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Playing with Sony A7R II - here's my fav picture profile - post yours


Ed_David
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Messing with the A7R II - good, but I would wait if you can till the A7S II - rolling shutter issues.  Also save some cash. 

 

Here's my receipe that I'm liking:

COLOR MATRIX  - Pro, not s gamut - reds feel more red

COLOR GAMMA - CINE4, not slog - cleaner highlights.  Slog2 looks weird with an 8 bit codec how it gets noisy in highlights
Black Level: 0
Black Gamma > Range: Middle , Level: -3
Knee > Mode: Auto , Auto Set > Max Point: 95 , Sensitivity: Mid
Colore Mode: Pro
Saturation: +8
Color Phase -2
Color Depth > R+1, G-1, B+2,, C-2, M-1, Y-3
Detail > Level, -5 Adjust > Mode; Manual, V/H Balance: -2, B/W Balance Type3, Limit: 0, Crispening:0, hi_light Detail: 0

White balance > Manual > Grid setting B 1 (one to the left)
You don't have to follow it perfectly, but overall it can get to some stunning results.

And the secret to any log recording is post.  Use film convert.  filmconvert.com.  Or impulz luts.  Select slog 2 - modify it - less contrast - less of a curve since it's less flat as s log 2

I used Film Convert Arri Alexa Log C profile for grading. FilmConvert setting is Arri Alexa as the camera. logC. film stock is Fuji Film 8543 Vivid. color 93. curve 100. size 35mm full frame. grain 0.  But just mess around - find what you like.

Have fun!

And everyone post your own.  Together we can help each other improve.  That's what it's all about - using the Hive to get better.  Get knowledge, give knowledge.

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EOSHD Pro Color 5 for Sony cameras EOSHD Z LOG for Nikon CamerasEOSHD C-LOG and Film Profiles for All Canon DSLRs

Thanks Ed. 

I am very curious to play with the Knee parameter for better highlight roll off. 

Is the knee being used in your setup? Cause here is what the manual says and I am not sure what "Mode" refers to:

Knee
Sets knee point and slope for video signal compression to prevent over-exposure by limiting signals in high intensity areas of the subject to the dynamic range of your camera.
When selecting [Still][Cine1][Cine2][Cine3][Cine4][ITU709(800%)][S-Log2] in [Gamma][Knee] is set to [Off] if [Mode] is set to [Auto]. To use functions in [Knee], set [Mode] to [Manual].
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opps maybe not - thanks for looking into that!  boom, the internet wins again.  yes should help roll off slightly

good to get to image manupulatino before it goes to card and gets knocked down to 4:2:0 - I think at this earlier stage you are playing with a 4:2:2 image.  Don't know if its 10 bit before it gets recorded but seems to be best to work on it while in camera before card

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Messing with the A7R II - good, but I would wait if you can till the A7S II - rolling shutter issues.  Also save some cash. 

 

Here's my receipe that I'm liking:

COLOR MATRIX  - Pro, not s gamut - reds feel more red

COLOR GAMMA - CINE4, not slog - cleaner highlights.  Slog2 looks weird with an 8 bit codec how it gets noisy in highlights
Black Level: 0
Black Gamma > Range: Middle , Level: -3
Knee > Mode: Auto , Auto Set > Max Point: 95 , Sensitivity: Mid
Colore Mode: Pro
Saturation: +8
Color Phase -2
Color Depth > R+1, G-1, B+2,, C-2, M-1, Y-3
Detail > Level, -5 Adjust > Mode; Manual, V/H Balance: -2, B/W Balance Type3, Limit: 0, Crispening:0, hi_light Detail: 0

White balance > Manual > Grid setting B 1 (one to the left)
You don't have to follow it perfectly, but overall it can get to some stunning results.

And the secret to any log recording is post.  Use film convert.  filmconvert.com.  Or impulz luts.  Select slog 2 - modify it - less contrast - less of a curve since it's less flat as s log 2

I used Film Convert Arri Alexa Log C profile for grading. FilmConvert setting is Arri Alexa as the camera. logC. film stock is Fuji Film 8543 Vivid. color 93. curve 100. size 35mm full frame. grain 0.  But just mess around - find what you like.

Have fun!

And everyone post your own.  Together we can help each other improve.  That's what it's all about - using the Hive to get better.  Get knowledge, give knowledge.

hi Ed!!! thank u for sharing this. i am new to shooting slog2 and your posts have been v helpful to me ?

what you pointed out about cine 4 vs slog is v interesting. i just got an rx10m2 and i havent noticed noisy highlight areas with my slog2 settings but ill have to check that out... in your experience, does this vary with exposure? ive been exposing for my highlights, basically setting the clipping point in camera just where i want it to be; but this is only the beginning of my testing

anyway, not being limited to the slog native iso of 800 on my lil cam would def be handy so im gonna try some cine 4 stuff~!!! thank u!!

 

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Hi Ed, 

How do you like the A7R II so far ? I didn't have a chance to play with it yet, but I haven't been convinced by the colors - especially skin tones - the camera produces (compared to Samsung NX1 for instance). 

I would be very much interested in your opinion : )

Thanks !

