solovetski

Probably the most honest review, he got the camera to overheat on his couch while just menu diving and it overheat in FIVE minutes in 4K60p while shooting outdoors in non summer Florida:
 
Its expected in June so well after all the reviews will be out. 

At the risk of going off topic, I also remember when on video forums people would post videos that they had made!
It's the same everywhere else. On FB groups people post pics of their setup rather than something that they shot with it.
By the way I think it's worth pointing out that the original post of this topic was something along the lines of "does 14bit give noticeably better colour?". It's a perfectly valid question or talking point for discussion about one aspect of image quality, and has nothing whatsoever to do with lighting, story, frosted glass or frosted flakes or whatever somebody had for their breakfast... So to veer off into those topics is to miss the point of this thread.
Now, here's a video! This is the last project I shot on the 5D3. Hope you like slow cinema!
 

Honestly, I don't even know what we're talking about anymore.
I am just a hobbyist who has been using a 5D Mark III with 1080p ML Raw for the past 5-6 years as I attempt to make a few short films in my spare time. I'm hardly chasing cameras. I picked up a Sigma FP a few months ago, on a whim, and I like it. It has a nice image, I can't say for sure that it's a better image than the 5D though. I assumed the 14bit color from the 5D may be evening out the playing field, but what do I know... as I said... I'm not a professional like you guys are.
I've always been a writer first, so story is the most important thing to me, but I'm not delusional enough to think I am going to sell a screenplay or make a film that will have any impact on anything. I enjoy doing it, though and I suppose there are worse things I could spend my money on.
Next year I may buy a camcorder, making movies was a lot more fun back when camcorders were the only option for zero budget filmmakers.
I will end with this, though. Since we're all being so brutally honest... none of these cameras look that good. If you're shooting with a P4K and a Sigma zoom, or a 5D3 with ML Raw... they all look amateurish. So when you guys attack other people for their choices... remember your choices probably look questionable as well.
Then again, I've never seen any of your work, so maybe you guy's are artistic geniuses, but how could anyone know... only a few people share any of their work on this forum and when they do, the posts about the next best camera gets way more attention...
Good luck to you. 

I think there are better cameras out there for what this camera is marketed for, but for those who've spent the last several years watching YouTubers gush about the A7Siii or the FX3 but couldn't afford one, I think this will be popular with them. I think we forget that the "famous" YouTubers are but a small fraction of those trying to create successful YouTube channels. There are millions of people on there trying to become the next big YouTuber but with limited resources. This is a camera that will probably appeal to them. They were probably ready to whip their credit cards out the second every reviewer said "it's like a A7Siii but for half the price."

eh, if you're rolling for hours (days even!) covering some random small business conference in a hotel that's only going to be put on YT (or perhaps even only used internally) then 8bit is perfectly fine. 

The obsession with IQ is getting out of hand here, 10bit, 12 bit, 14 bit seems to be negligible from the tests.  Story, set design, lighting, sound, music, framing, lenses, etc. are more important then bit depth imo. Possession of Hannah grace 8bit 422(a7sii), 8bit 422 knock knock (1dc) and others released in festivals, streaming platforms proves that.  Obviously people are biased and want the best possible and that’s great but 14 bit image isn’t everything to the overall average audience (same with 8k).  All things subjective, filmmakers can shoot with whatever they want.

Blind tests aren't of much use. The zakuto blind tests says that a GH1 and 35mm film are equal. So why didn't camera development stop there? It would indicate 10 bit log, 4k, high bitrate, and anything beyond 8 stops of dynamic range, doesn't really matter. Cameras aren't developed or sold on blind tests. I don't think any professional is choosing a camera based on blind tests either. They have certainly offered no use to me.

You can argue IQ has nothing to do with making a pleasing looking image. That is definitely true in many ways. But it has nothing to do with marketing. You can say that marketing is all bullshit. I'd agree with that. 8k is useless for 99% of people yet it is a great buzzword for marketing. You are saying though that 14 bit recording is useless and blind tests somehow prove this.

If you are simply trying to say that 14 bit isn't marketable, that could be true. I am not a marketing specialist.  But camera companies don't use blind tests to market or else they would all be out of business.

In my experience when you actually use a camera on production and work with it through post, then you see a difference. There isn't really much debate there. Can a film look good that isn't shot on a cinema camera? Yes of course. But cameras like ARRI and RED are industry favored by pretty much any DP you would ask.

To me DP's are usually the last people to fall for marketing hype. These people see images constantly from production all the way to the finished product. ARRI isn't favored because of internet blind tests, they are favored because they actually make production and post workflow much easier. I'd love it if my S1 could give me the same image as an Alexa. But from my experience it just doesn't.

