kye

They say that restriction breeds creativity...  Sony says "you're welcome!"

3 hours ago, tomsemiterrific said:

Shot this mood piece to show a bit of Nikon's low-light capabilities in video. No use of noise reduction at all, so doing so should get you some super clean video with not a lot of trouble---IF your lenses are fast enough in certain circumstances.
Also, you can get an idea of how well 420/8bit video grades--I did some fairly extreme things to get the looks I wanted.

 

Nice work!!

8 hours ago, heart0less said:

I just didn't feel any chemistry with 5D2. 

Considering that I mainly take photos (video stands for maybe 20% of my hobby), I realized my relationship with 5D2 may prove to be a bit troublesome.

Decided to let this one go and look for some all-rounder in similar (~500$) price.

If you didn't like the experience then you're right to change.  Film-making is a creative pursuit and it's hard to remain creative if every time you think about your camera it gives you a little bump of negative emotion.  There are so many cameras around these days that are "good enough" that you should be able to find one that gives you a little positive bump throughout the process, or at least doesn't detract or get in the way.

7 hours ago, thebrothersthre3 said:

I want a good set of manual focus glass. Currently have a set of Minoltas; 24mm 2.8, 35mm 1.8, 50mm 1.4, and 135mm 2.8

I really want to get a speedbooster to make full use of them but my go to focal reducers Lens Turbo doesn't make one. That leaves me with Metabones, which is $400, unsure if its worth it.

I am debating selling it all and getting a Nikon 35mm 1.4, 105mm 2.5 or 85mm f2, plus a cheap lens turbo speedbooster. Than I'd have the option of using with or without the focal reducer to get different FOV. 50mm lenses are cheap but I don't really like the focal length. Its either too long or too short. 

This is definitely more of a passion move as for practical purposes super fast glass isn't very useful. Accurately focusing the 50mm 1.4 is difficult if not practically worthless for live events, unless the subject isn't moving. I was thinking about getting a 58mm 1.2, but imagine focusing that with a speedbooster lol. Buying glass is fun though. May just keep all my minolta glass and get the Nikon glass as well.

Be aware of focus ring direction on lenses.  IIRC Minolta and Nikon are opposites, so if you have any muscle memory then it won't like changing from one to the other!

5 hours ago, thebrothersthre3 said:

I'll probably just pony up and and buy a metabones. Its probably more useful than this useless 4k monitor I just purchased for not much less ??

A 4K monitor is useful for having a 1:1 window of 1080p plug the tools of your NLE visible at the same time.  Just like how they were advertising 5K monitors as having 4K preview with a GUI also visible.

So if you want to justify your 4K monitor purchase then get shooting and then get editing!!

10 hours ago, Heera said:

What old canon camera models would you recommend to someone who doesn’t yet have a camera body but has a 70-200mm lens?

Are there any that wouldn’t break the bank? Under $500 if possible. Also, is a newer APSC sensor worth it if it’s newer than the old full frame body?

edit: Someone is giving me a Canon T6i. When I save up enough money for those cameras you all mentioned I know that the 6D or the 5Dii are the two obvious choices. Thanks to everyone who answered!

What are you shooting?  70-200 sounds pretty long as your only lens.  Unless you're buying some other ones to go with it?

33 minutes ago, mercer said:

@heart0less some of my favorite ML Raw videos were shot with the 5Dii. Check out Northmen on Vimeo for some beautiful samples. For the money, I think you made a great choice. 

The Northmen videos are really nice.  I kind of wish they were pumping them out like lots of other creators.  I think YT has spoiled me!

17 minutes ago, mercer said:

The C200 has a Super 35mm sensor... the crop factor is 1.4-1.5x. So the 20mm would technically have a FOV around 28-30mm.

You're right.  I just found the C200 review I got that from and discovered I read it wrong.  My bad ???

That makes it even more of a general purpose lens I guess, but my point was that my default is 35mm so it's all relative to how you shoot and what you like to see

3 hours ago, newfoundmass said:

For me it depends on the project. For events I usually shoot 1080p unless I have to deliver in 4K. Because I'll have coverage from multiple cameras I rarely ever feel like I wish I had the extra resolution to crop in. 

For music video or narrative work I'll usually shoot in 4K even if I am delivering 1080p. Even though I'm a big proponent of shooting it right, there are enough times where I'm glad I had that extra resolution to crop in that it's worth shooting it in 4K. For creative projects like that the more options the better. 

When you crop is it to try and create an additional camera angle?

My wife does public speaking and they film the talks but only from one angle, so if you want to edit them without jump cuts then you have to crop to create a virtual second angle.  It's an odd thing but it kind of works.  I'm curious how you use it.