 

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I think it looks very similar to a7s but better for stills because of extra size of photo sensor I think - but i messed with it so quickly

I still think to wait for a7s II if you can

samsung nx1 is great - it surprises me more every day- i mostly just use it as a scouting camera.  the a7r ii and a7s has more dynamic range but there is a punch in resolution to the image of nx1 - but i still like the color better out of the a7s and a7r ii

i look forward to the next round of the samsung camera

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I think it looks very similar to a7s but better for stills because of extra size of photo sensor I think - but i messed with it so quickly

I still think to wait for a7s II if you can

samsung nx1 is great - it surprises me more every day- i mostly just use it as a scouting camera.  the a7r ii and a7s has more dynamic range but there is a punch in resolution to the image of nx1 - but i still like the color better out of the a7s and a7r ii

i look forward to the next round of the samsung camera

Thanks Ed : ) 

Also  I got to watch your video in Cuba, that was amazing work ! 

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Messing with the A7R II - good, but I would wait if you can till the A7S II - rolling shutter issues.  Also save some cash. 

Why? Because of rolling shutter in crop mode at a7S levels... OK ;-)

 

And...

How would you do if you have large prints to put it out there?! You got it? The point is people think for themselves. People tend to ignore the needs of others. There's also something else: filmmakers are yet like the still photographers some years ago, refusing the media convergence, why? Why to try go figure hybrid concept is a piece of crap instead? Or actually a threat...? To my eyes, RED was not much of a revolution in the end, with or without their contribution to the democratization for (new) industry standards in hands of many; HDSLR -- now FF 4K/8K mirrorless camera à la VistaVision/Medium format, it is.

 

- E.

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  • 4 weeks later...

After spending enough time with the camera this is the profile that I have settled with. Very pleasing skin tones, minimal banding and easy for slight grading. 

Gamma: Cine 4, but I switch to Cine 2 in low light. Sometimes I also use S-log in very strong light people far away but I try to avoid it. With a face close up Cine 3 is very good too. 

Color mode: Cinema. Pro gave me too saturated colors. Maybe it will be nice in nature. Avoid s-gamut unless you are using an external recorder and you are very confident with your color grading abilities. Also keep in mind that colors change depending on the exposure so make sure you are exposing consistenly (very hard to do with the LCD in s-log more). 

Black level: 0. Black is black. 

Black gamma: middle. 

Knee: Manual 97.5% -1. This is optimized for a slight highlight roll off. Set the percentage lower for strong contrasts. 

Saturation: 0. Lower this if you plan to play with the colors later.  

Color Phase: 0. I trust sony on this one.

Color Depth: 3,0,0,0,0,0. Just a touch of red. 

Detail: -3.  A bit more organic. 

 

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After spending enough time with the camera this is the profile that I have settled with. Very pleasing skin tones, minimal banding and easy for slight grading. 

Gamma: Cine 4, but I switch to Cine 2 in low light. Sometimes I also use S-log in very strong light people far away but I try to avoid it. With a face close up Cine 3 is very good too. 

Color mode: Cinema. Pro gave me too saturated colors. Maybe it will be nice in nature. Avoid s-gamut unless you are using an external recorder and you are very confident with your color grading abilities. Also keep in mind that colors change depending on the exposure so make sure you are exposing consistenly (very hard to do with the LCD in s-log more). 

Black level: 0. Black is black. 

Black gamma: middle. 

Knee: Manual 97.5% -1. This is optimized for a slight highlight roll off. Set the percentage lower for strong contrasts. 

Saturation: 0. Lower this if you plan to play with the colors later.  

Color Phase: 0. I trust sony on this one.

Color Depth: 3,0,0,0,0,0. Just a touch of red. 

Detail: -3.  A bit more organic. 

 

Why not detail all way down?

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No, but I can't say I was looking for it. Also keep in mind that I come from E-M1 and BMPCC before that so aliasing is not an issue for me ;)

I guess you'll find it, though. Have you also shot in FF? Or mainly S35? BMPCC shows moiré, anyway... :(

How have you felt the difference coming from much higher than 8-bit? :d

 

Why a7RII instead? Stills worth the trade?

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I guess you'll find it, though. Have you also shot in FF? Or mainly S35? BMPCC shows moiré, anyway... :(

Mostly FF. S35 only for low light, fast zoom, landscape shots.

How have you felt the difference coming from much higher than 8-bit? :d

Major differences are: 1. Worse noise quality 2. More banding 3. Less color depth.  

Why a7RII instead? Stills worth the trade?

I shoot stills mostly with the D800. Not that much difference in terms of picture quality as far as the sensor goes. But because of the IBIS, electronic first curtain and the sharp 55 1.8 Zeiss, the difference is dramatic. 

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Mostly FF. S35 only for low light, fast zoom, landscape shots.

Major differences are: 1. Worse noise quality 2. More banding 3. Less color depth.  

I shoot stills mostly with the D800. Not that much difference in terms of picture quality as far as the sensor goes. But because of the IBIS, electronic first curtain and the sharp 55 1.8 Zeiss, the difference is dramatic. 

Well, you have higher resolution with the new Sony's toy.

Bit depth also known as color depth, though, has several variables indeed. But, noise? I guess BMPCC is noisier.

And haven't you had trouble with aliasing/moiré going with FF?

I've found all the footage I've seen very disturbed, even if barely, with such issue. Haven't you?

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