Marcio Kabke Pinheiro

Will do a test with mine here - not the best conditions now (the temperature here dropped to around 23oC), and only have a V30 card (a 200Mbps Sandisk Extreme Pro that until now worked without glitches with 6.2k, but probably will generate more heat). But will try to record in Long GOP instead of ALL-I (this probably generates even more heat), with the LCD open (since the back was made to get the fan, probably there is some heat spreader there).

I'm using 10-bit 4:2:0 in my X-S20 because 10-bit 4:2:2 have no hardware decoders on Nvidia cards, only 10-bit 4:2:0. From what I've searched, keying, like you said, is the most visible difference, and contrast on the edges (hence the better keying in 4:2:2). Looks like some very pushy grades are better with 4:2:2, too. For me (personal use), I think that 4:2:0 will be enough - never had a 10-bit camera before, I guess that 8 to 10 bit is a much more noted upgrade.

Yep - will upgrade my computer on Black Friday, and heavily thinking about a Mini M1 or M2. But there is some hurdles: - I use 3 monitors - not exactly for photo / video editing, but for my (real) work. Rarely use the 3 simultaneously on one computer - generally 2 are on one computer and one on another - but today I can use the 3 if needeed and manage it by software. With a M1 or M2, or I got a Pro model (which is more more expensive), or have to manage it using a HDMI switch (using 2 monitors max) or some gizmos that I found. - Software issues: some softwares that I use do not have Mac versions, one specifically recently got one but somewhat limited compared to the Windows one. Guess I could use it with Parallels, but have to see. - Price: Buy it from Apple here is out of question - the Mac Mini M2 price is almost 140% higher than in US (yep, you see it right, 140%). From another channels, I could get it for a 100% increase. In fact, is MUCH cheaper to get a round trip ticket plane from Brazil to USA and buy the computer... Considering internal prices, in fact, for the estimated price of my upgrade, i could get and used Mini M1. Since my old computer is completely fine for everything that I need except video editing, and since it is old, the resell value is very low, maybe I will keep it and use the Mac only when doing photo / video editing...

Still want to test my X-S20 - it is winter here, so it will not be the best case.

Another point that is bothering me right now: the lack of testing some details point, coupled together with (looks like) the companies refusing to answer some technical details. Some examples: - Electronic shutter for stills: what are the penalties, if any, besides rolling shutter? In the past, I remember some smaller Panasonics reverting to a lower bit depth when using it. Tested in my current cameras, the RAWs have the full bit depth, but it is real bit depth or less bits wrapped in a bigger bit depth "container"? There is a dynamic range penalty? Never find a correct (and justified) answer. - Always is said that a 4k image downsampled from a larger read in camera render a better image than a 4k crop of the sensor. Looks logical - but why the image quality from the Open Gate cameras (hence, using a 1:1 readout of the sensor) are showing no image penalty? - Which cameras have (or not) plug-in power for using external mics? Good luck to find out. Every review is the same topics over and over. Taking the X-S20 for example: no one mentioned that the Face / Eye AF is not only better, but is totaly different than before, you have to use is a very different way. No comparison between the penalties of using lower data bitrates - is 360mbps and 200mbps much different? Or 10-bit 4:2:2 and 10-bit 4:2:0 - I've discovered this is a HUGE topic for Windows users this week, because Nvidia cards only have decoders for 10 bit 4:2:0, you could have the best RTX 4xxx card and your 10 bit 4:2:2 footage will only decode using CPU; and only the newer Intels CPUs with iGpu have hardware decoders 10 bit 4:2:2. Everything is very shallow.

In fact, all environmental data is important when comparing overheating issues, for all brands. What was the current temperature outside? What was the humidity level? The camera was in shade or inder the sun? What was the filming load before the overheating (aka, the camera was already hot?). As I said before, reports (not only from the A6700) are all over the place. It is bad testing methodology (if there is any), or the QC on these cameras are all over the place. Or both.

