seanzzxx

Mr. Reid, I don't know you and I won't pretend to understand what you are going through, so please do not take this statement the wrong way. However, when you say you are 'feeling really quite down', do you think that your current mental wellbeing is served by continuing to have this discussion? By arguing (no matter how justified) with people on these forums, your blog and Facebook page (all three of which you seem to hold very dear and personal, something which I understand).
In my opinion you absolutely did the right thing by locking up this thread temporarily, and my advice to you would be to do it again. Why revel in this energy-consuming discussion? I get that you're dissapointed and feel sleighted by Blackmagic's decision no to hand you the camera for early review, something only exacerbated by the fact that the event was in your own home-time. That must have honestly felt like shit. Nonetheless, scratching the wound left by this event (by returning to the discussion over and over again on these forums) might feel satisfying in the short-term, but it is absolutely not conducive to it healing. I suspect you are not gaining any longterm insight or satisfaction by having this discussion in this manner, and even worse, you might be worsening you're already crummy mood because you are now infecting this website with a discussion that 1) will make it harder to take back anything you say in anger because it is now done in a very public way, and 2) taints your very personal project with a negativity that you probably don't want in your life. Finally, in your anger you might end up taking actions or saying things that will end up doing damage to this project (eoshd.com) which you obviously hold so dear to you.
My advice (but hey, who am I) to you would be to give yourself a break - delete the blogpost you made, lock this thread and go for a walk/watch a movie/have a nice dinner with friends. Seriously do anything else for a while instead of having this situation drag you down. When you come back, delete this entire tangent and have this thread be about the Pocket 4K again. If you find Blackmagic's answer to your emails not satisfactory in the future, just don't cover them anymore if it makes you feel better. I just don't believe it is conducive to your wellbeing by dragging the argument into the public (and very ill-informed) sphere.
Hope that all makes sense. Thank you for your passion and thanks for hosting this site.

Mr. Reid, I don't know you and I won't pretend to understand what you are going through, so please do not take this statement the wrong way. However, when you say you are 'feeling really quite down', do you think that your current mental wellbeing is served by continuing to have this discussion? By arguing (no matter how justified) with people on these forums, your blog and Facebook page (all three of which you seem to hold very dear and personal, something which I understand).
In my opinion you absolutely did the right thing by locking up this thread temporarily, and my advice to you would be to do it again. Why revel in this energy-consuming discussion? I get that you're dissapointed and feel sleighted by Blackmagic's decision no to hand you the camera for early review, something only exacerbated by the fact that the event was in your own home-time. That must have honestly felt like shit. Nonetheless, scratching the wound left by this event (by returning to the discussion over and over again on these forums) might feel satisfying in the short-term, but it is absolutely not conducive to it healing. I suspect you are not gaining any longterm insight or satisfaction by having this discussion in this manner, and even worse, you might be worsening you're already crummy mood because you are now infecting this website with a discussion that 1) will make it harder to take back anything you say in anger because it is now done in a very public way, and 2) taints your very personal project with a negativity that you probably don't want in your life. Finally, in your anger you might end up taking actions or saying things that will end up doing damage to this project (eoshd.com) which you obviously hold so dear to you.
My advice (but hey, who am I) to you would be to give yourself a break - delete the blogpost you made, lock this thread and go for a walk/watch a movie/have a nice dinner with friends. Seriously do anything else for a while instead of having this situation drag you down. When you come back, delete this entire tangent and have this thread be about the Pocket 4K again. If you find Blackmagic's answer to your emails not satisfactory in the future, just don't cover them anymore if it makes you feel better. I just don't believe it is conducive to your wellbeing by dragging the argument into the public (and very ill-informed) sphere.
Hope that all makes sense. Thank you for your passion and thanks for hosting this site.