If you want a good test of a camera shoot 100 different scenes in all different scenarios, time restraints, lighting conditions, different sized crews, and then color correct and grade all of the shots and scenes. Do that with 5 different cameras and than compare them all. Well that couldn't be put in a little 5 minute youtube video. Stuff that is actually helpful can't be compressed into a little youtube video. Experience gotten from months of shooting and in post gives one a good idea of what matters.

Anyways 14 bit plus capture, even if it is just the readout is the way forward to better IQ imo. The Alexa shooting in 422 is still using a 14 bit readout. That is partially why it looks way better than cameras that are shooting 12 bit linear raw, which is a marketing scam.  12 bit linear raw really doesn't give you any more information to work with than a good 10 bit ALL-I. The advantage is it sometimes gets around the horrid internal processing many cameras do to their 10 bit options for some reason. But it also often reveals how shitty consumer sensors are in the shadows, bad colored noise and banding that is normally hidden by heavy noise reduction.

The Alexa has a 14 bit readout regardless of if you shoot 422 or 444 or RAW.

Anyways I am just expressing my disappointment in camera development. I would extend that disappointment to the high end cameras as well. RED is partially to blame in my opinion. They pushed the whole high resolution band wagon that consumer cameras jumped on. 10 years later and the best camera in the world the Alexa 35 only shoots 4k, while RED releases cameras for 1/2 what they did their previous line-up, with sensors that can't even match ARRI's 5 year old cameras. 13 years ago the Alexa came onto the market, the camera that replaced film essentially. 13 years later it's still the best sensor on the market, only surpassed by ARRI's own Alexa 35.

It's unfortunate resolution got put on the forefront of development instead of color depth, which also leads to increased dynamic range.

Am I saying the 5D MK3 is the pinnacle of image quality? No I am not. But it was capable of giving you a high bitrate 14 bit 1080p image. That was 11 years ago. Why can't we have 14 bit RAW 3K-4K in a small prosumer camera 11 years later. We get the same releases with a MK2 slapped onto it, with micro improvements. Very annoying.

Now you can tell me these are first world problems and I will gladly agree. I am in between projects right now and don't have any kids, so I have the time. And if this forum is not the place to vent about the BS that camera companies do than maybe I am just very confused.

 

Hero 11 shoots "IMAX":
Yes, the true IMAX aspect ratio (1.43:1) from the full Hero 11 8/7 sensor (and 10bit color).
The uploaded video has no horizontal bars, nor are sides cutoff - there is just more vertical resolution, useful for filming large spaces like Grand Central Terminal. Looks great on Apple Pro laptops, which are less widescreen.
5.3K resolution is more than some (ARRI) IMAX-approved cameras.
No, this does not make me Christopher Nolan.
Thank you for your cooperation.

OK, now we have with the latest GoPro Labs firmware the ability to use a color gamut (WIDE) that contains all the color the sensor can recognize, way wider than REC709. Leeming makes a LUT that transforms the WIDE gamut to REC709. This is the test video I shot using the Flog (Fuji) gamma setting, WIDE 10bit color, and graded using the Leeming LUT:
 

In a blink of an eye we're going to enter the "Web 4.0" era within a few years, when there is more AI written content on the internet than there is human written content. And you won't be able to tell the difference. 

One less pointless trip to the stratosphere (barely space!) would run DPR for 4 or 5 lives!
The forum there had a very strong NX presence, I hope we can attract here most of that traffic, even thought there are too many hobbyists and newbies, which I am not sure if they are the right target group for eoshd, still, it is a possibility..

The problem with Japanese camera makers is that they don't know how to make money anymore. You want to attract younger customers, you have to support the platforms that encourage them to use dedicated cameras. That's about a combination of knowledge and culture. Its a shame that these days its Apple, the king of parental "auto everything", that advocates manual control for its iphone cinematic mode. The Apple way of "manual" of course. Soon they change the taste of an entire generation to believe 60fps is artistic! Dedicated camera needs its own narrative to survive, and we're losing the narrative. 

