MurtlandPhoto

26 minutes ago, Caleb Genheimer said:

I know Gerald is apparently in vogue as the reviewer to bash, but honestly I got a lot more from his preview than from the others I watched (including Media Division).

 

1. He had that shot out a window that clearly and concisely showed the impact of engaging DR Boost

 

2. He whacked the camera around to show how good the RS performs

 

3. Sure, his “is dead” statement is clickbaity, but heck, he laments even having to drop a video at embargo lift. He knows what he’s doing, it’s just how it has to be done to a certain extent, and most importantly, if you pay attention to his justification for personally declaring that, HE’S RIGHT.

 

Anyone who follows sensor tech and the signal processing along with it will recognize that he gave grounded reasons. For what it is, the performance is incredible, but they can’t cheat the physics of smaller sensors. I think the GH6 will serve many serious creators well, just like every other GH before it, but we’re now at a juncture where Panasonic has larger sensors in the game as an alternative. On paper, I think what most (if not all) the reviewers have missed though is its strengths versus the S-Series, which fill in some (not all) gaps, making it a VERY attractive B-Cam. Most importantly, they’ve managed full V-Log, so matching should be a breeze. And secondly, where DR is M4/3’s Achilles Heel, RS is Full Frame’s! The GH6 has piles of VERY high quality HFR AND low rolling Shutter. 
 

If you have an S-Series body, and need a second camera, I think the GH6 adds more flexibility to your arsenal than a second S-Series body would.

Agreed. Gerald kinda stuck his neck out there, but I think he’s right: if ultimate image quality is your primary goal, m43 isn’t the right choice plain and simple. The GH6 is the very best the system can offer and it’s still not as good an image as the entry level FF S5. Still, it’s a superrrrr compelling camera if you’re fully invested in m43. 

There's a bunch of interesting little features to this thing, but the biggest thing for me is the addition of h.264 and h.265 internally. Personally, that has always been the #1 factor in deciding whether I take my Panasonic kit or Blackmagic kit for certain jobs. This blurs that line completely.  

I was waiting for someone to post this 🙂 I think this could be Blackmagic's most compelling camera to date. It is their first do-everything camera: cinema, corporate, broadcast, live event and streaming. The price is just right. 

46 minutes ago, Mark Romero 2 said:

One benefit of refurbished cameras over even NEW cameras is that they have had someone from the offical repair center go over the cameras thoroughly.

When a new camera comes off the production line, they are going to give it a quick diagnostic test, maybe take a few frames with it, and that's about it.

When you buy refurbished, it means someone has really taken the time to look into the camera. (At leas more so than when it rolled off the assembly line.)

This is a really good point. 

58 minutes ago, SRV1981 said:

Does refurbished indicate a potentially better quality?  also for used - do you like KEH? MBP? BH?

 

Makes sense!  i was going to call Canon to see about their Refurbished policy and potentially save a few hundred by getting a refurb body

Refurbished items often come with warrantees of their own making them a bit safer than just straight up used copies. I definitely recommend buying used or refurbished from any of those retailers in addition to Adorama. I've had great experiences with all of them. The used prices are often a little higher than you'd pay buying direct from another person, but you get the security of solid return policies and reputations.

Obviously the best value savings is in used lenses. They don't get replaced with new models every couple years and don't become "obsolete" when they do eventually get replaced. For cameras, I have a system I've developed lol. Cameras below $3000 I will buy brand new on day one to maximize the useful life and the return on my investment. Cameras more than $3000, I will mostly wait for a used body to appear before buying. But, obviously there's a balance between price and age that needs to be reached. I swap out cameras wayyyy too often TBH, but since I stay in the ~$3000 range mostly I'm never too deep underwater lol.

I too have been using a small camera lately to fly under the radar. I went with the Osmo Pocket. It's perfect for home videos and BTS stuff on set. 

Funky looking thing, but the versatility of an integrated gimbal is probably gamechanging for some people. I'm pretty intrigued.

On 8/25/2021 at 9:27 AM, MurtlandPhoto said:

Personally I bought the Ursa Mini Pro earlier this year which is largely the same camera. It’s big and heavy making it a pain in the ass sometimes compared to my Pocket 6K. BUT, the ND filters, BRAW to SD cards, shoulder kit and EVF, SDI, and full XLR inputs give it an edge over my other cams.