Mr. Reid, I don't know you and I won't pretend to understand what you are going through, so please do not take this statement the wrong way. However, when you say you are 'feeling really quite down', do you think that your current mental wellbeing is served by continuing to have this discussion? By arguing (no matter how justified) with people on these forums, your blog and Facebook page (all three of which you seem to hold very dear and personal, something which I understand).
In my opinion you absolutely did the right thing by locking up this thread temporarily, and my advice to you would be to do it again. Why revel in this energy-consuming discussion? I get that you're dissapointed and feel sleighted by Blackmagic's decision no to hand you the camera for early review, something only exacerbated by the fact that the event was in your own home-time. That must have honestly felt like shit. Nonetheless, scratching the wound left by this event (by returning to the discussion over and over again on these forums) might feel satisfying in the short-term, but it is absolutely not conducive to it healing. I suspect you are not gaining any longterm insight or satisfaction by having this discussion in this manner, and even worse, you might be worsening you're already crummy mood because you are now infecting this website with a discussion that 1) will make it harder to take back anything you say in anger because it is now done in a very public way, and 2) taints your very personal project with a negativity that you probably don't want in your life. Finally, in your anger you might end up taking actions or saying things that will end up doing damage to this project (eoshd.com) which you obviously hold so dear to you.
My advice (but hey, who am I) to you would be to give yourself a break - delete the blogpost you made, lock this thread and go for a walk/watch a movie/have a nice dinner with friends. Seriously do anything else for a while instead of having this situation drag you down. When you come back, delete this entire tangent and have this thread be about the Pocket 4K again. If you find Blackmagic's answer to your emails not satisfactory in the future, just don't cover them anymore if it makes you feel better. I just don't believe it is conducive to your wellbeing by dragging the argument into the public (and very ill-informed) sphere.
Hope that all makes sense. Thank you for your passion and thanks for hosting this site.

As if I hadn't already said that I came here to participate in the forum. Not like I joined just to insult you. You aren't the draw of the forum, at least not for me, and I'm sure for most members of this forum. I didn't join this place to get closer to prestigious Andrew Reid. I joined so that I can participate in discussions with the likes of people like Captain Hook and John Brawley.

Seriously, from a guy who has an ego of his own, you really need to get yours under control. 

Mr. Reid, I don't know you and I won't pretend to understand what you are going through, so please do not take this statement the wrong way. However, when you say you are 'feeling really quite down', do you think that your current mental wellbeing is served by continuing to have this discussion? By arguing (no matter how justified) with people on these forums, your blog and Facebook page (all three of which you seem to hold very dear and personal, something which I understand).
In my opinion you absolutely did the right thing by locking up this thread temporarily, and my advice to you would be to do it again. Why revel in this energy-consuming discussion? I get that you're dissapointed and feel sleighted by Blackmagic's decision no to hand you the camera for early review, something only exacerbated by the fact that the event was in your own home-time. That must have honestly felt like shit. Nonetheless, scratching the wound left by this event (by returning to the discussion over and over again on these forums) might feel satisfying in the short-term, but it is absolutely not conducive to it healing. I suspect you are not gaining any longterm insight or satisfaction by having this discussion in this manner, and even worse, you might be worsening you're already crummy mood because you are now infecting this website with a discussion that 1) will make it harder to take back anything you say in anger because it is now done in a very public way, and 2) taints your very personal project with a negativity that you probably don't want in your life. Finally, in your anger you might end up taking actions or saying things that will end up doing damage to this project (eoshd.com) which you obviously hold so dear to you.
My advice (but hey, who am I) to you would be to give yourself a break - delete the blogpost you made, lock this thread and go for a walk/watch a movie/have a nice dinner with friends. Seriously do anything else for a while instead of having this situation drag you down. When you come back, delete this entire tangent and have this thread be about the Pocket 4K again. If you find Blackmagic's answer to your emails not satisfactory in the future, just don't cover them anymore if it makes you feel better. I just don't believe it is conducive to your wellbeing by dragging the argument into the public (and very ill-informed) sphere.
Hope that all makes sense. Thank you for your passion and thanks for hosting this site.