I have gotten to where I shoot almost exclusively with the R7 for events and hybrid photo/video work. For talking heads, long form content, concerts, etc. where the camera can be locked down and audio is more important then I use the C70. For commercial shoots and things like music videos I typically combine the C70 with the R7 as the b-cam.
For audio when running and gunning I typically use just a shotgun mic, the Canon EF 24-105mm F4.0 lens and get pretty close to the subject to try to reduce background noise. When I am working with an onscreen personality doing impromptu interviews at events then I use a Sennheiser handheld mic and G4 receiver. For talking head work I use a Sennheiser G4 transmitter and receiver combined with a mini-XLR shotgun mic into the C70.
Some of it is depending on budget as well. If the budget is pretty low I will just use the R7 simply because I don't see the point in bringing the C70 to a lower budget shoot unless it will drastically improve my workflow. If the budget is high enough then I will use the C70 even for shots that I would typically shoot with the R7 (i.e. I will rig up the C70 on a gimbal if the budget is high enough, and forgo the R7's IBIS for the C70's improved DR/IQ when shooting handheld). 
At the end of the day I definitely make my camera selections based on the project type. If the project is 90% photography and 10% video then I will probably use the R5. If its 50/50 photography/video then I will use the R7, if I need two cameras then I will pair the R7 with the C70, if its 100% video then the budget and audio requirements will make me choose the C70 or R7, etc. etc. 
The great thing about the R7, R5, and C70 is that none of them need much rigging to work and all of them will produce great quality with or without rigging/lighting. I know BM cameras tend to need more rigging/lighting to get the best results which is why with my setup I can use any camera for anything from run and gun to studio work.

The idea of editorial independence was enshrined in the BBC’s founding Royal Charter in 1927, which stated the corporation should be “independent in all matters of internal control.” This was a way of ensuring the BBC’s coverage was not subject to political interference or pressure from any external sources such as the government.
Now the editorial independence of the BBC is at best completely neutered by the Conservative Party. Many talented journalists have left. In many respects the best news organisation in the world has taken to sourcing stories purely from Twitter and social media.
https://www.eoshd.com/news/controversy-at-the-bbc-and-impartialitys-true-meaning/

On a side note, I never liked the term "creator" from the start. It's pretentious. 
No matter how awesome a video I make is, I didn't cReAte anything. I captured something that God created, and edited it into something cool. I produced something, but I didn't create shit.
Imagine an architect looking at a building he/she designed and declaring: "I created this". 
But it makes people who make a basic-ass video or reel feel good and important, so that's one of the reasons it's so popular IMO.
/rant.

I took this path more than a year ago for several reasons.
    1. BRAW. Using BMPCC 4K realized how good BRAW is  
            - various degree of compression and file size
            - ability to adjust white balance
            - great support in Davinci Resolve,
            - smooth playback, scrubbing and editing
One of the main reason I've choose Panasonic, instead of Sony or Canon was support of external BRAW recording. Only Panasonic and Nikon cameras had it. But Panasonic support is better as it gives you 6K and no line skipping, auto focus was not a problem for me because can use manual focus for 100% of what I shoot
The other reason was price. Even then Panasonic S5 almost new from the box but second hand costed me 1100 Euro. Cheaper than BMPCC 4K which new came at 1400 Euro. If we add speedbooster and monitor price is also pretty much comparable to Panasonic S5 + Video Assist
    2.     BMPCC 4K is great but it's difficult to shoot without external monitor. Maybe it's just me but without a good 1500+ nits monitor which sits at 45 to 90 degree to the top of the camera or camera + cage + top handle it was really difficult and painful to shoot. In general I find that the most convenient, practical and useful setup for professional or serious shoots is camera + cage + top handle + monitor. It adds weight which is good for stability and it makes shooting so much easier. If we add the monitor to BMPCC 4K, then in terms and weight and size Panasonic S5 + BM Video Assist, suddenly became almost identical to BMPCC + monitor and even more compact in terms of length. Panasonic S5 can be used on most gimbals, BMPCC 4K on just a few. If I stayed only with BMPCC 4K had to buy a new gimbal. Sometimes it is great to be able to shoot with one small camera and lens, similar to the reporter style of Henri Cartier-Bresson. But BMPCC 4K is not good at this. It lacks EVF and is too big in length. Panasonic S5 on the other hand is. For those shoots I can skip the recorder and use 10bit 4:2:2 internal codec which is also very good or simply put the recorder in a bag and have a small and tiny HDMI cable hanging on the side.
    3. BMPCC 4K sensor size. I used Metabones speedbooster x0.64 and in term of DOF and bokeh this camera and setup were great. However crop factor is kind of weird - 1.21, can't use my primes lens sets on their specific focal length. No big deal but still kind of problematic. With Panasonic S5 any vintage lens has exactly the same focal length / angle degree it was designed for.
Panasonic S5 + BM Video Assist 5'' 12G solves most of BMPCC 4K shortcomings like poor battery life, lack of EVF, IBIS and smaller sensor size. Plus it is a great photo camera on it's own. Plus it could be used without BM Video Assist 5'' and will still give great image quality.
Shortcomings of Panasonic S5 + Video Assist: Micro HDMI, always kind of problematic, needs special attention and mini cage with a clamp to hold it on place or micro HDMI to HDMI adapter clamped to a cage as well. You need a bigger bag in order to be able to put camera and recorder together as one piece but same is true for BMPCC 4K + monitor. You have to start / stop two different devices.
In general I find  S5 + BM Video Assist to be more convenient and enjoyable camera setup than BMPCC 4K + monitor + speedbooster. New S5 II solves the micro HDMI port problem and adds tracking auto focus. Can we call it cinema camera ? Yes, with BRAW it certainly is capable to deliver high picture quality.

