Danyyyel

I just don't understand what people expect anymore. The size and weight of a z6 and a Ninja 5 is smaller that using one of those entry level dslr and a small flash. That is less than the average Japanase/chinese tourist with his small Nikon/canon camera walking around taking photos in some random tourist location. The C200 is much bigger and not full frame, to have a full frame video camera with 10 bit just 5 month ago was the Canon C300 a much bigger shoulder only camera and now you have to add a codex recorder to put RAW. The fact is that your type of (small, unassuming, versatile, total lightweight package, easy to mount on gimbal, etc) does not need more than 8 bit shooting, 10 bit and even prores is an overkill to shoot those low level production.
Just six month ago, absolutely no one was expecting any manufacturer (I even include the likes of blackmagic)was going to release a full frame camera with RAW. In fact everyone was begging for 10 bit for at least the last 2-5 years. Just for a measure, this is the Nikon d3200, the smallest Nikon dslr compared to the z6-z7. In pure volume the Z6 is smaller (much thinner) and I advise anyone to look at the Nikon D3000 series camera in a showroom or people using it. This thing is tiny to the point of being uncomfortable if you have average man hand.

Exactly, I just did nearly two week non stop shoot around my tropical island for a reportage on a Victoria Secret model coffee book shoot. That shoot was intense in very harsh tropical summer climate with a lot of rainfall, heat and humidity (shooting a lot around the water). At first I was a bit embarrassed to shoot on such a small camera and rigged it a little, after not even half day, I was shooting mostly hand held and with my 7 inch Ninja. This shoot was going fast and I did not want to interfere at all as most of the team was coming from US and with the weather had a very tight schedule. After watching the fotage at night I slowly moved to only the internal shooting and was really impresed by the internal 120 fps 1080p footage. Where I en-counted problem with the footage was banding in the blue sky, I watched some tutorial and got some great result with qualifier and ofx debanding in Davinci resolve.
Perhaps for a Nikon shooter this is extraordinary and would have been normal for other MILC shooters. But for me it was extraordinary, I got some amazing tracking and slowmo handheld footage (I was starting to have to restrict myself with the slowmo because it was so gorgeous), that Nikon quality with all the features of the Z6 video capabilities like Ibis, auto focus, handling ergonomic, build quality is mind boggling in such a small package. Now if I was first camera and I had a more compact Ninja V than my 7 inch one. I would have perhaps done more 10 bit shooting and use an external recorder. But even then, with mostly the 4k and 120 fps codec bitrate, I am stunned by the quality.
The last thing I don't understand is the supposed non cinematic image of the camera. I guess some people might understand that its not shooting in crappy light that will make their camera look cinematic or not, perhaps they should look at the meaning of the word. Because for me, my images are coming out great. There is not one people from the US team (photographer working for vogue etc) thought the image were crap. 

I just don't understand what people expect anymore. The size and weight of a z6 and a Ninja 5 is smaller that using one of those entry level dslr and a small flash. That is less than the average Japanase/chinese tourist with his small Nikon/canon camera walking around taking photos in some random tourist location. The C200 is much bigger and not full frame, to have a full frame video camera with 10 bit just 5 month ago was the Canon C300 a much bigger shoulder only camera and now you have to add a codex recorder to put RAW. The fact is that your type of (small, unassuming, versatile, total lightweight package, easy to mount on gimbal, etc) does not need more than 8 bit shooting, 10 bit and even prores is an overkill to shoot those low level production.
Just six month ago, absolutely no one was expecting any manufacturer (I even include the likes of blackmagic)was going to release a full frame camera with RAW. In fact everyone was begging for 10 bit for at least the last 2-5 years. Just for a measure, this is the Nikon d3200, the smallest Nikon dslr compared to the z6-z7. In pure volume the Z6 is smaller (much thinner) and I advise anyone to look at the Nikon D3000 series camera in a showroom or people using it. This thing is tiny to the point of being uncomfortable if you have average man hand.