Mr. Reid, I don't know you and I won't pretend to understand what you are going through, so please do not take this statement the wrong way. However, when you say you are 'feeling really quite down', do you think that your current mental wellbeing is served by continuing to have this discussion? By arguing (no matter how justified) with people on these forums, your blog and Facebook page (all three of which you seem to hold very dear and personal, something which I understand).
In my opinion you absolutely did the right thing by locking up this thread temporarily, and my advice to you would be to do it again. Why revel in this energy-consuming discussion? I get that you're dissapointed and feel sleighted by Blackmagic's decision no to hand you the camera for early review, something only exacerbated by the fact that the event was in your own home-time. That must have honestly felt like shit. Nonetheless, scratching the wound left by this event (by returning to the discussion over and over again on these forums) might feel satisfying in the short-term, but it is absolutely not conducive to it healing. I suspect you are not gaining any longterm insight or satisfaction by having this discussion in this manner, and even worse, you might be worsening you're already crummy mood because you are now infecting this website with a discussion that 1) will make it harder to take back anything you say in anger because it is now done in a very public way, and 2) taints your very personal project with a negativity that you probably don't want in your life. Finally, in your anger you might end up taking actions or saying things that will end up doing damage to this project (eoshd.com) which you obviously hold so dear to you.
My advice (but hey, who am I) to you would be to give yourself a break - delete the blogpost you made, lock this thread and go for a walk/watch a movie/have a nice dinner with friends. Seriously do anything else for a while instead of having this situation drag you down. When you come back, delete this entire tangent and have this thread be about the Pocket 4K again. If you find Blackmagic's answer to your emails not satisfactory in the future, just don't cover them anymore if it makes you feel better. I just don't believe it is conducive to your wellbeing by dragging the argument into the public (and very ill-informed) sphere.
Hope that all makes sense. Thank you for your passion and thanks for hosting this site.

@Andrew Reid I understand you are bothered that BMD did not invite you. And to be honest, I think they should have. But I don't think writing an article about a forum member is a great move. He (John Brawley) does not work for BMD. His view, by his own admission do not represent the view of BMD. Also, he had no role in who was invited to the Manchester event. I can see that many here are upset. But surely we do not base buying decision on weather a stranger is polite or impolite? It may be wise to just forget this conversation and move on to more constructive topics. We are bigger than this aren't we?

Attacking Andrew is to shoot on our own feet. Let's give him a bit more of respect and recognition for his free voice in a plain vivid independent tool this web corner is to honestly review any piece of gear. Are there so many other places out there to underestimate this one here?

So we're now publicly shaming people and companies because the host of one of our favorite internet forums didn't get invited to a camera test event that he had no natural entitlement to be at (besides it being a good publicity opportunity for BMD)?
While I can understand the disappointment of Andrew, I think the behavior displayed here will probably reduce future chances regarding any brands' involvements even more. Not exactly professional at all. Why is this forum always so god damn hostile?!
I can't judge if John Brawley is a nice person or not because I don't know him, but I found it rather surprising he was even willing to fight it out with some of us arm chair experts. People here compare his behavior to how Roger Deakins behaves on his forum. Well, I have never seen the people on Deakins' forum question what he says all the time so I think it is not too surprising that eventually there might be rash answers.
I find this really disappointing all in all. This is a forum I really enjoy(ed) to read a lot but the tone is often so negative, aggressive and absolute. I already took some time off the forum a while ago and now I often starting writing posts/replies but then stop and decide not to post at all because the internet tough guy behavior here.
 
Like in all controversial threads, I guess it's again only a question of time for people who disagree to get banned?

This honestly doesn't reflect well on anybody, least of all yourself.  Freezing the thread for a cool-off was a good idea.  My advice (unsolicited I know!) would be to take that down for a similar period and then consider if you really want it out there.
It comes off as sour grapes, and just isn't a smart response. 

What you do doesn't amount to a piss in the snow as the world goes. I have never even watched a F ng thing you have shot for a living, and Gee I haven't lost a days sleep.