Finally got some time to navigate all the menu and do some quick tests. Call me impressed. Surprise one: one little old desire (that nobody mentioned in the reviews) was that now the "3d" electronic level could be enabled pemanentely on the screen / EVF; in the X-S10 - and I guess in all the last generation's Fujis - only the horizontal level was permanent, the 3D version should be activated by a custom button, and disappeared after taking a shot. Surprise two: a new focus assist tool, only in video mode - Focus Meter. Is a "needle gauge" that shows where to turn the focus ring to bring the image in focus, and that could be used in conjunction with peaking. Works very well and very accurately. And finally, the AF. The face / eye AF interface and working mode was completely changed form the 4th gen Fuji's. In these (X-S10, X-T4, etc), when face / eye AF is on, the camera selects a face / eye and shows it on the screen in green, the other faces are marked with grey boxes, and you could change the face to focus with the joystick. In theory, a good system - until you hit record, and the camera goes haywire changing the face focused at will. For me, with more than one face on the frame, was unusable. Now, you choose a area box (that you could resize), and the camera will focus on the closest face of the box. Period. And tends to stick quite a bit in that face before switching to other. Not a perfect system - did not tested the worst situation, with all other people standing in place and the focused person going to the edge of the frame, far from the box, which in theory will make the camera changing the face focused - but if you keep the subject in the same spot of the frame, or move the box with the joystick, works perfectly. There are more subtleties to discover - one test was filming my wife's father, my wife and my daughter playing in our living room, tracking my daughter (an electric 4 year old), a case which the X-S10 failed completely; the focus point moved from person to person if they are close. With the X-S20, started tracking my daughter, and NEVER let her go. Focus spot on 100% of the time. And with an unexpected behaviour when my daughter got very close to my wife's father, instead of jumping faces, the old gray box appeared on his face, but the AF was kept on my daughter. One touch on the joystick, and then he was in focus - even with my daughter closer to the AF box. Another touch, returned to my daughter. Just as I wanted to be. The detection is much improved too. In the X-S10, if the person turns and the face did not appear, the camera reverts to the original AF mode. The X-S20 recognizes the back of a head - when the person turns, it starts tracking the back of the head. The person turns back, it revert to the eyes again. And the face / eye detection works in much farther distances than before, and gathers eye / face instantly. Is a completely new behaviour, much, much better than before.

Thinking about varifocals, how is your experience? And some glass lens recomendations? (old guys derailing a thread...)

Hope your eyes are good. My X-S20 have a much better lcd than the X-S10 (1.6m x 1.0 mdots), I could see that the screen info is a bit sharper but...even with glasses, the image looks almost the same 😑

Yep, it is a similar story too. I had my (very amateur) dj days too, albeit being a Traktor guy (already in the middle of the transition). But learnt to mix with vinyl, MUCH more rewarding. 🙂

And after a loooong wait (courtesy of the customs, which delayed the delivery to the store for almost 3 weeks,) the camera arrived today. As expected, very similar to the X-S10, charging the battery now. This was the first surprise - included in the box was a very good USB-C to USB-C cable, and a very good 3A 15w charger, with 4 interchangable wall plugs. Dunno if this will be the norm around the world, but was welcome. As reviews already said, most of the buttons have a higher profile and the clicks are more pronounced. The ISO/ Q buttons are much better, always hated them in the X-S10, now they are very good. All the dials have greater resistance between clicks, whick I liked too - had a lot of involuntary turning on the back dial of the X-S10. The on-off switch is stiffer too, will have to see if this will be a good or bad point, but the switch is higher and easier to access too. The grip is a bit beefier too, albeit in a very small margin considering how bigger the newer battery is - good job, Fuji. In hand, the 1st impression is that the feel is better too, but is very subtle. Joystick still too small (for my tastes, all the new units should have the X-H2 newer joystick), but the clicks are a bit stiffier too. Good first impressions. Still too few buttons and switches to my taste, but that was expected.

Indeed. My X-S20 just arrived, and have 6k 10-bit 4:2:2 with good(ish?) AF and IBIS in a body roughly bigger than a GX85. 4-5 years ago, it was unthinkable. But ergos are all over the place - this a thing that could improve. I've taken my GH2 out of the dry box to use it to test the last m43 lenses that I'm selling. First, this thing is freaking small - since the GH3 we forgot how small it was. And, even small...look at the image. Left dial, focus area, with a lever to switch the AF mode. Main dial (with 3 custom positions!) with two lever, one to set drive mode and other is the on-off switch (in a amazing position, very easy to access with the thumb). I miss this a lot. (and good internal mics - the GH2 mics are VERY good, much better than all the other Pannys that I had (never had a GH5 or G9, though).