I just don't understand what people expect anymore. The size and weight of a z6 and a Ninja 5 is smaller that using one of those entry level dslr and a small flash. That is less than the average Japanase/chinese tourist with his small Nikon/canon camera walking around taking photos in some random tourist location. The C200 is much bigger and not full frame, to have a full frame video camera with 10 bit just 5 month ago was the Canon C300 a much bigger shoulder only camera and now you have to add a codex recorder to put RAW. The fact is that your type of (small, unassuming, versatile, total lightweight package, easy to mount on gimbal, etc) does not need more than 8 bit shooting, 10 bit and even prores is an overkill to shoot those low level production.
Just six month ago, absolutely no one was expecting any manufacturer (I even include the likes of blackmagic)was going to release a full frame camera with RAW. In fact everyone was begging for 10 bit for at least the last 2-5 years. Just for a measure, this is the Nikon d3200, the smallest Nikon dslr compared to the z6-z7. In pure volume the Z6 is smaller (much thinner) and I advise anyone to look at the Nikon D3000 series camera in a showroom or people using it. This thing is tiny to the point of being uncomfortable if you have average man hand.

Here you are...
I went down to the station and filmed a few basic tests. This is a worst case scenario as far as setup... bad follow focus and lots of wind. But it's good to show what it can do.

Yes, Nikon is one of the top choices for video (arguably the #1 choice), yet their perception is not even "mid back" but "last" (ignored alongside with Pentax etc). 

Nikon has a serious marketing problem, and giving us raw video from a $2K full frame mirrorless exactly what they need to do to make heads turn and finally pay attention. 

I think offering full frame (no crop) 12 bit raw video on a US$2000 hybrid body pretty much meets the definition of going into complete and total overdrive.

There has been some management change if I am not mistaken. It is true that they have sometimes added  some functionality but never at this level. One reason could also be that other manufacturer have come with 10 bit video just after them and just like that they where just in the pack, with Pana and Fuji with 4k 60p. As a Nikon user, every time Nikon came out with some new video tech, but just at the same time someone came and just took the limelight out of them. Even if I know how good the Nikon video image is for quite some time, most people consider them as not good or only photographic centric company. This time would have played the same way, the Z6 would have been only for Nikon connoisseur. The rest would have still been Sony, Canon, Pana or even fuji video users. When you think the A73 was considered game changing like only 9 month ago and the z6 more or less beats it in every way, this tells you how low Nikon is in the video community. 
While now, with this RAW upgrade, they clearly make a Canon 5D move in 2008. All the others, except Fuji are scratching their heads. This would kill a lot of sales for Canon, Sony and Pana if they put RAW in their 2000-3000 mirrorless camera in their video camera line.

I don't think you can get even close to that much latitude or processing from normal  Prores.
 

WOW, I thought it was a joke, I am bewildered, I was hopeful Nikon would do some firmware update, but this one is out of this world. My z6 in arriving in two days, it is as if I am getting a new camera. I hope they do it for the 1080 version also. For those asking about raw 6k to 4k etc, Nikon has some lower rez raw format for photo already, they might use the same system for video.
This is another Canon 5d moment. I am sure people in Sony, Pana and Canon HQ are in panic mode. This camera will more or less beat anything below 30 000 USD. It will be a full frame Raw camera with at least 14 stop of DR, low light that will beat every APSC photo/video camera, very good IBIS and slowmotion etc. The only place it will be beaten is slow motion and Nikon is coming with a full set of video centric lens that will be a bargain in the video/cinema world. 
 
Does anyone know the different bitrate of prores raw. I have seen Black Magic ones but I don't know compression of Prores Raw.

I just finished my first shoot where I used the z6 for all the video shooting.  Was a bit painful to shoot (z6+14-24f2.8+ronin-s), but a total joy to grade.  The house was pretty easy to shoot though, nowhere near the dynamic range of some properties I shoot, it'll be interesting to see how it fares with them.  The ronin-s is miles better than the crane 2 for me. virtually no jitter even with the humongous cam and lens combo.  Good job too because the rolling shutter makes warp stabiliser a bit hit and miss.  I know some people have complained about the slomo, but I think its better than the gh5's. I spent the first few weeks telling my partner I was going to sell it, but just like the d5500, I'm loving the image.  Foibles: flicker from lights. I assume this is to do with the slow readout too.  Never had this issue with GH5. Its fine if I leave the shutter on 1/100 or 1/50th, but problematic if I want to use an auto mode.  I noticed some flicker on manual with auto iso. Have no idea why that should happen.  I know people dont post there own work a lot on here, I think more people should. 
 