What a shame.
Who are these "deep state" BMD insiders that are here pushing an agenda ? Myself and Hook.  Who else ?  What do you guys think, there's a plot and conspiracy ?  You guys don't wat these contributions I guess ?
I'm here because I've been a member here for years and I'm on many camera forums and this is just another one I like to read and contribute to where I can.
I want to know where all the clowns that were saying on this thread that the world was going to end because BMD didn't have any footage out yet and that definitely meant something was very wrong and the shipping date would be missed.
All I've seen so far is that a planned marketing campaign by BMD that has gone off the way they intended.
They commissioned some actual filmmakers (not bloggers or camera reviewers) that make certain types of film (natural history, action sports, nature) to make some films and then they released them and the camera originals.
Then they gave some cameras, complete with some boxes as if they were new to some secondary users, and whilst having them also under NDA, got them to shoot some test footage and allowed some of them to release that footage.  Again.  Not reviewers.  Not bloggers.
About a thousand reviewers and camera jockeys have done a bunch of made up comparisons and VLOGS based on existing footage. (hey I love seeing my footage being butchered by grading nerds)
Think about it.
No blogger or reviewer ANYWHERE has gotten a functioning camera to shoot with as far as I can tell.  Because that's not what BMD want to do with their marketing of this camera.  This isjust marketing 101. 
They need people using the cameras in the many difference specific sectors of the market will use the camera.  Camera reviews aren't part of that plan. (though it hasn't stopped people doing it based on existing footage)
Until it's shipping, it's their choice to give it to whomever they want.
I'm tired of this entitled bullshit.  
I recently left a few facebook groups I was on for this camera, and I'm doing the same here.  Frankly it's juvenile and I don't need the agro I sure hate explaining what should be obvious.
There's no slight.  
BMD have a marketing department and they have a plan and it doesn't involve forums, bloggers or camera reviewers.  That's not a snub, that's just them marketing the product in the way that they see fit.
JB 
 

Andrew, you are cutting off your nose to spite your face. 
Blackmagic really don't owe you anything for any 'free publicity'. Their Pocket 4k has started a frenzy among the camera world stirring up conversation and leading people to discuss it on forums, maybe you owe Blackmagic for making your site and this thread so popular? Maybe you owe all of your forum members here for contributing all their content here  and making this site popular. Maybe you owe John Brawley for his contributions, I know I read this thread mainly because of his input and presence here...... Silly, I know, but the tantrum you seem to be throwing could also be seen as a bit silly too. 
Seems like nothing really new came from the event and maybe BM didn't think you would want to do an unboxing video...? 
Your reaction here only serves to diminish your character and reputation and by snubbing the camera based on you not receiving a pre prod version for testing or not being invited to one event. It might also suggest that you can be easily bought which is not what most people want out of an online reviewer. 
Who knows, maybe a marketing person at BM didn't think it appropriate to invite someone who seems brand focused by being call EOSHD? 
There are so many reasons why you may have not received an invite.... 
Just my 2c.
 

Though honestly, maybe... be better at networking? Don't have to go as far as these self-proclaimed YouTube reviewers that are mostly asslickers. But for sure keep tabs, keep on the radar.
I'm not gonna get upset if I'm not invited to Timmy's birthday party and refuse a treat when he does a round of treats in class because of it. That's a little petty. That's just the industry, I mean... must not be the only company not inviting you to these hands-on events. Seems Kai was in London for the Canon EOS-R event... were you there as well? Got invited at all?
It's like skipping dinner as a protest because earlier on you weren't allowed to eat a cookie. A bit unnecessarily stubborn. The only person that it really effects badly seems you.

If people don't buy this camera just because Andrew canceled his order and don't review it - then I'll be shocked. 
There will be thousands of reviews the day it's released. They may or may not be as honest and thorough as Mr. Reid's, but they will give a good enough picture of the product. I guarantee Philip Bloom will do a 45 minute or more video before the year is out.
If I want to buy something that's worth reading a review about, I don't really care who DIDN'T review it. 

Yeah, but now you are just doing what would happen if you exposed at (let's say) 400 normally, instead of 100. Between ISO 100-800 no gain is applied by the sensor, only the curve is shifted. In raw this doesn't matter, because you CAN underexpose at ISO 100 and just apply the 400 curve without losing anything. However, due to the compression applied by prores (which is pretty good, don't get me wrong), you'll likely have less shadow detail/more noise when you pull up ISO 100 in post to match ISO 400 as opposed to just having shot at ISO 400 to begin with.

@seanzzxx great explanation - that makes sense.  Thanks!

The guy who shot the Seoul Zoo footage had this to say over on bmcuser:
"I did another shoot yesterday which I'm editing right now. I used Hoya Pro NDs (2-4-6 stops) and I haven't noticed a thing related to IR. Blacks are neutral and clean"
So sounds promising! And yeah, that footage is beautiful.

