jgharding

it seems to vary camera to camera, the whole 8-bit vs 10-bit thing,

Like Panasonic S1H the 8-bit in vlog has the weird banded magenta thing and can render it unusable, Sometimes even in non-vlog profiles, but the 10-bit is great.

But the 12-bit BRAW for the Video Assist is just excellent! Such a huge jump up if you're going to do keying and heavy grading and so on.

5 minutes ago, Stab said:

Yea, I would buy an S1H if it wasn't for all the people complaining about corrupt .mtd files, camera freezes, etc. I also had those with my 3 S1 bodies. Many times and I was furious when it happened during weddings. But since I changed to CFexpress recording, I have no more problems. The S1H does not have that option, only SD-card recording. Which frankly, I don't dare to use anymore on paid gigs. Especially weddings...

Now there are many people without problems, but some never had problems and then all of a sudden, boom, a corrupt file. Did you ever have anything happen?

The Facebook groups of 'S1 and S1 users' are full of those posts.

Again, a great point I forgot about. I did have two of these, and now I record on Ninja V exclusively, so had forgotten, but yes it's a travesty. To allow this in their top DSLM body and just not address it other than tell people to buy new cards, then start blaming card manufacturers etc... it was all terrible.

I just switched to Ninja and carried on. There's no visual gain from ProRes at all, even if you push the footage into a pixelly mess of colour it's the same, you just have bigger files and slightly easier compatibility.

I'd prefer to use internal but I don't trust it, so yeah I see what you're saying.

The Ninja is a good tool regardless, but I wouldn't want to carry it around for a wedding, you'll wanna stay light I guess? I've never shot a wedding.

27 minutes ago, Stab said:

I don't think I'll need another camera for the next couple of years.

I own 2x S1 and 1x S5 at the moment, and they are exactly what I  need at the moment.

The only 'downside' is that the camera's can't record 4:2:2 10-bit and full frame at 50 fps. But, I have now invested in anamorphic lenses and these camera's offer great anamorphic support. In camera desqueeze and even the IBIS takes the squeeze factor into account. Also nice is that the 4:3 crop of the sensor is a bit higher than the normal S35 / APS-C crop (and slightly narrower) and that means that the crop factor when shooting a 1.33x anamorphic lens is reduced with about 20% as opposed to shooting in s35 mode. That's close to APS-H territory which is IMO, all you need for video.

Add to that the great photo quality and decent AF (for photography), the relatively small filesizes, the great DR when shooting in V-LOG 10-bit and the price... I really can't complain.

Well if I have to complain, it's the lack of an OLPF. 

Anamorphic support is downright amazing on the S series, i don't think there's much more you could ask for, it really is the best!

Yes the lack of OLPF actually made me send the S1 back and get the S1H, it drives me mad, i despise moire and somehow interview subjects always pick the worst clothes. I was able to refund the S1 and get a second hand S1H for not too much more. S1H also fits the Tilta cage way better.

Do keep an eye on second hand S1H prices, 2500£ or so isn't uncommon now for the body in great shape

8 hours ago, TomTheDP said:

The S1H is quite fantastic. The only need it doesn't fill for me is VFR. Once Panasonic puts something out with a good 120p I'll be set. 

Good point, it is limited in high speed, 50 and 60p are APSC crop and 120 is 1080p. The crop I'm used to from a previous Red, so i keep wider options around, but yeah it'd be great if they can give use everything obviously, like full-frame 120p and functional video AF....

 

I got an S1H before lockdown, it's not been used a lot but will pay for itself in some time.

I've been on the Red Komodo pre-order list for 4 months or so with no word. TBH I may cancel it as work is light. I'll see how I feel when i finally get the "do you want to complete your order sir?" call...

The S1H for me is like a baby Alexa, such a good image. But I prefer Komodo post pipeline due to the raw codec and global shutter. That's it though, TBH the S1H is better for everything else. Maybe I will cancel it TBH, seems like there's little benefit at the moment.

I got an S1H before lockdown, it's not been used a lot but will pay for itself in some time.

