anonim

@Kye Little bit or little bit more thinking about 3d, microcontrast, blur, creative effects etc. Of course, for video usage order of values might be different. (Story telling greatly benefit from interesting 3d separation.)

Thanks, it's so nice to hear voice of modesty, out of endless verbal judging what is future or what is dead. Actually, it seems that inner peace and modesty are the most important talents to make a gems such these - with NX1. (And it is great to see that Black Pencil still use NX1... last post is just one month old one).
 

Thanks, it's so nice to hear voice of modesty, out of endless verbal judging what is future or what is dead. Actually, it seems that inner peace and modesty are the most important talents to make a gems such these - with NX1. (And it is great to see that Black Pencil still use NX1... last post is just one month old one).
 

Probably I'm wrong, but every rumor about higher capable camera actually affects me in a strange way - to ask myself: am I really overgrew my existing tool regarding opportunities to use it, or am I even made usage of its values to full potential, for private creativeness or for real business/competitive market? Sadly, I must admit that at the moment it seems that answer is - no. (If just somewhere exists rumors about more opportunities for me to escape in camera shooting realm...)
 

I'm just intentional dreamer (I have yet to find better way to oppose to so often nightmarish surrounding)
Not strange at all, my problem with gimbals and glidecams is bulkiness, although there are the must for some narrow usage.
I firmly believe that most important and successful element (and advantage ) for indie artistic direction is possibility to more completely melt into scene and vision, to forget technical burden and calculation. With high budget we can achieve everything but at the massive budget expense and expense of  endless negotiation. That's, I think, a question of specific balance between spontaneity and preparing. Of course, it's not everyone cup of tea - I'm just trying to provide and reinforce what I feel as my inner preference (or "quality"): as mush as possible fluid stream of unrestricted imagination, letting to it to find best forms of its adaptation. (And there's a secondary gain: stronger and refreshing feeling of existence of some other center of gravity-being than boring reason in myself... but of course, it is some kind of mystical philosophy :)
 

I agree completely.  IBIS is something that people who don't need it don't understand the value in.  That's like everything in a sense, we don't appreciate what we don't use or don't need.
For me, IBIS provides a nice level of camera movement.  If you hand-hold a camera it's ok for action scenes, but too jerky for anything else and just screams "8mm home video".  Something like a shoulder rig gives a nice level of motion, the extra size eliminates the hand-shake but keeps the human movement, especially when paired with IS in a lens.  More stable than that are the glide cams which are very smooth, but @KnightsFan is right in saying they're still intuitive and can still have that human movement.  Gimbals are very difficult to control to let that human movement through, but I think part of the difficulty with them is that they let basically no changes to where the camera is pointing but still let through all of the changes in where the camera is positioned, and the combination looks odd.
You're absolutely right that it allows something new.  We used to have glide cams or shoulder-rigs to give that level of movement, we also used to have rigs that were very fast to setup and use which allowed spontaneity and life to blossom in front of the camera easily, and we also used to have small setups that you could take into places that don't allow professional filming. 
IBIS brings these three together in a way that we never had before, and for me that's what creates new creative possibilities.  You can use the size and speed to allow filming in situations where there wouldn't have been time, or to allow more movement that would have been very difficult before.  Shooting calligraphy is a beautiful way of saying it, another might be to have a dance between the subject and the camera.
I am attempting to make videos of my family (who don't re-do things and I'm not going to ask them to) in places where there is no professional shooting allowed and I'm carrying around the camera all day, and I want the end results to be as beautiful as I can make them, which hand-shake completely destroys IMHO.  IBIS is what allows me to shoot in places and not get told off or asked to leave.
I suspect they will get better, and may incorporate additional features that make this easier in the future.  For example, if there was a little camera looking at you scanning your face and you could steer the direction of the camera by angling your head, like those separate controllers do when you tilt or rotate them now.  This would be very intuitive because I know that when I'm watching something and I want the camera to look somewhere else at something off-screen I move my head by instinct as if trying to get the camera to move. 

That's true you can be much more in tune with your camera when using IBIS. I love your knowledge of film history though most of it goes right over my head ? 

Probably I'm wrong, but every rumor about higher capable camera actually affects me in a strange way - to ask myself: am I really overgrew my existing tool regarding opportunities to use it, or am I even made usage of its values to full potential, for private creativeness or for real business/competitive market? Sadly, I must admit that at the moment it seems that answer is - no. (If just somewhere exists rumors about more opportunities for me to escape in camera shooting realm...)
 