11 hours ago, KitaCam said:

Can I ask, would I be making some fundamental ballsup by thinking that mounting a (full frame) Sigma 20mm F1.4 on the C200 would be a sane idea? Manual focus (most of the time though autofocus will probably work ok) and no stabilisation, but that F1.4 is enticing and there's plenty of excellent footage with the unstabilised Sigma F1.8 18-35 out there. Of course the C200 has internal ND's so that bypasses the bulbous front element filter issue. I really want wide, perhaps that is not wide enough...

In terms of focal lengths, having the 20mm lens on the C200 (with it's 1.74x crop factor when shooting 4K) would be the same field-of-view as a 35mm lens, which is a nice length.

I shoot home videos and travel films and the occasional project for a friend and these mainly consist of landscapes, environmental portraits, and close-ups when people are close by (like at a table).  I'd been shooting with the normal 24-80 / 80-400 range of my zooms and my phone and came to the realisation that 24mm isn't wide enough, and also not long enough, so when I changed camera systems to the GH5 and had to start a lens collection from scratch I decided to avoid 24mm altogether.

I now have these 35mm equivalents:

• 16mm f5.6 (great for landscapes, architecture, and that Wow factor of a wide lens)
• 35mm f1.4 (this is my main lens, it works for people, environmental detail shots, or general environment shots)
• 116mm f4 (this was my only longer lens and I found it to be a bit too long, so I'm looking for a replacement around 80mm)

I'm also looking for a good sports lens in the 270-400mm equivalent range.

Although I can use the ETC mode to get a 1.4x digital crop which makes the 16mm a 24mm equivalent I never found myself doing that, I'd change to the 16mm only if there was something really Wow and then just change back to the 35mm 1.4 without thinking about it as that's my default lens.   The same crop mode turns the 35mm into a 50mm and I did use this quite a bit.  When I have the GH5 being stored at home I always have it charged, with memory card in it and ready to go so that when something interesting happens I can run and grab it and capture the moment.  For this reason I always store it with the 35mm lens on it because that's such a good all-around lens for me.

It's good to really pay attention to what you're shooting and understand what focal lengths work for you.  Also pay attention to the aperture - having fast lenses is great but if you never open them up that much, or those shots never make the final edit, then you might be better off with a slower but more flexible zoom.

Everyone is going to have their own preferences that suit their style.  Just as I skip 24mm the next person might only ever use that length and might love it.

2 hours ago, newfoundmass said:

In some ways the G85 doesn't need a successor yet. It'd be nice, obviously, but it's still such a great budget camera even today and I still recommend it to people on a budget. It still kinda blows my mind that they released such a feature rich camera so shortly before launching the GH5. Panasonic had a lot of swagger from 2014 to 2017!

Let's hope they still do!

19 hours ago, newfoundmass said:

I'd be surprised if the GH6 isn't announced by early next year. I think the S1 factors very little in Panasonic's GH plans. I'm guessing we won't see a video focused full frame camera announced from Panasonic until mid to late 2020 at the earliest. 

The GH line is their bread and butter right now, as it should be. It'd make no sense for them to prioritize the S series over the GH series until there's reason to. 

I think they're separate too.  Canon proves that you can have FF MILC without great video and still be successful.

In a way many other companies are limiting video quality on their FF cameras and keeping video quality for their cine-lines.  If you think of Panasonic as having two cine lines - the cine EVA and the GH series, then it kind of makes sense.

10 hours ago, DBounce said:

Then you are really also talking about changing the recording media also. I don't think sd cards have bandwidth for internal raw. However, if they choose to go the Nikon/S-Line route and adopt a CFExpress compatible slot on the GH6... well, internal raw could easily be accommodated. And honestly, at that point I think few would choose a P4K over the GH6. There are certainly things that Panasonic could do... but they could do those things right now with the S1/R. Why they don't is open to debate.

Come to think of it... why did Panasonic put XQD/CFExpress in the S-Line? Are they, like Nikon, planning to offer internal raw recording via a firmware update? You just might be onto something.

In my mind the GH5 and P4K are completely different cameras because the GH5 has IBIS and is rock solid and the P4K doesn't have IBIS and isn't rock solid.  The GH5S doesn't have IBIS but is rock solid.  Of course, the P4K also has RAW/Prores, but that's not a deal-breaker for me as the 10-bit GH5 files are good enough (hell, they're great, what am I saying!).

Anyway, the GH6 will be rock solid and if it had IBIS and RAW then that would be spectacular, and we haven't mentioned 8K yet....

They could even make it a hybrid where it would do up to 4K RAW and 8K in H265, that would sure be something!