Yeah, I don't know the ins and outs of the arrangement but there are certainly slim pickings when it comes to DX lenses in Z mount (although there are a number of them on the lens roadmap) so these Sigma lenses certainly fill a gap for Nikon to encourage sales of the two DX cameras.
Canon have the same issue with their RF-S range being small and exclusively fairly slow zooms so could also really do with these Sigma lenses for their R-50.
Looks like a triumph of pragmatism over ideology to me but, knowing my terrible prediction skills, Canon will now launch a raft of RF-S lenses next week 🙂

No I didn't just go by what Andrew said, I looked at it for myself, and the R8 is missing the back wheel around the joystick which I use on literally every single shoot, they moved the photo/video switch to the left side which means I would need to let go of my side handle to flip the switch vs the R7 which is on the right side and right under my thumb allowing me to instantly switch from photos to quick video clips during events, and last but not least it is even smaller and lighter than the R7.
When shooting video handheld I like big heavy cameras, the bigger and heavier the better for stability especially since Canon has IBIS wobble problems with wider lenses. The R7 with a cage and side/top handles is the perfect size for me, big enough to easily rig heavier but small enough to quickly strip down to a gimbal camera.
I never use the touch screen to focus, that would mean I would need to take one hand off of the camera and touch the screen. I stick to center cross hairs and keep both hands on the camera. The R5, R7, and C70 all have a back wheel which I use to quickly adjust the aperture or shutter speed without letting go of the camera. Only my Canon Rebel doesn't have a back wheel and for that camera I don't care since it is just a timelapse camera.
So yes, I did reach my own conclusions that the R8 is not as ergonomically friendly to my specific shooting style as the R5 or R7 and is closer in ergonomics to my Canon Rebel.
I will never get a camera with a single card slot when dual card slots are available on so many cameras. Many more things can happen to footage vs just the card going bad or the camera stopping the recording. I shoot event work and most of my customers re-hire me year after year, all it would take is one year of lost footage for them to hire someone else leading to much more lost revenue than the cost of getting dual slots. Computers can get infected with viruses that wipe out your footage, if you are transferring the raw footage onsite with the client their computer could be infected, or their card reader could fry your card, etc. etc. None of this has happened to me but I have had a few clips disappear in the middle of a project (possibly accidentally deleted or overwritten) and I have used the second card to get it back.  With equipment being so good these days sometimes the only thing separating the professional from the beginner is the level of preparation for when things go wrong.
When I need multiple cameras for a project I pair the R7 with the R5 or C70, if I had to buy an additional camera body tomorrow then I would just buy another R7. If your budget is $3K and you need two camera bodies then I would recommend two R7s, that way they can share batteries and accessories, menus and ergonomics are identical, etc. I just really don't see what the big deal is about shooting FF or non-line skipped 4K60FPS. RS doesn't bother me since I don't shoot fast action. 
As I mention in many of my posts, these are just my opinions, my workflow, and what works for me, in today's times, there's something for everyone.

Competition is good isn’t it.  Why not share the pie, it would be boring if it’s just Sony and Canon.  I’m thankful that there are Sigmas, Panasonic, black magic, Fuji, Leica, DJI etc. because they offer different things for different users.  It’s not like these brands are gonna die anytime soon, there are fan bases for them.  There all just tools anyways and filmmakers/videographers/photographers are just trying to find the right tool that works for them, there’s nothing wrong about someone being interested in choosing L-mount/Z/fx mount/?, just because they don’t have a high-end cinema line.  