Sincerely, people should chill out a bit. We are getting a Full Frame raw 4k camera, with very very very very  good low light, dynamic range, auto focus, IBis, viewfinder etc for 2700 USD. Less if you buy the complete filmmaker kit. There is nothing remotely close to that and people are still complaining. What is small enough for people these days. The Z6 Ninja V combo is smaller than my d7100 Dslr and a Flash. When you see the amount of active cooling something like the Pocket 4k needs for a sensor that is 1/4 of the Z6 people have to be a bit realistic. Another thing to consider is a user of a Ninja Flame, having an external recorder like this brings so much functionality for focusing, previewing and exposure tools that go so much beyond just a recorder.
 

REDCODE is compressed RAW for a dozen years, no one has complained in Hollywood included... Do you? :X

I hope your coffee machine can do actions photos like that. Care to give me the brand please so I can dish all my cameras. I prefer to take advise from actual professional than youtubers and website who never ever have any practical shooting experience and will spend one day with a completely new camera. Thtas his setting and feeling about z6 https://www.facebook.com/groups/NikonMirrorless/permalink/462911304234806/?comment_tracking={"tn"%3A"O"}
Here is another shoot with his account https://***URL removed***/forums/thread/4340957
 
 
I am sure that your coffee machine can also be used in the staples center to photograph Lebron. below is the account of the shooter, a known sport shooter and not some random dude on the youtube or those dpreview guy that can't even shoot outside of test chart.
https://www.facebook.com/robert.hanashiro/media_set?set=a.10156360392953025&type=3
Nikon z6 Metallica  , and his account on the Af in challenging lights  https://***URL removed***/forums/thread/4343245#forum-post-61973980
 

Sincerely, best evf and back screen for most, very very good Full frame IBIS, very very good video autofocus, outstanding body construction (lensrental rivaling best DSLR ones), 10 bit and log. What did you expect, it beats the A73 in everything except native lens choice (The adapted Nikon lens are still very good on the body). I don't what some people expected, perhaps a coffee machine option. The only body that would beat it depending if you want better slowmotion and internal 10 bit is the Fuji XT3. Now if for you IBIS and better low light is more important and the FF look, then the Nikon would win. As for the Sony, when the next one comes out, then we can compare to the z6, because for now the z6 is in every way better.

What until now I don't understand, not judging you in particular, but there are quite a lot of low light test, I guess by nw we know that we can use 6400 ISO and go to 12800 or even 25600 ISO. But no one was able to do a test with what is the real innovation of this camera and it is 10 bit log profile. That is the first test I will do with this camera when I get it start of next year, put it at 800 ISO, log, 10 bit and shoot some people and landscape. Just to know what is the ultimate quality of this camera.

I remember when you where saying that Nikon first gen would never compete against Sony third gen. You know what the Z6 is better than the A73 Sony MILC, better viewfinder, rear screen, ergonomic, 10 bit, construction weather sealing, 10 bit etc. The only thing it looses is Continous autofocus in.............. photo and not video. So what I expect is at least 1 or 2 firmware update for continuous autofocus to get it better. That does not mean that its photo autofocus is bad, it is just not at the same level than the Sony in Continous autofocus.
 
 
I can't understand people thinking, Sony sensor division is number one in the world, why would they handicap their reputation to protect 13% Milc Dslr market. They would alienate 90% of their own customer.

People are getting 4k TV by default , its not like they really really want it, it is just that you can get a 4k TV for 5-10% more than a 1080p one, or no more 1080p model. In fact if 4k was successful in anyway, there would have been a premium on that, but like 3D, no one cares. The reality is that young people are watching movies on their mobile phone or tablets. We are living the MP3 audio transition but for video. It is really sad for people like us who are a bit passionate about image quality but that's a big trend.
The TV manufacturers and as a lot of other consumer electronic product are experiencing a shrinking market because people just can't see a big difference between 1080p and 4k at normal viewing distance. The only thing that for me would push big sales again would be a cheap tech for much bigger screen size. If you could get 80+ inch screen for 1k etc, then people will go back buying TV. Display size does make a difference in the viewing at least for me.
Sincerely there is about 100 pixel difference between a 1080p and 2k screen. If you can tell me how there is a huge difference, i am happy to hear that. When I am talking about 1080p, I am not talking about Canon 5d style 1080p which is barely 720p, but true 1080p-2k from camera like the Alexa. In my country most screen are still 1080p-2k and until now I have never seen a pixel on 10 meter wide screen.