9 hours ago, thebrothersthre3 said:

I don't know, I think AI could change everything. 

I think AF is a funny topic that people don't really talk about sensibly / consistently / somethingly.  I've been an AF person for a long time because I wanted the camera to do it for me, and have only recently changed to MF.  Dear mother do you get kick-back on these forums when you say you need AF for your shooting style...  all the "they don't use it in Hollywood" " you're not a real film-maker unless you use MF" "growing up I only ate gravel" type comments all get trotted out.

I think our views of AF still haven't stabilised - the same people would criticise AF reliance and then turn around and criticise the GH5 for not having good AF.

If you want a good argument for not needing AF then here it is...  the GH5.  Hopeless as shit for AF, sells bucketloads, reputation as industry standard workhorse.

By the time we get around to accepting AF (and having some consistency in our opinions) I think AI and processing power may well have solved it.  Panasonic might turn out to have made the smart move by getting their AI sorted out and when it finally starts delivering the others may be years behind.  Sure, Canon might focus on the face, but film-making isn't always about faces.

5 hours ago, newfoundmass said:

I just hope that whatever Card slots they use that they're both the same. Not a fan of one being SD and the other being XQD. I'd also absolutely LOVE being able to record to an SSD. That'd make my life a million times easier when I'm shooting long events. 

I also think that would be great.  Not only would it mean inexpensive media, huge speeds, and less internal heating, but it would be cheap and small to implement in the camera body.  Anyone who has seen the size of the SD and CFast slot in the XC10 knows that those things take up quite a bit of space in a small camera body.

4 hours ago, @yan_berthemy_photography said:

Hi there,

 

I was wondering which quality settings do you guys use for commercial stuff such as weddings, music videos, etc.

I found 4k very hard to edit with some leggings issues, etc. what do you recommend to shoot with? 4k 10bit/8bit 60fps or FHD 10bit?

 

will 4K look like FHD if downscaled to FHD?

 

Thanks

If you're delivering in 4K: shoot 4K and use proxies to edit with.

If you're delivering in 1080 and need to crop a lot in post: shoot 4K.

If you're delivering in 1080 and don't need to crop much in post: film a few test shots to compare the 4K 10-bit mode and the 1080 10-bit mode and see how the image looks to you and if it's acceptable.  The 10-bit modes are one of the key advantages of the GH5 and I'd suggest that for commercial work 10-bit vs 8-bit probably makes more difference than 4K vs 1080p.

@Ehetyz @mercer My Takumar 55 1.8 arrived yesterday and I compared it to my Helios and found some interesting results.  Wide open the Helios was tack sharp (ha ha) in the very centre but got crazy soft on the edges (even with the 2x crop of MFT) and the Tak was considerably softer but had the same level of sharpness / bloom / flare across the whole frame.  By F4 they were getting similar, but the character of the softness was quite different.

I'll do some more tests and post a little write-up in the lenses thread when I'm done.  I've still got some lenses on the way.

17 hours ago, leslie said:

the lens looks immaculate, got a hand written note and a piece of origami no idea how it works or what it does but its the thought that counts ?

 

I've recently ordered a bunch of lenses, mostly from Japan, and the main seller I bought from sends these:

I don't know what chazuke is yet, but each packet has a different picture on it (this one is the fish) so it will be fun to find out.  The instructions are photocopied, but they're obviously drawn by hand, which isn't something you'd get from many other countries!

3 hours ago, KitaCam said:

Thanks. No issue at all with Super 35mm, just wanted as wide and as fast (F1.4 (real?) vs. F1.8 (real?)) as reasonably affordably possible with perhaps the ability (hence my thinking twice about the 18-35 which is for DX/Super 35mm) to mount on a stabilised full frame mirrorless (potentially canon, panasonic or otherwise) further down the line.

How about just buy the 18-35 second hand and then when/if you go full-frame just sell it again.  This is a classic lens and it should hold its value relatively well, or at least won't cost much if you think of the loss as a kind of rental fee

I've done this too.  I wasn't sure about my 700D and for a while was wondering about Magic Lantern and so I just bought one to try, and now that I'm not really going to use it I'll probably sell it again.

14 hours ago, Mmmbeats said:

Another thing to consider is that filters apply the effect to the actual light entering the lens. Post effects are added to the heavily compressed data you end up with in your edit codec. Even the most efficient codecs are massively compressed when you also consider chroma subsampling, debayer, etc. The physical filters have a considerably greater amount of 'data' to manipulate.

True, but considering this filter adds a massive blur, I wouldn't think it would make much difference.

Maybe for other filters it might matter.