The guy who shot the Seoul Zoo footage had this to say over on bmcuser:
"I did another shoot yesterday which I'm editing right now. I used Hoya Pro NDs (2-4-6 stops) and I haven't noticed a thing related to IR. Blacks are neutral and clean"
So sounds promising! And yeah, that footage is beautiful.

The guy who shot the Seoul Zoo footage had this to say over on bmcuser:
"I did another shoot yesterday which I'm editing right now. I used Hoya Pro NDs (2-4-6 stops) and I haven't noticed a thing related to IR. Blacks are neutral and clean"
So sounds promising! And yeah, that footage is beautiful.

No the 2x crop is only when shooting raw, Prores is downsampled 4k at no crop.

Hey Alex, I don't think the DNGs weigh anything, but here are the datarates at 30 frames per second:
4096 x 2160
CinemaDNG RAW - 272 MB/s
CinemaDNG RAW 3:1 - 129 MB/s
CinemaDNG RAW 4:1 - 97 MB/s

3840 x 2160
CinemaDNG RAW - 255 MB/s
CinemaDNG RAW 3:1 - 122 MB/s
CinemaDNG RAW 4:1 - 92 MB/s

1920 x 1080 (at a 2x crop)
CinemaDNG RAW - 66 MB/s
CinemaDNG RAW 3:1 - 32 MB/s
CinemaDNG RAW 4:1 - 24 MB/s

I like the pictures. A lot. 
This camera will probably replace the micro cinema camera for me as it’s not much bigger and is much easier to work with. 
I didn’t feel as strongly about the 4K production camera / Ursa because they were limited, principally by dynamic range.
I have a deep affection for the 4.6K sensor and have shot nearly daily withnit since before it was launched. I know it very well. 
This pocket camera will integrate and sit very nicely alongside the 4.6K. It’s already a closer match than the micro for me without having really tested it in an A/B scenario. 
I was a little worried about it having less DR Than the 4.6K but I think the other clips  show some great examples of what this sensor can do. “Nature” was incredibly tricky material to shoot as anyone who’s been in that situation before would know and it was unfair to see it being derided.  
Those that did so only reveal their own inadequate understanding of what those shots reveal. 
I can think of a million other scenarios I would have rather done but these sequences were specifically produced to illuminate what the camera can do in specific situations. 
What im almost more excited about is the unification that Gen 4 brings. As I mentioned earlier, it’s pretty much the same people at BMD that brought you the first camera working on this camera.
They’ve learned a lot (and so have I) and I think Gen 4 is really strong. I wish this and extended video would get rolled out wide already as I think half the issue I see with users of BMD products is a lack of knowledge in grading. 
Now BMD do have perhaps the greatest colour correction tool on the market BUT they don’t make it easy to get to a great result without a little arcane knowledge.
Even I often run into issues when working by myself and I see extended video being a great step in addressing that shortcoming. There’s no point in talking about how great you can make images shot RAW if you don’t know how to do it and can’t easily or intuitively find a way to do so. 
With regards to the 4k Pocket. 
Its a genuine low light contender. I was really impressed at what a useable picture it produces with little lighting.
I’m laughing at those that said it’s overlit. I mean a 500w chimera dimmed to almost nothing so the background lighting would still show though the tinted hotel windows is very very low light, much lower levels than the idiots demanding I walk out on the street and light by sodium were demanding.
Again, I laugh when I see comments about how noisy ISO3200 is but I’m guessing those users aren’t aware how much image processing their cameras are doing at high ISOs.  BMD allow you as the user to choose your poison. A very very underrated feature. And like colour correction it’s almost too powerful because users haven’t been instructed to change their expectations, nor how to add noise reduction or sharpening so they can season to taste. 
The best testbfootage will be friends users so the sooner they ship the cameras the better.  Hopefully Gen 4 means there will be less hysteria about its performance and a few will realise there’s no point comparing it to a GHx or a Sony and learn to get the most from what it is good at.
JB

...That looks like it could be the Pocket 4k? Reflected at an angle with a big lens with a screw-on ND on the front. I don't see what the problem is.