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Emanuel

Best gimbal for Pocket 4K?

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Thanks?.  I was poking fun at the media in my bio.  Anchorage had a big earthquake in November.  One media story said the earthquake occurred in Alaska’s capital city.....which is actually Juneau (where I live).  It’s only 850 miles by road and ferry between Anchorage and Juneau, they are practically neighbors, so easy to see the mistake ? 

Also, a news anchor on the news was talking over video of cars stranded on little sections of asphalt while the rest of the road had dropped 20 or 30 feet around them.  The video showed a street sign (Minnesota Drive) where this had occurred.  The anchor excitedly exclaimed

‘I know right where this is!  Minnesota Drive is the road that comes up from the lower 48 and then continues on over to the Aleutian Islands.’

In reality the Aleutian Islands are over 1000 miles to the west of Anchorage.  Minnesota Drive is actually a road that goes north and south through Anchorage.  It’s most well known by visitors as it is the road you get on when driving to the Ted Stevens International Airport to leave Anchorage.  You drive on Minnesota to International Airport road.  There are no roads in Alaska to the west of Anchorage.  In fact the only roads in Alaska, go right through the center of the state, north to south.  The road system connects Seward and Homer on the coast to Anchorage area and Anchorage area to Fairbanks in the interior and continues north to Deadhorse and Prudhoe Bay on the Arctic Ocean.  But you can’t really go west at all in Alaska unless you are in a plane.  Even to go east and drive from Anchorage to Juneau, you have to use Canada’s road system.  In fact, over 80% of Alaska is not accessible by roads at all!   So I was just poking fun at the media who were stating ‘facts’ about the earthquake and Alaska that were a bunch of hogwash.  Typical ‘fake news’ these days it’s kind of disheartening to see as I got my start as a tv news videographer/editor and these days there is almost no fact checking they just run stories without making sure they are accurate.

As to the gimbal, the Accsoon is very good.  As I said close to a Ronin.  The Ronin has a couple advantages ‘one being how you can hold the trigger to lock it then release it to go back into another mode.’  I go through some of these advantages in my review.  But the Accsoon is very smooth, easy to balance, made pretty well, and smaller and lighter than the Ronin S while boasting the same payload.  Much like cameras, you have to choose the features that are important to you, there is no ‘best’.

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55 minutes ago, Gabe Strong said:

As to the gimbal, the Accsoon is very good.  As I said close to a Ronin.  The Ronin has a couple advantages ‘one being how you can hold the trigger to lock it then release it to go back into another mode.’  I go through some of these advantages in my review.  But the Accsoon is very smooth, easy to balance, made pretty well, and smaller and lighter than the Ronin S while boasting the same payload.  Much like cameras, you have to choose the features that are important to you, there is no ‘best’.

Exactly the same impression from some little information so far though, so yours counts indeed : ) Thanks for your input expressed here.

: -)

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Hey Guys,

sorry just a newbie here :)

After reading this forum and doing some thorough research I still can’t decide which gimbal to buy.

i have 3 options.

1. Zhiyun crane 3 lab

2. Dji ronin mx with thumb control

3. Moza lite2 with thumb control

I am using heavy lenses, focus pull system and a 7” focus monitor. I am always renting out different gimbals but still have no clue which one to purchase.

Any recommendations? 

 

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I don't want to sound silly but how strong are you? If you are on the bigger side go Ronin S. It is sort of the best there is for the money. I don't see how going with the lightest one is going to work with all the stuff you are adding. The Dji Ronin mx with thumb control is some pretty big boy money, not counting heavy as heck. It weighs 6.11 lbs without the thumb. None of them you will Need to buy with all that weight you are adding are going to be light. Running around holding 10 lbs out straight half the day doesn't sound like my cup of tea. Maybe you need to think about a vest. Depends on what your shooting situation is, maybe it is 30 seconds at a time?

Maybe you just need to add More weight and come up with a good shoulder Rig and be done with it. Heck of a lot cheaper, and a lot easier to operate unless you are going for total perfection and a lot of low angle stuff, even then you can use a handle to get that kind of angle. You can hold a 20 lbs or more rig on your shoulder for an amazing amount of time. Been there done that. Either way, the bigger you go the bigger your Wallet better be, and your body.

At least with the MX you Could add that Monitor you have,  but 7" sounds a bit big, and a extra battery, Mike, LCD on and on. The Gimbal alone can handle 10 lbs, not counting what you can add to the cage. It is the most veritable. But also the most money by far. Decisions, decisions.

 

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15 minutes ago, webrunner5 said:

Maybe you just need to add more weight and come up with a good shoulder Rig and be done with it.