36 minutes ago, drm said:

Yep. I was pissed. Luckily, I was just testing the camera at the time and only had test footage on the drive. Every once in a while, the screen will just go crazy and start acting like someone is clicking around on the screen. I have seen it happen maybe 3 or 4 times. At least once, the camera decided to open the external drive menu, then clicks on through until the drive is reformatted. I haven't seen this with the new firmware. I will let everyone know if I see it again.

13 minutes ago, Turboguard said:

I had that screen bug and they replaced it right away. Received a new camera just 3 days after I spoke to customer support. 

Sounds like a faulty touchscreen sensing ghost touches.  

...or you're haunted!!  (when is Halloween again? ???)

1 hour ago, DBounce said:

Having real filters does not prevent you from adding effects in post. I personally use both. I think it's better when you can capture the look you want in camera. If you dig deep enough you can find pros and cons to everything. Personally, I like the reflections that can bounce off the filters. Granted, if it doesn't look right you may have to control the scene by moving lights, adding flags or moving the angle of the camera. To me it all part of the process. These days I try to capture as close to the finished result in camera. 

That said, I understand everyone has a different taste, and different ways of working. In the end you do what works for you. 

I agree, everything has pros and cons.  Just think about how every new camera release we all turn ourselves inside out because there's no perfect camera

I think it also depends on what situations you shoot.  Some people have control and the time to tweak things as they shoot, and there are real advantages to getting it right in-camera.  Others are recording with varying levels of control or even influence on their situation, and just getting the shot might be the best they can hope for.  For these people, moving light-sources or tweaking settings just isn't feasible, so adjusting things in post when the pressure is off gives them extra creative expression.

My personal situation is that in shooting my family and travel videos I don't have time to fiddle around with various things.  This is partly because we go where it's interesting and not where the light is good, partly because for me the holiday comes before the photography, and partly because I'm just not skilled enough to operate the camera and think about every variable all at once, which is why I rely on automatic settings for some things.  

I started this thread because I really like the look of the BPM filters and was using the Glow OFX plugin with Resolve (that does an ok job at this effect) and wanted to see how well I could replicate the real filters.  I shared it partly because others might learn something useful, because it's nice to give back to the community, and because writing it up forces me to think clearly and critically about it so I learn more effectively by doing it.

Education is one of those things where everyone wins

Edit: I also really love that look during golden hour when the sun is out of frame but catches the BPM and gives a warm light-leak style rendering to part of the frame.  That's also something you could model through tracking and placing the lens flare effect off screen, but light-leaks and flares is something I haven't added to my videos yet, so maybe that's something I'll explore in the future.  I want to really push my videos but not to the point where the medium gets in the way of the content, if that makes sense

1 hour ago, thebrothersthre3 said:

I have the X-T3 so I'll get an X-T2 next. I just don't really need IBIS. The Xt2 also apparently has less moire in HD 60p and 120p. Might eventually get a 3rd XT2 or XT3 plus external recorder. My setup for weddings is two shooters plus a 3rd unmanned camera doing a wide shot which needs no record limits. Using a G7 atm, which works for now.

Yeah, it's great if you can keep compatibility between bodies but cover the range of nice features (slow-motion, recording limits, as you say) between them so you've got the right tools for the job.

It's also nice if you can work out what combinations seem to work nicely together too.  For example if you decided that for gimbal shots you always wanted a 50mm FOV and slow-motion then there's a chance that you could just leave that lens on the XT2.  Perhaps you'd have your unmanned G7 with a wide lens, and perhaps the other one might be a longer length for tighter shots.  Obviously these are just examples, but the less you have to be swapping lenses, putting cameras on and off gimbals, swapping filters and all that fiddling the better.

11 hours ago, DBounce said:

I sort of don’t understand this thread. Why not just use a real BPM?

Reasons that adding the effect in post is better:

• It's free
• It works on all your cameras and lenses without adapters
• It works on all your past footage
• It works on all stock footage
• You can control the strength of it shot to shot
• You can control it within frame (you can have the nice skin smoothing effects on skin and not have it go nuts from a direct light-source also in frame)
• You can change the colour rendering like the Warm Pro Mist filters, or any other tint you care to make (even ones Tiffen doesn't offer)
• You can change the characteristics to emulate their other filters (Black Pro Mist is only one of the filters they offer - https://tiffen.com/diffusion/ )
• You can even have hybrid effects like light sources glow green with a red outer ring around them, all adjustable to taste
• Real filters can have reflections under certain circumstances

Reasons that adding the effect in post isn't better:

• It doesn't work properly if any channel is clipped
• It doesn't work with any light-source that isn't in the frame
• It isn't an exact match to the look

Things that aren't good reasons for doing anything:

• That's how they do it in Hollywood

1 hour ago, Batou Bato said:

xc10 test

Looks good!