Well now, just over month later, I cannot recommend the Ursa Mini Pro to anyone. On Sept. 5 my UMP died out of nowhere in the middle of a shoot. Completely black image off the sensor, no menus, no image from SDI, won't playback clips... DEAD. I talked to Blackmagic and other users. It turns out this is a fatal sensor issue that Blackmagic will not service at all. They won't even take the camera to assess it—all they needed was an email conversation to confirm this was the issue. I can't recommend a camera from a company that refuses to service their own product. They'll still service the G2, but for how long?? Is that worth the risk? Not for me. Not while I'm dealing with insurance.

I've moved on to the Panasonic EVA1 to match my S1 in Vlog. The menu system feels like I'm in the stone ages compared to Blackmagic's fantastic menus and the screen is utter garbage, but the image is simply amazing and right up on par with the UMP. 

2 hours ago, Matins 2 said:

It looks absolutely terrible. But it was totally to be expected.

That's what I'm saying though. Is this terrible new aesthetic a sort of meta take on the film industry right now? The machines have formed a poorly-shot green screen,  ultra punchy color hellscape for humans to live within which mirrors the state of much of cinema now.

Or is this just an ugly movie. Lol.

I think {hope} we're seeing some clever marketing here. Much of the trailer footage shows a sort of hyper-realistic video gamey aesthetic... perhaps because it is a video game of sorts. Maybe it is the next iteration of the matrix after Neo reached the source and saved Zion. Similar to how the Matrix color tone was green and the real world was blueish in the trilogy, perhaps the matrix is ultra bright, colorful, and contrasty in this movie??

14 minutes ago, barefoot_dp said:

That's what confuses me so much. If they want to make a solo-operator camera, do it! Put the controls where you can reach them, for a start.

I think the primary controls will still be on the top-mounted touchscreen just like with all the DSMC2 bodies. The added controls on the other side are just another option. Although, it does make adding a side handle... awkward.

At this point I don’t see enough upsides to get the 4.6K. Personally I bought the Ursa Mini Pro earlier this year which is largely the same camera. It’s big and heavy making it a pain in the ass sometimes compared to my Pocket 6K. BUT, the ND filters, BRAW to SD cards, shoulder kit and EVF, SDI, and full XLR inputs give it an edge over my other cams. 
 

If your intention is to shoot on sticks or handheld, I think the Pockets are far better choices than the 4.6K right now. 

20 hours ago, herein2020 said:

Regardless of what it is meant for, it doesn't change the fact that the support system needed to get quality footage out of this camera costs many times more than the camera itself.

But that's not unique to just this camera. Once you make that jump to a legit cinema camera, the accessories go up in price. But lighting, rigging, and support equipment isn't exclusive to big cameras. I can use the same amount of expensive lights and rigging for a shoot with my Panasonic S1 as I do with my UMP. 

Very exciting news! I feel like the price drop is similar to the OG Pocket fire sale. No immediate replacement imminent... just doing it to do it. Some may say the 12K is overkill, but BRAW made that resolution very manageable from what I've seen. 

Rumor has it that the S1/S1R/S5 will be getting a firmware update next week adding BRAW output from the HDMI port. That to me puts the S line even higher up the list as the best hybrid cameras on the market right now. I'd love to have BRAW out of the USB C port a la the Pocket line though.

3 hours ago, newfoundmass said:

I find it hard to believe that they're going to charge $2500 based only on what they announced today. Maybe I'm wrong, but I suspect there will be quite a few features that will help justify the higher price tag. I could be totally wrong though. 

There are many more specs to tease out, DR being a major one. They did the same thing with the GH5: the development announcement had a few enticing features to get people excited and their wallets ready, then the full announcement dished out all the goods.

5 hours ago, BTM_Pix said:

Like JVC found though, trying to undo the pre-conceived notion of the relationship between the mount size and the sensor size being absolute is a bit of a tough sell.

I sooooo wanted JVC to find success here. The camera itself wasn't quite right for me, but a Panasonic or Blackmagic camera doing the same thing would almost certainly found its way into my kit.

