seanzzxx

21 minutes ago, Mark Romero 2 said:

All other things being equal, in regards to skin tones, would you say that Cine4 at 0 EV gives better skin tones than SLOG2 at around +2 after grading? Or are they about equal? You said with regular grading they both look about equal, so i am assuming that also refers to skin tones being on par with each other when exposed optimally. (I haven't been able to test on skin tones really.)

The reason I stopped shooting Slog was the fact that by overexposing by two stops the skin tones get really pasty and thin most of the times. I much rather have good skintones than some extra dynamic range, however I agree with you on the fact that the Cine curves have terrible highlight roll off.

It's because using the term ISO is relatively tricky in an age of digital photography:

Quote

"Why can't I use ISO 100 in Log mode?" The answer is that a log gamma curve is so flat that it requires very little light to achieve middle grey, which means it's considered a high ISO. Strictly speaking, though, you can't really calculate an ISO value for log at all, since the standard is based on a different colorspace and gamma. It's a similar story for Raw.

I mean, the Pocket 4k is cheaper, so I don't understand this dig? Looks really nice though!

I personally think most diffusion filters look kinda cheesy (especially the highlight bloom), would you have any good tips?

You could qualify the face, add a tiny bit of blur and then add some grain to the whole picture - that's most succesful in my limited experience. You could of course just add a fraction of blur to the whole image and then you wouldn't have to add the masking step, but 1) qualifying (maybe add a large mask) a face is super easy and quick, and 2) without a qualifier it will probably look less subtle because it affects the whole image.

EDIT: If other people have tips and tricks for making footage less sharp and more 'creamy' I'd love to know it, always looking for that with non-Ursa footage.

33 minutes ago, deezid said:

According to the description, he added midtone detail.
Also, RAW looks quite harsh out of this camera and has moire as well as aliasing. ProRes looks way cleaner.

I don't know if he added midtone detail ... sounds more like he raised the level of the midtones from that description?

That lowlight footage still has way too much midtone detail for my taste (look at her pores), but that's something that's adjustable in post with this much data. It's just a shame they haven't managed to get it like that 'out of camera'. Still a great deal though.

Sorry, I forgot to write the word 'RAW' in my message (I've edited it now). Because that's really the key:

You cannot downsample in RAW. The Pocket will shoot downsampled 1080P in Prores (up to 80fps I believe?) and will only crop at the absolute highest framerates.

1 hour ago, mercer said:

As I’ve said, the 1080p Raw crop is really bugging me.

If you're waiting for a camera that shoots uncropped 1080p RAW from a 4k sensor I've got some bad news for you...

EDIT: Forgot the word 'RAW'

A rep at IBC said the sensor was a Sony one, sometimes they are of the mark though.

The gigantic difference between Blackmagic manuals and other brands is that the BM manuals actually explain what's happening. They don't just state that the sensor will be windowed at higher frame rates, they explain it's because it reads out one-to-one pixels when it windows. I love that.

I thought that video looked impressive, and extremely impressive when you consider it was shot on a 1500 dollar camera, but it also looks to start falling apart slightly, especially in the skintones. That just happens when you grade 10 bit footage this hard.

Manufacturers want a global launch in most cases for a product, which means ALL distributors in all markets need to have stock on hand. There's a step in between getting the product boxed and actually having thousands of those boxes shipped around the world.

*Edited to make the language a bit less harsh.

Ah, CINEMA 2k, gotcha- thanks!

What's C2K?

I mean, YES! This is awesome.

1 hour ago, Andrew Reid said:

@seanzzxx That is true. Blackmagic have their own forum as well, which is good on their part but also reduces support costs maybe?

I mean: if it does, that's great, right? Everything I've heard from Blackmagic support has been pretty excellent otherwise. They've definitely been way, way more accessible to me when I had an issue than, let's say, Sony has been.

1 hour ago, Jerome Chiu said:

That makes their choice of those who were given early access of their new cameras more, not less, mystifying, right?

Because they should've had a better feeling for their market, you mean? We should remember that their choices up until recently have been pretty conventional (all the official Blackmagic footage was shot by established DP's), and now the cameras are going out to a bunch of 'influencers' (yuk) it seems, with a focus on South-East Asia, which is a large potential market I imagine. Unexpectedly, some of the footage out of that corner has actually been some of the best yet, in my humble opinion (I'm talking about the 'Sunset' and 'Bubble Gum' videos).

I mean at this point you're just outright misrepresenting what Areia shot. Yes, he did shoot a video walking around a zoo. He also shot what I consider to be a well-shot, edited and graded video: ...