How are you finding the camera?

2 hours ago, drm said:

(like the damn camera reformatting the T5 drive on its own while glitching #$#%#!!)

wow.......

43 minutes ago, thebrothersthre3 said:

Yeah that is my end decision and thanks everyone for the advices. 

What bodies do you think you'll get?  

2 hours ago, BTM_Pix said:

Ireland might be worth a look though.

Apparently there is going to be a new border that might need some coverage.... 

I think it's time for a GH6 rumours thread.

There were a flurry of rumours in early 2015, including talk of 8K video and people were anticipating potential release dates.  The New Camera made this handy-dandy diagram:

They also made a couple of predictions about a couple of different possibilities on how it might happen:

Quote

Possibility #1

• GH1 – 2009
• GH2 – 2010
• GH3 – 2012
• GH4 – 2014
• GH5 – 2016 – 4K
• GH6 – 2018 – 6K
• GH7 – 2020 – 8K

Possibility #2

• GH1 – 2009
• GH2 – 2010
• GH3 – 2012
• GH4 – 2014
• GH5 – 2016 – 4K
• GH6 – 2018 – 8K (development announcement on Photokina)
• GH6 – 2019 – 8K (official announcement)

There's also lots more stuff in there too - http://thenewcamera.com/tag/panasonic-gh6/

We know that The GH5 got 5K video in a firmware update in late 2017, and with all the talk about 8K for the 2020 Olympics, the GH6 might be 8K.  The GH5 5K mode also got H265 encoding, which due to its increased efficiency, is probably a requirement for decent 8K video.

In May 2018 Personal View leaked this: https://www.personal-view.com/talks/discussion/19798/panasonic-gh6-first-rumors

Quote

Rumors I heard so far from various sources:

• Panasonic wants to add 8K support, most probably at 24p only
• m43 sensor can be first present only at GH6 presentation time and will be exclusive for 1-2 years
• 8K support can be interpolated (from around 6.5-7K), but can be true 8K, depends on sensor version Sony chooses
• Next focus will be improving high frame rates
• AF will be kept at same level, slightly faster, just with more options
• Will use this EVF - https://www.personal-view.com/talks/discussion/19797/meet-first-gh6-part-1600x1200-resolution-oled-evf#Item_1
• GH6 can be first camera with AI and cloud based features with monthly cost
• Other features can be possible to be enabled permanently, but paid, similar to V-LOG license
• Panasonic also wants to account for big currency fluctuations
• So, price will rise compared to GH5, but it can be GH6V (value edition) with 8K and other features disabled that you can buy later
• GH lineup, after one year of introduction, will be 3 cameras - GH6V, GH6 and GH6X (top one, similar to mix of G9 and GH5S)
• First announcement round will be Photokina 2018 and spring Photokina 2019 or CP++ will be release time

Then during the S1 announcements, a Panasonic rep made comments that indicated that video would continue to be lead by their GH line of cameras (I can't find the link) which helped to firm up the idea of a GH6 rather than abandoning MFT for FF, yet at least.

What do you predict?  What do you want?  Do you care?

5 hours ago, thebrothersthre3 said:

I am kind of thinking the GH6 won't arrive until next spring. Seems like the GH5S and GH5 are still too new for them to throw out another camera so quick.

I think it might be time for a GH6 thread

13 hours ago, IronFilm said:

Agreed, you should have just gone straight to the VMP

At the time I was contemplating going for a Mid-Side configuration so I could record the isolation of a shotgun mic and the ambience of a stereo pair at the same time, so I would have needed two mics to both be powered, so it made sense from that perspective.

The VMP is kind of a compromise in that sense, although having a safety track has saved by butt more than once.  

Actually, I've been meaning to ask you - is there an in-line attenuator that you'd recommend that only attenuates one channel?  I've found that the safety track attenuation from the VMP+ isn't sufficient sometimes and I'd like it to be quieter.  IIRC the VMP+ safety channel is 20dB down, so maybe something like 40dB down?  I'd rather have a quiet and slightly noisier safety track than one that has clipped, so I'm willing to trade-off quality for safety on my safety track if that makes sense.

If there isn't one you'd recommend then I'll have to just make one, but the DIY connectors etc tend to be bulky so a professionally made one would be nicer     Either if there's a standard safety track attenuator that attenuates the already attenuated signal from the VMP+, or one that has a huge attenuation on it and I turn the VMP+ to both channels just being normal levels.