I wonder (hope) if there are some bigger benefits that perhaps this limited spec sheet doesn't show? The same sensor, but with a much better processor could mean faster readout, better DR, cleaner ISO, etc., right? Maybe internal 4K60p 10 bit? Maybe...

Although this is a pretty damning situation

1 hour ago, MrSMW said:

I stopped using eBay for camera gear sales when with one lens sale, the purchaser came back and reported the lens had been dropped (by me) at some time and wanted a 50% refund. I said no and it was sent back and zero issues with it. And there were none when I sent it.

Another told me a lens they had purchased from was water damaged. FK off. Sent it back to me. I sent it and sold it to a dealer without issue.

I just don’t trust the place anymore. Never really have actually...

I hear you. Instead of eBay, I do a lot of selling on Fred Miranda forums. You have to pay a fee to sell on the site and you must build up good feedback to sell. Because it's a niche market, you end up with scrupulous buyers and sellers. 

7 hours ago, MrSMW said:

My only experience of eBay has been mixed and I try and avoid the place these days. Especially in regard to big ticket items.

I think the trick of it is to really REALLY consider purchases in the first place and their longevity.

Cameras I expect to run into the ground these days and if buying or selling used, go through a dealer.

MBP make it so easy and yes, you might make a few quid extra selling (or cheaper buying) private, but near zero risk, returns policy, postage/delivery all taken care of and fast.

I bought my used S1H from them recently using their EU division. It arrived from Berlin within 24 hours.

I also sent them a piece of gear which they checked over and said had a small internal issue which downgraded their evaluation, so they are thorough.

Anyway, sorry about your phones Andrew. It’s stuff like this that people seem to have issues with most on eBay, - techy gear with higher sticker prices. 

+1 going through a reputable used dealer, but definitely shop around when trying to sell your gear. Adorama gave me an embarrassingly low quote for my mint condition Nocticron 42.5mm f/1.2. They wanted to give me $300 for it since they had many used copies already in stock. So, it made me nervous but I went the private route and was able to get $800 for it. Risk and reward sometimes.

Holy shit @Andrew Reid this is insane. I've often felt like a crazy person being so nervous to sell anything of value on eBay, but this justifies my fears. I'm sorry this happened to you and I hope some better resolution can come of it!

2 hours ago, gt3rs said:

Really cool that they listened to feedback, with the new firmware you can use the transmitter as standalone recorder:

'Always' recording mode: When this mode is activated, the transmitter will start recording audio as soon as it is switched on. It will continue recording until it is switched off, regardless of whether is it connected to the receiver. This means that you will have a continuous recording from the moment the transmitter is switched on, making this mode suitable for using the Wireless GO II as a standalone field recorder. Note that in this mode, the ‘mute’ function will not affect the on-board recording (although it will still mute the wireless transmission).

This is fantastic! The use case I'm scoping out with the GO II is walking tour of a college campus. It will be great to be able to have a single audio source for the on-camera segments and the scripted, voiceover stuff with b-roll. I did something similar a couple years ago with a traditional wireless set. The presenter would meander through talking points making the constant starting and stopping of recording on video a bit of a pain, so having the full recording will be helpful. Super specific use case, but useful for me haha.

19 hours ago, newfoundmass said:

What they're doing is very interesting. I've yet to use one myself, though I've heard it's a bit rough around the edges when it comes to OS and some reliability. 

I think they need to streamline their naming convention and have more than just a Facebook group for promotion and support. That stuff is a bit confusing / makes the overall system unwelcoming given the attitude many people in their group have to anyone that doesn't praise absolutely everything about the cameras. I see people getting talked down to regularly when just asking genuine support questions. 

I actually think they have one of the best naming conventions in the whole industry. All the cameras are in the E2 generation, but M4 is m43 4K, S6 is s35 6K, F6 is FF 6K, and F8 is FF 8K. Compare that to a7siii, FX3, C70, etc. when trying to judge specs at a glance. Even Blackmagic's convoluted naming at least lets you know what the cameras offer 😅

2 minutes ago, crevice said:

Do we not care anymore about the actual inside of cameras anymore?  But, minus BRAW, C70 is better in almost every single way.

Taking away a major internal feature from the P6K to make your argument doesn't really work, though. For my money, two P6K Pros are worth more than one C70. You may feel differently. Everyone has a different balance they need to reach.