1 - Yep, they are. As I said sometimes here, I'm in a Telegram group that have a lot of younger "content creators", mostly talking about gear shopping, but sometimes giving filmmaking hints to each other. NEVER in this almost 8 months there I saw a link to some forum or webpage. Ever. All links are to Youtube or Instagram. 2 - Which leads from the previous point. People want videos, nobody reads anymore. Even some blog guys like Gordon Laing or Robin Wong are putting more efforts on Youtube. I like Youtube to see some tests like AF, recording the camera screen to show how the detection is ocurring, but few people do that. Or to show some ergonomics. The rest, I prefer text, but is a dying preference. 3 - Fanboyism is a long staple in camera community. For me is a human necessity to prove themselves right - I bought this camera / lens, and I will defend that I made THE BEST decision. And as @MrSMWsaid, there is a ‘you don’t need anything new’ mantra - which, specially for stills, is very true. Video is still being improved, but for stills the only tangible upgrade was in the AF section. 4 - For experienced people to comunicate with newer genrations is hard - because these people tend to lend long explanations telling just not HOW to solve a problem, but also WHY that was the solution. Which is a good thing - it increases the knowledge of the reader. But nowadays people wants FAST solutions, don't want to even search for themselves. Last week in the already mentioned Telegram group, one guy made a very basic question, and I gave him the solution. THE NEXT message in the channel was another guy...making THE SAME question. Yeah, he not only did not made a previous search, but did not even to bother read THE PREVIOUS MESSAGE. And this is the norm.

Not to defend Sony (did not have a Sony camera, and their overheating history is not the best), but the guy in the video did not give too much info: - The overheating threshold was set to "High"? - The back screen was flipped outside the camera (which improves the heat dissipation)? - And using that live cropping mode for sure increases the camera processing (which is not invelid to test, lost of people could use it). Telling that beacuse I'm monitoring the X-S20 situation (my unit had not arrived - maybe this week) and the overheating reports are all over the place. One person said that the camera overheated just navigating the menus. Other people recorded 30 mins in 6.2k open gate 10-bit 4:2:2 in Malaysia under the sun (the place is humid as hell) and the camera never even get a warning. Or the QC of these cameras are all over the place, or there is a lot of variance depending on the modes / resources used.

S5 II have internal fan and is one of the cheapest FF video cameras - and Panasonic have the best heat management, the GX9 that I had never even get warmer recording 4k (probably best chipset design).

Since it is SO cheap, I've got one for my X-S20 (when the camera arrives arrives). Don't have high hopes, though. The fan is kinda small, blows it to "open air" behind the fan, and not certain about the suction cups. Probably will mod it to be like the Fuji fan - put a metal plate on the back (which help is general dissipation) and attach using screws.

Yep, it is good. And they have all the conditions to improve - just look the latest Viltrox lenses, mile sbetter than the 1st ones (I have the 13mm f/1.4 and the 75mm f/1.2 and both are amazing, the 75mm is mind blowing)

Good news - but saw some reviews of their Af lenses, and specially the zooms do not look stellar.

My 2 cents after seeing some reviews as a targeted consumer of this camera - hybrid-enthusiast-amateur. Yes, because if doing videos was my work, don't even would think about this one. It is a rollercoaster of features: some very "high" (good) and some very low (bad). Mostly comparing it to the Fuji XS-20, which looks like the closest competitor. High: - 4K60 and 4K120 available in this price point - and, importantly, the image in these modes are VERY good. (I'm looking to the 1080p 240 from you, Fuji). - Card slot on the side, not on the battery door. - No idiotic filters / effects on the mode dial; - Arguably the best AF on the market, and good to use use manual focus too with the Focus Map feature (never tested it, but looks amazing and almost no one talks about it). - Dedicated switch between stills and video - much better than turning a mode dial.- Small - in the videos I got the impression that the camera is bigger because it looks thicker, but is even smaller than the X-S20. Heck, even smaller than a Panasonic GX85. Low: - Horrible 1080p video, if you want it; - Bitrates looks bad, 100 mbps for 4k24 (but never used XAVC-HD to have an opinion); - Terrible LCD panel for 2023 standards; - No focus joystick - and yes, was just the case to put one on the place of the AF-ON button, and moved the button up. - Bad burst still numbers; - No open gate or DCI 4k; - Dunno if the C modes on dials could be used for video too; About overheating: for people like me (hybrid normal user), and most the "content creators", it is almost a non-issue. Slow-mo is not used a lot, and when used, is for small takes. In fact, for Youtubers, the bad 1080p is more of a concern - a lot of these people still uses 1080p. Overheat could pose a problem for hybrid wedding shooters, I guess. In this regard, the fan of the X-S20 is kinda of a good solution - but if I wanna use Fuji for any professional use, would get a X-H2 or X-H2s. I liked the camera. But, if the X-S20 have AF good enough, is a much better proposition - in fact, Fujifilm released a firmware update yesterday that enhances the AF performance (but, again, no general wide / area tracking). And you have open gate and even the option to get an external recorder and shoot RAW video, for $100 less than the Sony. And, for stills, you have Fuji colors. All goes down to AF performance. For "content creators", is the most important thing - and the reason that ZV-E10 sells like hotcakes. The Canon R7 looks slight ahead than both these ones, but...where are the lenses? The A6700 is terrific for the intended public - and for the boatloads of the A6xxx users, is a no brainer. This one will sell VERY well.