I expect to see this statement posted again in 2020 as well....

Well, on the road you can easily drive 160km/h with 100hp. With 400hp obviously, too. But on a normal viewing situation 4K is already a waste while 8k is simply for show off race car drivers were 99% of humanity just shake their head about this guy in a lambo. It is manly just penis size at this point and everybody knows size is very important and storytelling is completely unnecessary if you can have 8k or a lambo respectively.

I am still waiting for 4k next year for the last 5 years, oh wait I am still waiting for 1080p, because 90% of the world is still on 720p and SD. Japan and Korea are some kind of tech lab experiment that never represent the world. In fact 1080p is good enough and in a good sense for any normal viewing distance display for our human brain. Over and above that is really pushing it in terms of diminishing return. it is like moving from a 100 hp car to a 400 hp one to get .2 second better from 0 to 100, now that's for 4k, I don't even know what will 8k bring.

I don't understand the logic of this conclusion at all. I mean why should... "almost exclusively" be people with a large selection of Nikkor AF glass chose the z6.  It is nothing outrageous to say that the z6 is the best video MILC for now and only behind the XT3 if you really want 4k 60 fps and don't care about IBIS. So why should only Nikon users be interested in the top 2 best video MILC. As illustrated by the video below, the guy finding himself so much liking the z6 that he doesn't know what to choose between it and the A73 which he already has.
What some will point out is the native lens selection. If someone starts from zero for sure the Sony has more lens but Nikon has already put out a roadmap. By this time next year we will have most of the pro quality lens to cater for 80% of use, and in two years 90% of what most people use. We already have FTZ adapter which caters for everything. The only grippe with the Ftz is video, because of motor noise. But as seen by most account the F mount lens work very well with the z6 ftz adapter combo. But if you are serious about video you will never use the internal microphone but get an external one. Another thing with the FTZ adapter, waiting for native lens, I could buy new or even better used, a bunch of quality Fmount lens for the price of one new Sony lens.
The other thing about the Z lens mount is, do you buy into Sony system (which is already very costly) or buy into a new system that is planed to be future proof. With that bigger mount we can already see with Nikon and Canon that it opens new possibilities with higher quality fast lens and completely new formula as F2 zoom. Other innovation like third ring that can be programmed for smooth aperture or Iso change. So my conclusion of this conclusion, why should the z6 "almost exclusively" be people with a large selection of Nikkor AF glass, when ultimately it is at least as good and potentially much better than the competition. 
 
 

That's one of the attractions of the Swiss Army Knife approach of the Nikon. You can stick the same camera in small bag for spontaneous moments at unprecedented quality, but the same body can also be used in the studio for shooting 10 bit log for green screen, with a recorder and audio extras.

Yes, and I know some photographers that are asked by clients to dive into video, so the Z line might be attractive, instead of switching to Sony. It also could sparks an interest among a larger audience ; I'm reading more and more comments on forums (video oriented, or photo specialized with a dedicated video section), from video shooters that are really intrigued by 10bit/FF/ibis/robust construction.
Personally, despite having no Nikkor lenses, I've chosen the z6 over the a7iii, primarily for build quality and handling. Better evf, lcd and touchscreen, great ibis, desirable Nikkor G line-up and lovely colors are a plus. I will also attach a lot of non AF lenses, as I would've done with Sony. Won't be a problem to share it later with a bmpcc4k or a gh5s. But, if it had not been for the Z line, I would not be back to Nikon today (or only for stills).

I think it is your beta software, You have got this test between D750 and Z6 and surprisingly when you consider Dpreview lab test, the z6 is better than the D750. I don't doubt the test because the pink shadows is typical of the older Nikon camera and it has been better since the latest ones.