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Petition for Samsung NX1 hack


kidzrevil
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On 9/29/2016 at 0:29 AM, kidzrevil said:

Yup a lens filter ! :-)

Yup it is major on textures and scenes with lots of motion & fine detail. I used to get pissed thinking the nx1 hated vintage lenses not realizing it was mostly cause the bitrate was too low

 

6 hours ago, tokhee said:

i use Filmcovert. you can add softness (i do about 20%) and also some film grain (30%). looks beautiful.

 

We really ought to start a new thread discussing the various methods of adding softness to neutralize the Samsung's sharpness.

 

14 hours ago, kinoseed said:

Sharpness: -10
Contrast: -5

I have never seen any problem with 4K and UHD.
With 1080p, you can try mounting the resolution on 4K or UHD (depending what FPS you need), and see if that helps.
ex: nx-ks menu > Custom Func. > Mod Resolutions > UHD as 1080p

I am on -10 always, but it's always been too sharp even then.

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1 hour ago, SR said:

 

We really ought to start a new thread discussing the various methods of adding softness to neutralize the Samsung's sharpness.

 

I am on -10 always, but it's always been too sharp even then.

It is not sharpness, it is resolution. It is due to the NX1 sensor being oversampled, which allows it to outresolve most other cameras out there.

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26 minutes ago, tugela said:

It is not sharpness, it is resolution. It is due to the NX1 sensor being oversampled, which allows it to outresolve most other cameras out there.

What about the Sony A7RII and A6300? I don't think they suffer from oversampled sharpness.

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2 hours ago, SR said:

 

We really ought to start a new thread discussing the various methods of adding softness to neutralize the Samsung's sharpness.

 

I am on -10 always, but it's always been too sharp even then.

Try lowering the contrast too, but at -10 I can't see any USM sharpening on the 4K/UHD
don't judge it on the camera screen, nor on your monitor unless you are looking at it full size on a 4K monitor.
Zoom to 100% and then check if it's too sharp, as resizing of the preview will make impossible to pass judgement on that.
If you are using Premiere for export to lower resolution, make sure you check the option that makes high-quality resize.

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9 minutes ago, kinoseed said:

Try lowering the contrast too, but at -10 I can't see any USM sharpening on the 4K/UHD
don't judge it on the camera screen, nor on your monitor unless you are looking at it full size on a 4K monitor.
Zoom to 100% and then check if it's too sharp, as resizing of the preview will make impossible to pass judgement on that.
If you are using Premiere for export to lower resolution, make sure you check the option that makes high-quality resize.

I use MPC-HC for viewing in 1080p monitor. And I have used sharpening setting 0 all the time. If I look the picture in MPC-HC choosing in the menu View/Video Frame/Normal Size, the picture should look as it would in 4k monitor (very large one though). The picture doesn't look too sharp to me.

In 1080p monitor the picture looks maybe little too sharp if video is sized to that.

I hope I can buy a 4K monitor+GPU soon (waiting for the prices go down) Then I could see if the NX1 picture is too sharp for me.

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1 hour ago, BopBill said:

I use MPC-HC for viewing in 1080p monitor. And I have used sharpening setting 0 all the time. If I look the picture in MPC-HC choosing in the menu View/Video Frame/Normal Size, the picture should look as it would in 4k monitor (very large one though). The picture doesn't look too sharp to me.

In 1080p monitor the picture looks maybe little too sharp if video is sized to that.

I hope I can buy a 4K monitor+GPU soon (waiting for the prices go down) Then I could see if the NX1 picture is too sharp for me.

If your player gives you an option to choose resizing algorithm, try "lanczos", but I really don't see "sharpening" as an issue.

re original issue: Destroying the footage with "softening" just to look good when you playback 4K on 1080p (when your player uses poor resizing algorithm) does not make sense.

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43 minutes ago, Otto K said:

It's probably slightly off topic but had anyone succeeded with nx500 and ninja2 or similar 1080p30 external recorder? 

A friend  has it but  it's not showing anything due to 60fps output. 