Just got a reply from the local vendor, my X-S20 should arrive only in July 25th. 😐 Fuji AF got better in this last generation - not on par with Sony, Canon or even PDAF Panasonic - but could be enough for me. But not having a Wide / Tracking mode in video is inexcusable. Even OM Digital have a (poor) one. Even Fuji have it for stills, but not for video.

Of course Sony could not deliver everything at once - front dial is there, but no joystick on the back. Ok, since their AF is so reliable, you could always go for tracking and recompose, but a miss anyways. $100 more than a X-S20 (which I guess it is its primary competition). Better in some ways, wors in others. - Back LCD: VERY bad, 1.0 million dots, compared to the 1.8 million of the X-S20. Fuji wins - EVF: both have (probably the same panel) 2.36 mp. The magnification is better on Sony, 0.7x against 0.62 on Fuji. Sony wins. - IBIS: 7 stops on Fuji, 5 on Sony. But all these must be seen in real world. Both are usually bad for video. - Weather sealing: Sony have (even a light one), Fuji not. - As stated, Fuji have joystick, Sony not (only the LCD trackpad). - Video modes: 6.2k open gate on Fuji, not open gate AFAIK on Sony. The bitrates are higher on Fuji too, 4k until 360mbps, 100 mbps on Sony - albeit dunno if there is a huge difference on quality. Since is the same quality of the other Sonys, probably not. - SD card slot on the side for the Sony: always a plus. Looking good for Fuji, my X-S20 is on the way, but...this one is the 1st tempting Sony for me. First, a personal reason: I prefer "rangerfinder" bodies for not-being-noted reasons. Second: because Sony already have a AF mode perfect for me, that ONLY Fujifilm does not have for video: have a single AF point on the frame, half press, track the subject. No more worries tracking a person in frame, with a lot of people behind. Ths X-S20 have (kinda of a lot) things better in my opinion: open gate, Film Simulation for stills, AF joystick, maybe a better IBIS (some user reports are saying that is much better for video now). But the video AF in the Fujis is currently my worse problem - and looks like that a general tracking in video will never be implemented. And there are some user reportings emerging about overheating in video with the X-S20. Will test when mine arrives. But reliable AF in a rangefinder body is starting to make me thinking about Sony.

Don´t remember if I already asked you: I know that 32-bit float give a lot of room (in fact, almost make it impossible) to sound do not clip. But if the sound already comes clipped from the microphone (recording a loud concert that exceeds the SPL of the mic), the recovering of the clipping is impossíble, right?

Yep, I'm a (each time less) "enthusiast" 🙂 If this is my work, for sure would be using FF too. But just want to get good images, document family and trips. And when you're travelling and want to shoot on streets, nothing better than a "rangefinder" - noboy cares. You pull a DSLRish camera, everyone start to notice and get grumpy. And is perfect to record concerts, never was barred by security with a GX. Already said that a GX10 with a decent EVF, 10 bit video (even with 30 min limit) and PDAF would be a perfect camera for me. But...each day becomes more clear that m43 for Panny looks like GH and (maybe) a G9 sucessor. No more GXs. For OM Digital, god only knows. Lenses - only big Pro ones. All that I don't want. Waiting for my X-S20, arrives in a 2 or 3 weeks. Not rangefinderesque, but small enough to be perceived as a P&S. Solved or mitigate most of the problems that I have with the X-S10 (horrendous battery life, better af, better IBIS, with 10-bit I finally could try F-log), but kept one of the worst problems, common to all Fuji: no old school object tracking in video. In which Sony is very good. Than Sony releases a rangefinderesque camera with better ergos, amazing AF, probably the same sensor in a Bayer version...for sure not now, but in the future, could make me switch. Still hoping that Fuji hire some Olympus guy for IBIS and some Sony guys for AF, but is just hope.

And good parts of the body, judging from the first image leaks in Sonyalpharumors. Sony are completely tools for me, zero feeling. But this one get my attention - a "rangefinder" body (which looks like, with the looking death of the GX line by Panasonic, and the rumors that there will not be a X-E5 from Fuji, will be the only one in the market, together with the A7C), good AF, dual dials (finally)...

Update: pre-ordered it, probably will be in my hands around July 15th. Recording a school party of my daughter was the decisive point: can't stand the battery life of the X-S10 anymore. Taken 15 stills, made two 4k24p videos (both around 6 minutes), and the first battery was already with one bar. Just hoping that I don't get tempted for the upcoming A7600 from Sony.