I've been on the Red Komodo pre-order list for 4 months or so with no word. TBH I may cancel it as work is light. I'll see how I feel when i finally get the "do you want to complete your order sir?" call...

The S1H for me is like a baby Alexa, such a good image. But I prefer Komodo post pipeline due to the raw codec. That's it though, TBH the S1H is better for everything else. Maybe I will cancel it TBH, seems like there's little benefit at the moment.

I think it's less to do with the sensor than it is the processing after the fact. Sony have a particular look, prioritisng blue and sharpness, for me that's the opposite of what I want most of the time. Canon have a big red boost in general. Of the Japanese companies Panasonic are the most neutral to my eyes.

The same sensors in other bodies work wonders, so Sony are just doing their odd thing in their cameras.

Most of the younger generation are really into 3D and game engine now, it seems. I guess it's quite a bit more accessible too in some ways, with lots of free software and the limit being imagination, you don't have to use real lights and so on. It's also a far bigger industry in money terms and userbase than film and TV, so I think keeping new generations interested will also be a challenge if the prices keep rising.

Since the small fan in the S1H works so well, i do wonder why no other manufacturer does this to alleviate overheating. It adds a little size, but it's a great idea...

This looks ace, I would much prefer a 17-inch version though, as a 13inch screen is very small for working on...

then again i guess they'll just put a 3080 in the laptop for that... but i had heard about the low powered laptop 3080s being WAY slower than desktop models. And this one has the external one which I guess is desktop spec... hmmm

He is so scary in Sexy Beast. That and Paddy Considine in Dead Man's Shoes are some of favourite intense performances.

52 minutes ago, herein2020 said:

It will be great if they ever get the Fusion integration right. As it stands now its an endless source of frustration. I'm always waiting for things to cache and the performance is terrible, simple things like Fusion titles cause the whole program to stutter, anything changes above or below a Fusion comp and the caching starts all over again..etc. etc. I think by DR20 they will have it where it needs to be. The rest of the program is already fantastic.

Yes it's not quite online yet is it? But it is phenomenally powerful... I recently used it to comp in some real VHS distortion using it as a luma displacement map, i had no idea whether I could, googled it, took 10 minutes on YT tutorial and it was done!

With an RTX3080 that was basically realtime. But it needs work for sure. It loves crashing.

It's a great bit of software. There's no need for a dongle any more, if you have two machines activated and try a third it just de-registers the others, so it's all automatic.

The "Cut" page makes no sense to me, and remember that Fusion is a distinct piece of software that they've bolted in, so it's more like learning After Effects than a bit of an NLE.

But yeah I recently tried Premiere again out of curiosity and the terrible stability etc meant i didn't last long in it.

I considered it but once I got a PC with a Ryzen and an RTX3080 the idea became a bit silly.

I fear Apple's love of just dumping software and other things with no notice.

1 hour ago, Parker said:

By "HW" updates are you meaning new, physically different cameras with new hardware? I'm not sure how many people market-wise are buying into the new L-cameras (anecdotally, several work buddies and colleagues just purchased the S5) but I am thrilled about my S1, especially with the recently announced firmware update coming sometime in Q1 of 2021, which means I'll get internal 6k, anamorphic modes and pro res raw via the ninja v. I literally won't need a new camera for years to come. Amazing dynamic range, really good ibis for handheld work, big, bright EVF, very reliable low-light dual-ISO, gorgeous stills, great battery life, and built like a tank. 

A lot of people care about autofocus, but I love my vintage contax zeiss lenses and they're what I prefer to use anyway so it doesn't matter to me. Plus if I really need it I can just pick up a nucleus nano and the fancy new ToF sensor from @BTM_Pix and voila, AF problems solved. 

Yeah I'm using the S1H and Nucleus Nano, the stills are amazing and the high-res photo mode is exceptional for still subjects, Vlog images are beautiful, and though Ninja V RAW is of limited use TBH it's still nice to have 

I think the issue is... how many of us are there? For me this is the best image available outside of Red and Arri, but are there enough of us who want it to keep them making these cameras?

On 11/27/2020 at 11:22 PM, BTM_Pix said:

Sad news indeed.

