Resolve. It simply makes no sense using this when you're on Windows 7 - just as it makes no sense to use an end-to-end ProRes workflow without a Mac.

I have had used Resolve and USB 3.0 flawlessly for years before upgrading to Windows 10, in many ways Windows 7 was more stable and more compatible than Windows 10 is and there has been no performance increase that I have noticed specifically with Resolve. Windows boots up quicker and I see benifits in terms of the OS but not really with other programs. Since firmware updates will be necessary to fix the mirad of issues popping up it is a bit unfair to advertise Windows7 compatibility then drop it after the fact. 

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Once again, Blackmagic officially specifies that Resolve 12.5 and - even more significantly - Blackmagic Camera Utility require Windows 8.1 64bit or higher. Windows 7 is not supported. If people use it nevertheless and encounter problems in the workflow, they shouldn't complain. It's the same tiresome story as with people constantly complaining about unreliable recording and framedrops with BM cameras because again and again, they use unsupported SSDs/SD/Cfast cards.

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1 hour ago, TheRenaissanceMan said:

Apparently, the big Ursa 4K PL just dropped down to $3000 on B&H. Feels like a bad omen for people who bought into that body on the promise of future upgrades.

It's possible those just aren't selling, those are the PL V1. The V2 EF are still $5K. Plus the Turrets are still for sale. They once dropped the BMPCC down to $500, then later raised back to $1K. BM price changes are not good indicators.

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On 11/3/2016 at 1:56 AM, Ehetyz said:

Another nail in the Ursa Mini coffin (at least in my view), yesterday in forum discussions about corrupt clips it came to light that Ursa Minis no longer officially support Windows 7 and it was heavily implied reading Ursa footage on Windows 7 could possibly lead to clips becoming corrupted, due to the way Firmware 4's file system works. 

 

huh ?

They weren't corrupted.  They just couldn't be READ by that particular unsupported setup.

The user was able to put the card back in the camera and they played just fine.  They just couldn't read them. 

And in fact, BM themselves responded saying they weren't sure what the actual problem was in that instance, but the glaring obvious starting position is that it's an unsupported setup.

Carry on...

6 hours ago, Jonesy Jones said:

It's possible those just aren't selling, those are the PL V1. The V2 EF are still $5K. Plus the Turrets are still for sale. They once dropped the BMPCC down to $500, then later raised back to $1K. BM price changes are not good indicators.

Indeed, that's my take.  It's "old" stock that they're clearing out that have the original V1 4K sensor.  

JB

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8 hours ago, Simon Shasha said:

I used the example of Windows 7 64bit vs Windows 10 32bit to highlight the fact that being "new" doesn't necessarily denote "better".

By cherrypicking examples. Get over it, some software/hardware will not work on older operating systems. This is a fact of the industry.

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