IBIS absence from GH5s was also explained as solution for protecting most demanding professional customers from image defects.
Of course, most demanding professional customers immediately recognized and wholeheartedly congratulated such deeply protection-motivated move.

Maybe, but I, personally, don't think so, or at least I can't approved that nostalgia effect in myself. Simply argument? I watched Tarkovski's Nostalghia 100 times (btw even wrote big 3-parts novel with same title and motto from that movie) - but I properly enjoyed just in last restоration of it, which is, actually, pretty sharp and detailed The same goes with 3 movies from Parajanov that are, finally, very recently restored/saved out from too soft, muddy look. Or, maybe there's some false hope for me, maybe I'm still not too old?

Maybe, but I, personally, don't think so, or at least I can't approved that nostalgia effect in myself. Simply argument? I watched Tarkovski's Nostalghia 100 times (btw even wrote big 3-parts novel with same title and motto from that movie) - but I properly enjoyed just in last restоration of it, which is, actually, pretty sharp and detailed The same goes with 3 movies from Parajanov that are, finally, very recently restored/saved out from too soft, muddy look. Or, maybe there's some false hope for me, maybe I'm still not too old?

I have Voigtlanders, had SB's...
But, please, Mr, when you start statements with "The new order will be"... or "BM is joke of company" it seems to me that it is not quite logical to expect answers - because you are so sure you know everything and in advance make impossible any exchange of arguments.
(Moreover, I must admit that, personally, I'm especially sensible to such attitude in conversation - but, of course, that's my own problem and I'm sure someone else will applaude to such tough-definitive close-the-door words. Unfortunately, I'm so tender, soft, even meek, so always ready to recede in front of such authority... )

I can just share experience and point of view, not at all advice. So, from my narrow perspective and goal of usage, I learned that my decision primarily and mostly come from lenses, not from cameras. I learned that I'm so fond to old school manual and cinema lenses, that I can't really find enjoy in modern, electronic, plastic ones without precise MF. For some reason that maybe origin from my character or education, I simply can't use autofocus, although it is great add - maybe I don't like helps and adds. But, I also learned that, unfortunately, I don't fully enjoy in permanently usage of adapters. So, my totally narrow experience say: choose first lens(es), then system. Cameras comes and go, bettering each other, lenses may stay with us for a long time.
Having said that, it seems to me that both Fuji and Panasonic (and BM) today are extremely attractive. Without doubt, we can match them, but why complicate matters and do so? At the moment when I started to be more seriously engaged in video/movie shooting, Fuji had no enough competitive characteristics. Now it is different, although still not quite.
If I'm starting now and have XT3 in hand, maybe I'll wait and see coming of XH2 - it seems that it will be greatly rounded tool. But, I will not choose that if I don't firmly know about most important lens that I'd stick with it - it is Fujinon MK zoom. I tried Fuji XF lenses, but I was not fully satisfied with them, as also with Panasonic, Sony, even also and Olympus ones. But now I think that SLR Magic or Makinon or so make old school Fuji primes and there are also Veydras that give wider angle to APSC sensor.
It seems that new Nikon cameras have to have adapter for using old beautiful Ais's. Pity, but maybe I could digest it. In general, it seems to me that FF cameras are not yet enough reasonable choice for my narrow usage. I had few Sony ones.
The most important reason for still staying with Panasonic is, of course, again lenses. But I'll not name them
 

I sure like my GH5, but if I was constantly having to match it to something else I'd probably like it a lot less!
This is excellent advice.  Lenses are really the place to start with building your setup to deliver the aesthetic you want to create.  
Also, don't underestimate the benefits of only having to buy one set of lenses that can be used across all your camera bodies.  And also maybe things like batteries, media, and accessories, although they're potentially more universal, or aren't the same across a brand.
Also also, if you have a setup with different brands and different non-compatible lenses then if a body fails you can't swap in another unless you have duplicate lenses and everything.  From a purely artistic perspective having a mixture might be an appealing thought, but from a "get it filmed, get it edited, get it out the door, get paid" kind of perspective, compatibility has real advantages.