I'd friendly second that regarding your demands - type of shooting with focus pull system and 7inch monitor doesn't call for relative advantages that might afford gimbal (more appropriate for lighter camera-lens combination). It could be too clumsy to move and operate, paying equal attention to focusing, proper gymbal operation, hands movements, you will easily loose spontaneity and concentration on shot. If a gimbal is the must - than better search for such that could be somehow fix to the body, as some sort of added extremity  Once again, I think that goal shouldn't be deadly non-shaking slide, but how to achieve natural movements - and get corresponding natural looking footage - without too distraction. 

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Yeah I would spend my money on a Zacuto Gratical HD LCD with a shoulder rig over a 7" monitor and the MX. Now if you have a crew looking over your shoulder, or you are looking over their shoulder lol, than I can see the 7" monitor. But man looking though a high end eyepiece is pure joy over an external monitor, especially outside.

The big trouble is you probably need to have both, and that is why doing video is so damn God Damn expensive if you want to get serious about it. That is why I got out of it years ago, there is no end to the money you really Need to spend to stay competitive. And now with new stuff coming out every week that is actually better than what you got, it is a Death Sentence now to do it. You are Always going to feel behind. Because lets be honest, this newer stuff is just flat easier to use. Manual everything is a pain in the ass when you are rushed, or tired, or frustrated, or worse, unsure of yourself in the job you are undertaking. Man now that is when it is some scary shit.. And that will, and does happen when big money is on the line from a client.

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29 minutes ago, webrunner5 said:

Yeah I would spend my money on a Zacuto Gratical HD LCD with a shoulder rig over a 7" monitor and the MX. Now if you have a crew looking over your shoulder, or you are looking over their shoulder lol, than I can see the 7" monitor. But man looking though a high end eyepiece is pure joy over an external monitor, especially outside.

The big trouble is you probably need to have both, and that is why doing video is so damn God Damn expensive if you want to get serious about it. That is why I got out of it years ago, there is no end to the money you really Need to spend to stay competitive. And now with new stuff coming out every week that is actually better than what you got, it is a death Sentence now to do it. You are Always going to feel behind. Because lets be honest, this newer stuff is just flat easier to use. Manual everything is a pain in the ass when you are rushed, or tired, or frustrated, or worse, unsure of yourself in the job you are undertaking. Man now that is when it is some scary shit.. And that will, and does happen when big money is on the line from a client.

Yes, but, from the other side, as pretty serious intruder from plethora of creative realms, I'm so often shocked how "shallow", one-dimensional and lacking of (time and knowledge and inner peace for) truly original perception/ideas are people strictly learned for film making... And how restricted are with their instruments, as fundamentally deprived in capability for play, for empathy, for seeing different angles and perspectives...

What I deeply regret is that I saw such enormously talented men and women at vimeo, with some so deeply original ideas and concepts that are high above of resulting artistic level (or lack of it) of regular movie productions... but those talented people, being poor and outside of mainstream connection, will stay forever anonymous :(

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I can tell you from experience when you start doing this stuff for money you spend one hell of a lot of nights awake. You are into a business that mostly on paper you have ONE shot at doing it. And if Anything is off by a good bit your goose is cooked no matter what you do to try and repair it, either in Post or with the Client. And there is always some talented as hell 16 year old kid down the street that is nipping at your heals. Because now they can get in pretty cheap at the start and look like a shooting star to you and your clients lol. Then it pretty much boils down to who screws up less, and has the better ideas. That is what keeps you up at night, because that is an unsustainable career path to always be better and perfect. Because now a hell of a lot more people can get into doing this stuff, and all of them can't all be stupid lol..

Just do this as a hobby, a cheap hobby and be happy, or work for someone else lol. YOU might live longer if you do.

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21 minutes ago, webrunner5 said:

I can tell you from experience when you start doing this stuff for money you spend one hell of a lot of nights awake. You are into a business that mostly on paper you have ONE shot at doing it. And if Anything is off by a good bit your goose is cooked no matter what you do to try and repair it, either in Post or with the Client. And there is always some talented as hell 16 year old kid down the street that is nipping at your heals. Because now they can get in pretty cheap at the start and look like a shooting star to you and your clients lol. Now it pretty much boils down to who screws up less, and has the better ideas. That is what keeps you up at night, because that is an unsustainable career path to always be better.

Just do this as a hobby and be happy, or work for someone else lol. YOU might live longer if you do.