The Shogun works just fine on the NX1 and NX500 although utterly useless with the bitrate hack, the Blackmagic Video Assist also worked on my NX1 and NX500 when I tried it from a friend of mine who owns it. 

Although I do not know why you would want to use an external recorder with the NX500 over using the bitrate hack? It basically yields the same results except one spits out H265 and the other a big ProRes or DNxHD(R) file

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I'm just trying to help a friend with ninja2 who's having problems (ie, nothing on it) and he's not near so I could help him in person. His problem is that nx500 seems locked to 60Hz output over HDMI and apparently ninja 2 supports only up to 30Hz in 1080p (it does 60 at 1080i).

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5 hours ago, Otto K said:

I'm just trying to help a friend with ninja2 who's having problems (ie, nothing on it) and he's not near so I could help him in person. His problem is that nx500 seems locked to 60Hz output over HDMI and apparently ninja 2 supports only up to 30Hz in 1080p (it does 60 at 1080i).

Are you sure the frame-rate is the problem?

st cap capdtm getusr HDMIOUT
The possible settings are: 576P / 720P / 1080I / UD / UD_4K

I know in the menu for HDMI out it says 1080p, but I don't see it in the settings.

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On ‎10‎/‎1‎/‎2016 at 1:38 AM, SR said:

What about the Sony A7RII and A6300? I don't think they suffer from oversampled sharpness.

The A7R2 does not oversample in FF mode, which is why the crop mode has better quality. Also, an image may be oversampled, but unless it fully reads a 6K image it will not be able to reproduce full 4K resolution after debeyering. The Sony cameras, even in optimal modes, do not reach the resolution the NX1 does, so they are probably using a smaller pixel set, or the downsampling is being down in a crude manner (probably because of computational limitations, which we know places limits on the Sony processors.

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22 hours ago, Otto K said:

I'm just trying to help a friend with ninja2 who's having problems (ie, nothing on it) and he's not near so I could help him in person. His problem is that nx500 seems locked to 60Hz output over HDMI and apparently ninja 2 supports only up to 30Hz in 1080p (it does 60 at 1080i).

I think that has more to do with with the limit of the Atomos Ninja 2, I had a look in the manual of it and found that it does not support anything above 30fps in progressive scan.

Quote

Frame rates 1080p; 24/SF24/25/SF25/30/SF30
1080i; 50/60i
720p; 50/60p
SD 480i, 576i

Only the older Samsung cameras can do 1080 interlaced, so that is your problem you are trying to receive an interlaced signal but the camera has none, there is no interlacing settings in the NX1 nor the NX500, you would have to buy the vintage dinosaur called the Canon 5DM4 to get interlaced video analogue style, jokes aside, the recorder does not support 60p only 60i and the NX500 only shoots 60p and no 60i, I hope that helps

EDIT:
It is easier to just shoot 1080p60 with the hack in-camera instead of slapping on the external recorders, the only point I see is if he needs an extra monitor or needs multiple audio sources as the Ninja 2 apparently can do 4 audio tracks.

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17 hours ago, tugela said:

The A7R2 does not oversample in FF mode, which is why the crop mode has better quality. Also, an image may be oversampled, but unless it fully reads a 6K image it will not be able to reproduce full 4K resolution after debeyering. The Sony cameras, even in optimal modes, do not reach the resolution the NX1 does, so they are probably using a smaller pixel set, or the downsampling is being down in a crude manner (probably because of computational limitations, which we know places limits on the Sony processors.

NX1 continues to astound me.

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The worst thing about high iso in video, is that it's much worse than the same high iso in a raw still image. Take a (still) picture at ISO 3200, resize it (downsample) to 4k and compare it to a frame grabbed from the video of the same subject. The difference is HUGE, at least one stop, but I guess more.

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@Marco Tecno yeah ! I truly believe that the in camera sharpening has something to do with how the nx1 renders detail throughout the iso range. I will test shooting at the default level of sharpening with master pedestal all the way up and see what happens. I have a strong feeling the noise reduction algorithim and the in camera sharpening work hand in hand

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