... as well as one comparing the Micro to the Pocket 4k, which is yet to come out (but he released the Pocket 4k footage already). I know you have seen these videos, mr. Reid, because you have commented on them on your own forums. Why are you downplaying the stuff he made? I mean the answer is obvious: it's because you weren't the one who got to make it. I really don't want to seem hostile to you on your own forums (which, don't get me wrong, I think is awesome for you to facilitate), but it's stuff like this that makes you come across as petty and vindictive, because by putting these little spins on the story you appear to be actively looking for reasons to feel slighted.

21 minutes ago, Jerome Chiu said:

 

They should take a leaf out of other niche players in the industry: Red has its own forum, and forum members could seek out some senior members who have early access to new models for comments and guidance; by a similar token, PhaseOne has a good and reliable presence in getdpi.

Blackmagic HAVE their own excellent forums (at blackmagicdesign.com), and their employees actively comment on different forums.

8 minutes ago, Bioskop.Inc said:

Shaky footage is shaky footage & I don't care who you are - it shows a lack of professionalism, there are no excuses for it & is always deemed unacceptable!

And your comments/excuses for him show just how arrogant people in this area are becoming - he wouldn't get or keep a proper gig pulling shit like that....

I don't understand why you have to be so asinine about this - he explains in the description of the video that he is aware of the fact that the footage is rocky, what the reason for it is, and then goes on to explain why he choose to include the footage anyway. What more do you want?

The shakiness of the footage is because he had a Micro rigged next to it for a comparison video so he could go about matching and comparing the two for a later video, which I think is pretty cool. If you read the description of the video he admits that he had a hard time holding the camera steady because of how cumbersome the rig was.

9 minutes ago, mercer said:

I think there are some questions regarding the P4K that I guess I wasn’t aware of... is there a 2x crop in 1080p Raw? If so, then that’s a 4X crop of FF? Or is it a 2x crop instead of the 1.89x crop? I assume the latter because the former would be ridiculous, unless I could get my D-mount lenses to work with it.

You assumed wrong, it's a 4x crop (roughly) compared to Full Frame. How wide do you need your slow-motion shots to be? You don't own an 18mm or something like that?

In raw - yes. In prores it is downsampled 1080p (meaning you get the full sensor width), unless you're shooting 120fps in which case it will be a 2x crop again.

That's my idea as well: Manfrotto has clamps that should easily hold a t5 in place.

44 minutes ago, Andrew Reid said:

 

I think that's entitlement right there.

Who are these idiots who think they're entitled to read one free blog post after another for years with no advertising, from an indie filmmaker, whilst giving back absolutely nothing in return, worse, slinging a shit ton of hatred my way in my own front room, just at the moment he's feeling really quite down?

Mr. Reid, I don't know you and I won't pretend to understand what you are going through, so please do not take this statement the wrong way. However, when you say you are 'feeling really quite down', do you think that your current mental wellbeing is served by continuing to have this discussion? By arguing (no matter how justified) with people on these forums, your blog and Facebook page (all three of which you seem to hold very dear and personal, something which I understand).

In my opinion you absolutely did the right thing by locking up this thread temporarily, and my advice to you would be to do it again. Why revel in this energy-consuming discussion? I get that you're dissapointed and feel sleighted by Blackmagic's decision no to hand you the camera for early review, something only exacerbated by the fact that the event was in your own home-time. That must have honestly felt like shit. Nonetheless, scratching the wound left by this event (by returning to the discussion over and over again on these forums) might feel satisfying in the short-term, but it is absolutely not conducive to it healing. I suspect you are not gaining any longterm insight or satisfaction by having this discussion in this manner, and even worse, you might be worsening you're already crummy mood because you are now infecting this website with a discussion that 1) will make it harder to take back anything you say in anger because it is now done in a very public way, and 2) taints your very personal project with a negativity that you probably don't want in your life. Finally, in your anger you might end up taking actions or saying things that will end up doing damage to this project (eoshd.com) which you obviously hold so dear to you.

My advice (but hey, who am I) to you would be to give yourself a break - delete the blogpost you made, lock this thread and go for a walk/watch a movie/have a nice dinner with friends. Seriously do anything else for a while instead of having this situation drag you down. When you come back, delete this entire tangent and have this thread be about the Pocket 4K again. If you find Blackmagic's answer to your emails not satisfactory in the future, just don't cover them anymore if it makes you feel better. I just don't believe it is conducive to your wellbeing by dragging the argument into the public (and very ill-informed) sphere.

Hope that all makes sense. Thank you for your passion and thanks for hosting this site.