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Andrew Reid

Evolving Sony A7S Review (Part 1)

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From video:

The A7S is clearly the end of my 5D Mark III...

[...]

It is clearly the beginning of the end for my Panasonic GH4...

[...]

The Sony A7S therefore has my highest recommendation

 

Looks like a sudden end of evolution of your "evloving review" :D

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Erik makes some great points

 

He certainly does...and he has had the camera longer than Andrew, I have read other reviews about the A7s that express similar sentiments as Erik feels, then theres the constant posts about trouble with skin tones, fidgety grading in the codec, inacurate colors, Jello, RS, problems using S-Log2 in lower ISOs higher light settings etc...

I cant help feelingt that Andrew is in the honeymoon stage (1 week with the camera is not long enough) and statements like end of 5D MK3, beginning of the end for GH4 come across as being a bit fickle to be honest.

Lets see how he feels (not that it would really influence my decision) after about 2 months of using it. :)

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Silly question:  when you use the APS-C mode do you get the depth of field of a super 35mm sensor?  Or is it same depth of field as full frame, just cropped?

 

Same depth of field as a super 35mm sensor yes, as it is the crop itself that changes depth of field because you have to reframe the shot to compensate for the narrower field of view.

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Erik makes some great points

 

He certainly does...

 

Really? 

 

His piece, especially the first half of it makes no logic sense. It makes him sound like yet another narrow-sighted gadget nerd. I agree with him about two pretty obvious things, though, that the piece is only his opinion, and that the A7s and himself aren't a good match. 

 

That's not the fault of the camera, though. It's merely tells us that the A7s is absolutely the wrong camera for him and for the likes of him. Which is fine, no camera is perfect, no camera can be a perfect fit for everyone, and there are plenty of other nice cameras around. 

 

 

 

I cant help feelingt that Andrew is in the honeymoon stage (1 week with the camera is not long enough) and statements like end of 5D MK3, beginning of the end for GH4 come across as being a bit fickle to be honest.

Lets see how he feels (not that it would really influence my decision) after about 2 months of using it.  :)

 

I can't help feeling that it's a matter of how you read the stories, and what your own inner wiring diagram looks like. He may or may not be in a honeymoon stage, but that's irrelevant. It's quite possible that Part 2 will have a different tone, but the relevant part about that is why and how.

 

If you read his entire piece with a pragmatic (enough) mindset, it was quite informative. The message that comes through is that in the 'right' (capable) hands the A7s is indeed capable of delivering fine and pleasant results, even pleasantly 'cinematic' even under lower light.

But that needs some work, as always, including getting familiar with the features of the camera and understanding how it works. And also trying to work around the quirks of the camera. And doing the necessary work both during shooting and after it. Which should be common practise with any camera, shouldn't it. 

 

You can create pretty pleasant looking footage with some other cameras, too, if you know what you're doing, but that's not the answer people are looking for, is it? 

 

I can't help but feeling that one of the issues people have with Andrew's story is that they read his piece with a typical enginerdy, I/O, either-or kind of mindset, which only want to see product X being either the best or crap, either better or worse than product Y, because choosing between X and Y will dictate the fate of one's cinematography. Automagically with a press of a button, of course.

 

Then, the moment they see Andrew considering the A7s being perhaps nicer a tool than the 5D3, or even the GH4 in certain areas, that's all they choose to see, and then they get blinded by that throughout the rest of the story. 

I also can't help but feeling that what peeks out of some of the comments is that questioning the authority of the Holy 5D3, that's blasphemy!  :)

 

But you shouldn't really worry, because the A7s is not likely to become a big mainstream hit. Mostly because it's not a Canikon, and because it "only" has 12 megapixels. No self-respecting pixel peeper is going to openly admit that he owns a FF camera with less than 36 megapixels. 

 

BTW, there is no such thing as "5D3 RAW." The RAW part is a 3rd party hack, not provided, authorised or endorsed by Canon. A regular 5D3 is another product. If you wish to participate in a length-peeing contest, doping your instrument won't take you to the podium. It only takes you on the top of the dunghill.