The problem is that with floor space at €400 per square metre before you've so much as put a piece of carpet down let alone build it out and staff it then spending €100 a pop on DHL to round trip a loan unit to thirty YouTubers that are hungry for gear to review is a no brainer for them.

As most products are lucky to have a buzz that lasts beyond two weeks of initial excitement anyway then doing it this way lets manufacturers own these short periods rather than having to share them with every other new product launch as they would at an exhibition.

UK visitors to European exhibitions also make up quite a sizeable portion of the overall attendance (15% at IBC for example, second only to the 18% of the host country) and that is about to get far more complicated after 1st of January.

The days of popping over to Amsterdam or Cologne on EasyJet and waltzing through immigration and being at the RAI or Messe 45 minutes later with your grubby paws on new cameras will sadly be a thing of the past as you'll need a visa to get in to the country in the first place and a work visa if its a trade show.

 

When you do shows in the USA the crazy union racketeering is amazing too. Like charging you thousands of dollars to move a pallet of stuff 100ft, or $200 to hire a $20 chair for three days, or demanding that a union registered man stand next to you at a charge of $1000/hr if you want to film something (at one particular show).

It's a phenomenally corrupt business the trade show shebang. The people make it fun, everything else around it is s chore.

That electronic ND is the best though, really wish it was in every camera.

On 11/18/2020 at 9:45 PM, IronFilm said:

WHAT??? Why on earth would RED leave that out.  

I believe they've moved to a DCT implementation of MJPEG, I'm guessing it'll have something to do with the processing requirements for wavelet vs battery life with such a little camera running on Canon BPs

In theory it means you could see macroblocking at higher compression settings. I just haven't seen enough torture-test footage to know though.

There's nothing here that beats the S1H I love and use in normal shooting apart from that electronic ND, it's a pretty disappointing offer.

TBH if I were gonna go up to this sorta price I'd get the Red Komodo and enjoy the genius codec again, I'll bet it thrashes the Sony on IQ

EDIT: I did a bit of research and the Komodo doesn't use RedCode wavelet compression like most Reds. Sigh. nothing is simple now...

this all looks great!

But if you STILL can't reorder audio plugins in fairlight I shall be very disappointed...

It was a pleasure, thanks for having me!

I do love having and listening to long conversations like this, so I'm looking forward to future episodes too!

There's nothing with Arriraw per say, but it is pretty big files, which can be a problem for smaller productions. Redcode goes nice and small.
 

ALEXA SXT Open Gate (3424x2202)ARRIRAW (.ari):

11.5 MB/frame & 996 GB/hour

ARRIRAW-HDE (.arx):

6.9 MB/frame & 598 GB/hour

ALEXA LF Open Gate (4448x3096)ARRIRAW (.ari):

20.9 MB/frame & 1.80 TB/hour

ARRIRAW-HDE (.arx):

12.5 MB/frame & 1.08 TB/hour

12 hours ago, kye said:

When you say 'compression', what are you referring to specifically?  Bit-rate? bit-depth? codec? chroma sub-sampling?

Not really referring to a specific aspect, just the pliability of the image.

Codec implementations are more than the sum of their parts so it's a little bit of a 'war of attrition' to try and pin it down to a number.

All of those things contribute to the pliability of the image. I'm just stating that in general, less-compressed images survive more alteration.

Red's codec is obviously the best here, raw data plus masses of compression and still holds up to abuse. But then the image characteristic of Arri is preferable to me despite ProRes being the most practical codec in there.

If the phrase "thick" and "thin" is this hard to define, perhaps it's better to use different ones whe you're to communicate the nature of an image. These words seem to be open to interpretation and sort of fail to communicate clearly as a result.

I always think of it as related to compression TBH, AKA how much you can push colour around and have things still look good.

C100 with external recorder for example looked way better than internal, cos the colours didn't go all "thin" and insipid if you pushed it about, 

Trying to white balance adjustments on over-compressed footage results in a sort of messy colour wash. I think of this as "thin", the opposite as "thick"

If the S1H would just output Braw i'd go and buy a blackmagic recorder...

Format wars are so tedious