graphicnatured

One of my favorite artists of all time.

3 hours ago, MeanRevert said:

Yeah ,for sure, I can see someone handhold the thing with just a lens, mic and SD/CFAST. It's kind of hard to do that for long with that small battery and non-articulating display though.

Yeah, a monitor setup on top can help, but in a lot of ways I still like carrying extra batteries over a v-mount. If I really want to carry something that heavy I'd just grab the Ursa because once you add that, it may as well be, like you said.

55 minutes ago, MeanRevert said:

It's kind of funny that to really make the Pocket 4K work well, it usually ends up looking like the Ursa. 

I don't know, I shot over a weekend with it when it first arrived with nothing but a shoulder strap for stabilization and it worked just fine for me. It was still a joy to use and nobody would I know I didn't have all kinds of crap hanging from it.

By the time DJI updates the action, the Hero8 will be out. Competition is great for all of us.

On 5/18/2019 at 7:32 PM, webrunner5 said:

Yeah, but I would imagine the RXO II would slaughter the others overall on imagine quality, low light, DOF, on and on.

Yeah, but it's also $700. (II)

In drm's defense. Sorry about the shaky phone clip.

Just now, kye said:

Yeah, fading light is terrible for camera comparisons unless you hit record on both at the same time (and have duplicate lenses of course).

Wild guess, but .... Blues Brothers?

Nope, but thanks for trying!

I messed this first test up pretty badly. I don't recommend deciding last minute to go shoot a test as the sun is going down, but hey, at least I finally did something. I'll shoot some more with the P4k and Micro on this holiday weekend and do it properly. Bonus points to the first person in the forum who doesn't live in my town who can name the famous movie this location is featured in. Knowing you guys, this is too easy.

2 hours ago, kye said:

I'm still keen to try to make the P4K match the older BM cameras in post-production.  If anyone has the ability to film some useful test footage with the P4K and an older BM camera and can upload it then I'll put in some serious work to see if we can match the old aesthetic from the new camera.

My theory is that we should be able to, because going from more resolution to less is possible, and having good bit-depth should be sufficient to grade and match colours etc.

Thread is here:

I don't have a BM camera of any kind, but if I can work out how to make the P4K have the magic of older BM cameras then I think I will learn a bunch trying to figure it out, and I'll get all kinds of interesting techniques to use with my GH5 footage, so I'm definitely up for it.

I feel bad I never did this. Going to head out after dinner and grab some clips with a Micro and a P4k. Both RAW 3:1 to start.

3 hours ago, StHubbins said:

Yeah, the biggest problem with my Micro is that it is literally the most difficult camera to use in the history of cameras... and that's from an owner of the original BMPCC. To get my Micro to work for my run-and-gun style, I've needed

1) A cage 

2) an HDMI cable lock

3) a Blackmagic URSA Mini handle, with LANC cable

4) an offset Arri rosette, purchased from a guy who makes them in Russia 

5) a right angle-to-straight HDMI cable for the monitor

6) a monitor, with 6B) a battery sled

7) a Sony battery (and charger) for the monitor

8} a One Little Remote control box, and 8B) a separate mounting screw for the cage

9) a Sennheiser MKE400 small shotgun mic for usable sound, with 9B) a screw-in cold shoe mount

This rig took me a ton of research and about 3 months to get together. And the camera is still barely usable - even the One Little Remote (which is great, compared to the laughable buttons on the front of the Micro) doesn't have a screen, so you have to guess if you've pressed a button once or twice or 3 times to figure out which parameter you're on. He's made a new one with a screen, but I don't want to buy yet another thing (though at some point I will). And nothing's worse than having your monitor run out of juice... and realize that your camera is still going strong, but there's no way to see what you're shooting.

Now, to get a fully useable rig for my BMPCC4K, I've had to buy...

1) Nothing.

Yep. Great (stereo!) audio from in camera, huge built-in monitor, tons of easy access buttons, plus a touch screen and amazing UI. I literally have NOTHING on the camera. And it's about 2 lbs. lighter than my Micro.

The Micro's image quality is indeed delicious, but it's a preposterously huge hassle to shoot with, comparatively. Nonetheless, you'll never get me to sell it

I agree completely with all of this. I haven't built my micro up to the extent of yours. (Still pressing those horrible buttons on the camera) The image with the micro and Pocket is beautiful, but when I go out to shoot, the P4k goes with me. Usability is becoming more and more important for me these days. Until I come up with that artsy project where that image of old is a must, these guys are watching over all my shelved gear. The thought of what it takes to use them and rigging them up makes me lose interest quick when deciding which cam to take.

26 minutes ago, kye said:

Aren't we simultaneously having two conversations?

1. The P4K is way too sharp!!!  4K and modern cameras aren't cinematic, the Alexa / older BM cameras are all lower res and have magic.
2. The P4K is way too soft!!!!  BRAW is clearly inferior because it smooths fine detail.

Not to mention conversations in other threads that also include:

1. Who needs 4K - 1080 is fine and you can't tell the difference and ...... blah blah blah
2. 8K!!!!!! OMFG!!!!!  ??

Well said.

2 hours ago, MeanRevert said:

It's a little funny to me that GoPro tried to enter DJI's territory and almost lost their ass with the Karma. So now DJI is returning the favor by trying to enter GoPro's territory. Haha. 

I agree. One didn't learn from the other.

3 hours ago, kye said:

That's all quite disappointing really.  

Apparently not..  I agree with many others here that if the hardware is similar to the GoPro and taking into account GoPro seeming to do pretty well on the software side, there doesn't seem to be much chance this offers much that GoPro doesn't.