Yes, well, me personally more and more did this (but with luxury to choose) stuff for money :) But it doesn't matter... Recently I watched again some De Sica's movies - what a richness and uncanny taste in framing with his than-a-days modest BW cameras! What perfection in evolving scripts through language of visual evocation of emotions! What a usage of perspective plans with totally absence of shallow DOF! Whole give-me-just-Alexa-color-science-and-nothing-else and flying crans mumbo-jumbo are smashed to trash in front of mind that experienced, suffered and searched enough and have something to convey about it... Excuse me for digression, back to the topic: De Sica, or even Dziga Vertov, had not any gimbal, but shoulders are always with us :)

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Yeah but had a crew of thousands, not really, but you get the point, to help him out. Hell All he did was direct, maybe stick his face in the viewfinder every once in awhile. He didn't do Everything like the average person has to do, they do all of it, or maybe have your crazy uncle hold a boom mike, the easy part. ?

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29 minutes ago, webrunner5 said:

Yeah but had a crew of thousands, not really, but you get the point, to help him out. Hell All he did was direct, maybe stick his face in the viewfinder every once in awhile. He didn't do Everything like the average person has to do, they do all of it, or maybe have your crazy uncle hold a boom mike, the easy part. ?

Actually, Dziga Vertov was all alone (I'd dare to try after your leading: alone as ass of hell?)

 

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Shit I was WAY better than he was. ? You tend to over exaggerate stuff. It is not even in color, and the cuts, phhff lol. Pretty poor use of Photoshop if you ask me. Why didn't he use Digital? ?

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Dziga Vartov was supported by the whole communist system doing their propagands. He had hundrends of people working under him.

Same as Riefenstahl. The whole system working for them.

Did my thesis about WWII, propaganda and Italian neorealism.

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Yeah that whole era over there was a shit storm of revolt and reform. Some good, but mostly pretty terrible. Main reason for WWII. Full of crazy ass people. Stalin, Hitler, Mussolini.

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24 minutes ago, Kisaha said:

Dziga Vartov was supported by the whole communist system doing their propagands. He had hundrends of people working under him.

Same as Riefenstahl. The whole system working for them.

 

Oh no... Maybe you are thinking about Sergei Eisenstein? Dziga Vertov filmed Man with the Movie Camera in exile in Ukraina  after he lost job in central Sovkino at Moscow because of criticism of mainstream line of Party (he than refused to make pure propaganda approach of Advertising and the Soviet Universe for the State Trade Organization). But because of success of it - yes, they hired him again and made mutual creative parthership  :)

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He filmed Movie with a Camera before all that happened to him. He fell out of favor way after that movie. Yeah at the end he may have seen the light as they say, but he was thick in it in the beginning. Shit happens. But still. He ain't no film hero of mine, talent or not.

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11 minutes ago, webrunner5 said:

He filmed Movie with a Camera before all that happened to him. He fell out of favor way after that movie. Yeah at the end he may have seen the light as they say, but he was thick in it in the beginning. Shit happenings. But still.

Sorry, it was contrary. After that movie he received whole support... But that pre-Stalin era was (just in term of creativity and indeed revolutionary ideas) totally different from usual manner represented in West: some of the greatest painters, writers, directors were offsprings from initial enthusiasm  of pure revolution, before it degenerated in Soviet version of controlled state.

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Oh I don't dispute there were an amazing bunch of talent in that Era, but a hell of a lot of people like that are mostly Rebels at heart, a good thing. Not creatures of normal behavior. Do their own thing. The problem is they are a prime target for a Jackass like Stalin, Hitler. They all, even the intellectuals, all want a better world for everyone, but Communism is just a F ing power grab and money grab, that the end result is even worse conditions. It is the biggest scam in the world and a ton of people fall for it whether willingly or forced, most forced. And death and destruction follows all of it. Communism just doesn't work in the long run. It just ends up corrupt as hell because the "people" are no longer in control of Anything. The leaders just end up being a different kind of King like you had before, only WAY worse and cruel. Human life doesn't amount to a shit.

I have lived long enough to see a lot of evil. And it is Never going to end until the world ends. There is Always a evil Bastard out there with some Pied Piper song to sing.. We have California here to propagate those crazy people lol. It needs to break off and drift out to sea. Ehh, maybe sink in the process, all lives lost. It's a silly ass State. And Hollywood leads the way. With Jerry Brown, the modern day Pied Piper. But he was not Hitler, he had Some good intentions, it is just not able to be sustained.

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For sure there are so many different aspects and layers to reckon in it, but back to the topic...

I'll get in wednesday Moza Air Cross - it has interesting unique feature of expandable plate space, so I'm curious if P4K can fit in it without additional accessories. Strange, I didn't yet manage to find anywhere if somebody has that gimbal working with P4K. Although it has 1.6kg payload, it is still enough for that camera and yet very light (under 1kg). Air Cross could supply power for GH5 or Sony cameras via dumb battery,  and I think that the same easy could be possible with P4K and Canon LP6 with maybe just changing jack in... I bought it for Micro cinema camera so will see...

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