I can just share experience and point of view, not at all advice. So, from my narrow perspective and goal of usage, I learned that my decision primarily and mostly come from lenses, not from cameras. I learned that I'm so fond to old school manual and cinema lenses, that I can't really find enjoy in modern, electronic, plastic ones without precise MF. For some reason that maybe origin from my character or education, I simply can't use autofocus, although it is great add - maybe I don't like helps and adds. But, I also learned that, unfortunately, I don't fully enjoy in permanently usage of adapters. So, my totally narrow experience say: choose first lens(es), then system. Cameras comes and go, bettering each other, lenses may stay with us for a long time.
Having said that, it seems to me that both Fuji and Panasonic (and BM) today are extremely attractive. Without doubt, we can match them, but why complicate matters and do so? At the moment when I started to be more seriously engaged in video/movie shooting, Fuji had no enough competitive characteristics. Now it is different, although still not quite.
If I'm starting now and have XT3 in hand, maybe I'll wait and see coming of XH2 - it seems that it will be greatly rounded tool. But, I will not choose that if I don't firmly know about most important lens that I'd stick with it - it is Fujinon MK zoom. I tried Fuji XF lenses, but I was not fully satisfied with them, as also with Panasonic, Sony, even also and Olympus ones. But now I think that SLR Magic or Makinon or so make old school Fuji primes and there are also Veydras that give wider angle to APSC sensor.
It seems that new Nikon cameras have to have adapter for using old beautiful Ais's. Pity, but maybe I could digest it. In general, it seems to me that FF cameras are not yet enough reasonable choice for my narrow usage. I had few Sony ones.
The most important reason for still staying with Panasonic is, of course, again lenses. But I'll not name them
 

I'd be glad to buy and test/play P4k from you - and so to help you to survive from unpleasant feeling of living-close-to-dead-system  
The more cameras are coming I'm more astonished with mistake that Panasonic made with GH5 that so miscalculatingly overshadowed future products... luckily, they put in it that ugly-wobbling IBIS for preventing really professional shooters to use it and ruin their precious pure cinema art achievements.
But, then right from nowhere came mr Sage with his GHa lut and inject in stubborn GH5 vampire fresh blood...

I respect your opinion and experience here. Much like with cars, it can go fast but still be an ugly car at the end of the day. The classics always have something special about them. I guess I just don't think I value that canon "special sauce" as much as you do for the prices they want for it. I think companies like Fuji and Panasonic are creeping up in this area with competitive products. I also think the "special sauce" is a decade or more of visual bias caused by watching A LOT of media shot on Canon cinema cameras.
At the end of the day I think we are all constantly seeking confirmation that we have the best tool because we spent our hard earned money on it. Especially if we spent a lot and feel threatened by newer gear. I just prefer not to feed the canon segmentation machine.

Wow Caesar

It's sort of funny Emanuel that of all the time I have been one here I think you have contributed the least useful information of anyone with endless babbling posts containing just about zero info about anything. And then come back like a little girl does and try to deflect what I said and turn it on to me. You sir are a horses ass. You have turned into an angry person as of late. And yeah Glenn is tired of your Bullshit also. So I, like him, will leave you to your as of late cesspool of useless words and not really loose any sleep because of it. I think this Forum sort of deserves you. Just mindless babble about gear and no care about footage. Sort of becoming DPR.

Yes, harsh movements are always dangerous for... sensors.

IBIS absence from GH5s was also explained as solution for protecting most demanding professional customers from image defects.
Of course, most demanding professional customers immediately recognized and wholeheartedly congratulated such deeply protection-motivated move.

IBIS absence from GH5s was also explained as solution for protecting most demanding professional customers from image defects.
Of course, most demanding professional customers immediately recognized and wholeheartedly congratulated such deeply protection-motivated move.

No they Use to do a thing or two right. That is the problem. The 5D mk III was the last FF camera they made that was a real effort. Class leading on the video side. They have lost most of the Pro C market now. They are just sliding down into the shitter as far as I am concerned. They have went from the best you can do mindset, to lets just push the shit out the door mindset. To me they are not the leader of anything anymore. Even the L lenses are mostly crap for the video side. EF-S lenses work better overall. They have become a 1990's company.

That's true, but it's always useful for those who can't afford to walk in the woods, or don't have time or the right shoes for it, to be able to go for a walk in the city and then fix it in post

IMO it is very interesting to see how Panasonic (or respectively any other) marketing team hardly works to think and rethink and find a space under the selling sun for all products in their gamma. Some sort of puzzle: what will they cripple here and there, what to loosely promise here and there, what to put in the upgrade roadmap. Big exercise of logic that grows to mini science under the pressure of competition.