Maybe because it can oversample a FF 24 mpix sensors at 60 fps 10 bit with full AF and can shoot 40fps 12 bit RAW pictures with full AF and AE.
40 fps RAW I believe it makes it the fastest FF RAW camera (with the R6 ii)…. just a few years ago you would need to buy a 1Dx class camera for 12/14 fps RAW….
But I finally find your problem with this camera … is not a Panasonic 🤣🤣

That's what so-called pundits where expecting three years ago when the original R6 dropped. Still hasn't happened, not even in the sub-$4K range. So who's going to do it? Sony? Nope, they won't put a new FF sensor that will cannibalise their best selling A7IV inside a $1500 camera. Besides FF 40K60p 10-bit sensor won't work in the tiny A7C body. Panasonic? They just released S5ii, have S5iiX planned with no FF4K60p and they don't do $1500 cameras. Who's left.. slow-poke Nikon? We're still waiting on Z8 (a $4K camera). 
Like it or not Canon have been pioneering quite a number of things in their mirrorless range, including 6K/8K internal RAW cameras. Something only the $6K Z9 can currently do. So yeah sometimes you just gotta give them credit where credit is due. Too easy to just dismiss it by saying no big deal, someone else will do the same soon when they've literally proven to be years ahead. 

Check out Lok's R8 test, he sticked it in his oven set at 37 degrees Celsius and it ran for an 1h10mn in 4K25p after what his SD was full and he stopped testing it, the new temp meter was only at about 3 bars. The R50 overheated immediately upon turning on after his initial 5mn off warm up. R8 battery life was I think 53mn (you'll have to check) in those conditions which isn't great but not totally bad.
Totally understandable. Not too many scenarios for the EOSHD crowd to go for an R8, we're not really the target. Places like Cined, Gerald Undone etc haven't even bothered reviewing it. Heck even the R5/R6/R5C barely get any traction. Canon is absolutely hated on by pundits. That said, on the field, or even right here, most Canon users are working pros, shooting silently and getting paid while others circle jerk over their bonus features shooting alleys and trees in glorious anamorphic splendour and wobble free stability. Being slightly facetious here, I think all cameras are pretty great right now compared to just a generation or two ago.

Are you serious?
We should compare to cameras that may be released in the future and thus we should be here saying that is meh release because it will be surpassed in the future?!? Because you, alias Nostradamus 🙂, thinks that in 6-12 months there will be (and I actually hope so) better cameras in this class?

But yes if you remove the super sampled 4k with no crop 24-60p, the great AF, the fast still fps, the 10 bit log, the good rolling shutter, the hybrid hot shoe, it is a crappy release... but guess what great AF and great 4k 24-60 image with AF is what many people want.  

I have also a prediction then, with the "next 6 to 12 months camera on the same price brackets" people can take artifacts free, rolling shutter free and noise free image, by using 0 space on the card compared to the R8 because it does not exit 😁

You don't like canon and is fine but I really don't get what is your contribution here as it not facts based and only hypothetical future predictions that does not help anybody that needs a camera today. 

Canon has changed a lot on the video side and most of the new release have really good video capacity with great AF:

C70 4k RAW
R5 8K RAW, 4k 120
R5c 8K RAW 60P with Cinema OS
R3 6K RAW 60p
R6, R6 II, R8 super sampled 4k 60 10bit CLog 3
R7 super sampled S35 4k 60 10bit CLog 3

Times are changed from the Canon that was not innovating and holding back tons of features on the video sides. Are these camera perfect no, are their competitive in their respective price bracket yes. Just a few years ago RP and R where really meh released for video.

The fact that a 1500$ gives you most of the feature that the others much more expensive cameras give you is the good story. And let's not discuss on the stills side that for the sports/actions photographer a R8 will do better in many scenarios than 6k$ 1Dx III (and I owned the 1Dx III)

 

It is time for a good old fashioned EOSHD article. Everything you’ve seen so far on YouTube is meaningless - yes it is.
Check out a new novelty on the web... with my WRITTEN BLOG POST!
https://www.eoshd.com/news/is-n-raw-real-raw-nikon-z9-under-the-spotlight-at-eoshd
 

I had similar thoughts. However, I was most surprised by the AF that looked surprisingly similar given the AF upgrade on the S5ii. Clearly, you'd trust it more in a Youtube situation. However, after watching Blooms' Sony video on "manual autofocus", I decided that manual AF is the way to go, even in 2023 for a lot of content. You end up putting way too much trust in the technology and fiddling around with settings when you could simply do another take if you know you missed it.
It would seem there's an unhealthy paranoia around focus in general. Talk to a YouTuber and they'd say it's the most important point on a camera with seemingly higher standards than Hollywood... for YouTube. It's a strange world we live in.
Concerning the DR Boost, I was also surprised he didn't use it. He should have because all the frame rates that the S5ii is capable of, the GH6 CAN use DR Boost. Also, that crop for 60fps is only mildly bigger that the GH6 60fps 4K.
The IBIS on the S5ii looks good on the wide end, but would seriously doubt the long end looking better than the GH6. Also, they was only 1 shot.