Interesting to hear that you're happy with the images - I know things have changed a lot since my Hero 3 Black but looking at the footage from that thing is beyond disappointing.  I tried recording myself and a colour chart under controlled lighting high DR scene and cycling through all the main resolutions and combinations of Protune and different WB settings.  Then I took them into Resolve and tried colour matching the Protune files to the normal mode and I struggled to get results as nice as the normal mode, and also couldn't see any improved DR either.  Needless to say that none of that footage matched anything like the glorious ads they make.

RAW or high bitrate files would be something interesting, one of the cool features of the X3000 is the 100Mbps codec, which combined with the OIS and less clipped DR (see iPhonedo GoPro review videos) makes for significantly cleaner images, especially in low-light.  If the DJI action camera had RAW or a nice codec then I'd be quite torn between it and the X3000, but so far there's nothing interesting about it.

Does anyone know if the Ambarella H2 image processor is particularly powerful?  If it is then maybe there's advanced software stuff going on....  @androidlad ?

GoPro's last ad was created entirely by all of us, the consumers. Not a single clip was made in house.

1 hour ago, webrunner5 said:

If true, sort of sounds like suicide unless they have some groundbreaking tech no one has even thought of. It just seems to be a...GoPro knockoff. We already have all kinds of those now.

Agreed. They shouldn't even bother with these specs.

3 hours ago, SR said:

GoPro's been a dead horse for a while now, with one bad move after another. Don't think DJI can challenge a company that is barely afloat.  

That's old news. They've been making a rebound. Who knows what the future holds, but the Hero7 Black is awesome and considering history, a new cam could be unveiled in a few months.

Speaking of dark, but unrelated. My buddy and I bought tickets to see The Passion of the Christ, but by the time we entered the theater the movie had already started. The beginning of that movie is pitch black so we couldn't find our seats. I didn't even know if I was standing in the aisle or in front of someone. I couldn't even see my hand in front of my face. It was both uncomfortable and hilarious for a very inconvenient amount of time. First world problems, considering the film we were trying to watch.

10 hours ago, deezid said:

Seems like BMD isn't open for critic's since Braw/ProRes on the Pocket 4K is perfect.
Since you're here @CaptainHook I may ask for fixing the gamut related issues of the perfect V4 BMD color science as well...

 

Right now I have to convert BMD V4 CS to ACES or IPP2 with some smooth gamut mapping applied.

 

I'm assuming you weren't actually looking for a response. Hook has been helpful when he's had time. Why go this route? I'd love for his input to remain a part of this forum. Omit the emotion when asking the question so we have a chance at an answer. I know this topic has come up before and he's responded to it. Things are always changing. Lets keep it real in here. Even if I missed something I don't know about, that post isn't getting any of us anywhere. My two cents.

3 hours ago, thebrothersthre3 said:

I wonder if the original ursa mini 4k is more similar to the OG Pocket and Micro 

I always liked the look of it. The really poor low light kept me away from it though.

4 hours ago, thebrothersthre3 said:

Interesting, how do you compare the Ursa 4.6k image to the micro and OG pocket?

They are dramatically different. I think resolution goes a long way in how an image appears to us, for sure. I see points for both. It's been said over and over how great those little cameras are, and it's all truth.There's something about them. (OG and Micro) With Ursa you get so many options though. Same with Pocket4k, but they look like the same camera in a lot of ways when reviewing the footage to me.

8 hours ago, thebrothersthre3 said:

For me right now though the Ursa Mini 4.6k seems like a great deal. Just saw one for $2500 on ebay. Quite expensive compared to a BMPCC but crazy cheap for what kind of cameras it can compete with. 

We have an Ursa Mini Pro at work and just shot a big project with both that cam and the Pocket4k both maxed out and, yes, in certain scenes the DR advantage can be seen, but for the most part they look very similar. So much so, that to most, no one could tell the difference. I guess it depends on what you're shooting.

6 hours ago, mercer said:

Yeah it was nice to have. I bought mine way too early and there wasnt enough support (cages, small monitors, port add ons) to put together a useful rig for my style of shooting. Otherwise, I really loved the camera and could find a use for it again. With that being said, I’m unsure how much I would use the 60p and I wonder if the OG Pocket and a loupe would make more sense... it would definitely be the cheapest way to shoot ProRes LT.

And then Z-Cam is supposed to release their E2C model pretty soon for $799 which will offer 4K ProRes up to 30p and 1080 up to 60p. I think with a possible Raw update in the future.

A lot of choices. Haha. 

I have both the OG pocket and the Micro. Not sure I should keep both, but I too love the image. Even when we were shooting a lot of projects with the FS7 I thought the Micro blew it out of the water. Just a beautiful image.

On 4/24/2019 at 11:51 PM, kaylee said:

[warning: the golden west hotel is like arkham asylum ? and the horton plaza parking structure security guards are REALLY humorless ?]

 

I would be too if I was security at a place that dead. I'm going to look into golden west hotel now. Thanks for the tip.

.... just looked into it. That place is awful! Yikes. An asylum or jail cell. It definitely fits the role of either.

Nice work, Kaylee! I recognize my neighborhood in there. You live here too? I like the compositions and also appreciate the color.

I can't speak for Moza Air, but have it working well with Ronin S. The weight is definitely no joke. 

IMG_6748.HEIC

I agree with @webrunner5 the BM wins by a big stretch. That being said, its still pretty good for 2009. I remember being blown away by ML RAW on it when it became available.

6 hours ago, Andrew Reid said:

40 minutes at best and sometimes camera turns off at 50% so hardly reliable

This happens to you, Andrew? I've had mine for quite some time and have yet to experience this 50% shut off. Like someone else said, my new batteries last about an hour. I haven't timed it, but that seems about right.