Just saying.  ;)

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Very interesting data from the video.  I appreciate Andrew's time and care to these matters.  Some intersting insight from Erik as well.  I think the only way to even discuss the 5d3 is in its raw mode, otherwise it clearly is out of favor with the BMPCC, GH4, or a7S.  To say otherwise is subjective.

 

The point about Erik being subjective and how it doesn't fit his particular criteria is valid and I agree.  However, it is still informative in the general sense of those who are on a budget and have to consider all options such as switching form Canon to Sony, and the costs to be incurred.

 

Gh4:

 

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Cheers for the review Andrew. Have decided to go in for the A7S and say goodbye to the Canon 5D for video. Used it as a B camera on a shoot in Berlin this weekend and for anything detail related it was awful. Using it exclusively for close ups is exhausting and limiting creatively. The sound of a super economic codec is a massive plus as RAW simply isn't an option for me cost wise at the moment.

Next up, any idea when it will land in Germany?

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Something wonky with the Sunset shots on the 5dmarkIII,

 

3:30 are you using ACR's highlight adjustments? That halo is weird and all the highlights look clipped. There should be enough information in RAW to do a nice roll off but you have to do it yourself.

 

3:42 holy! What did you do to the sun??! Huge blocking artifacts that look something like 4:2:0. 

 

Look how much better we can see into the shadows on the h264 5dmarkIII than the A7S. Do we conclude that the h264 has better dynamic range? ;)

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I agree with Quirky on a lot of his points. I'm not sure why 5D RAW comes into this at all... It's a massively different kettle of fish. Although I think it's ok to show how cameras such as the a7S can match it in perceived performance.

I'm very close to ordering an a7S because I want a different look and toolset compared with my GH3. Rolling shutter, weird record button, odd skin tones on a7S.... Doesn't faze me. There will be work arounds... Love to learn and just shoot.

I'll be renting the a7S first though. Don't know why more people don't try before they buy. Did this with the GH3. Loved it, bought it. Tried the BMCC, thought it was ok, didn't buy it. Same goes for pretty much everything.

Also... You can't judge a camera just by watching a few Vimeo clips and tests, as this depends on skill and creativity. It's cool to see it's capabilities in the right hands, but to write it off just because someone had filmed something with bad rolling shutter or yellow skin is a little silly. Love camera and what they can do.... I'm just more interested in the subject of the filming :)

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BTW, there is no such thing as "5D3 RAW." The RAW part is a 3rd party hack, not provided, authorised or endorsed by Canon. A regular 5D3 is another product. If you wish to participate in a length-peeing contest, doping your instrument won't take you to the podium. It only takes you on the top of the dunghill.

Just saying.  ;)

 

Jeez get off your trip, your coming off like a major tosser!!!

First off I dont own a 5D Mk3,  and I dont plan to buy one, 3rd I am no Canon Fanboy, 4th I know its the Magic Lantern Hack that created the RAW processing ability n the 5D Mk3...thats old news, its well known and I dont need to be told that from you.

Your attitude is totally condesending and superior and judging, all I said was Andrew is probably in the Honeymoon stage, and he probably is.

 

As far as Erik sounding like "another narrow-sighted gadget nerd" ...aren't we the great judge?...it must be nice to be so perfect as you seem to think you are,....and you are no button pressor either... only simpletons do that...right?

 

If Erik said something you approved of, you obviously would not say that, ...so you are conveying the same prejiduces that you just wrote a whole long and boring intellectual ramble about, basically saying that others are in this particular mindset that you yourself are displaying in your post in relation to Erik and others.

And as far as your totally condescending comment about people (on this forum) wanting things to happen with the press of a button...you dont know what I do (or anyone else for that matter)

But heres a hint...I design and write scripts and create 3d objects for world scenes that people (customers) press buttons in various host software packages and that makes things happen...and its not easy to do or learn.

So get over it, you dont know what people here are like or what they do...or anything else.

Leave your superior attitude  at home where it belongs.

People have different opinions, get over it, it doesn't mean they are gadjet nerds, button pressors, and therefore need to be instructed or corrected by you.

 

 

 

 

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Something to do with this review seems like BS, Because from Andrews review we see that the GH4's DR is much better than the 5d3... and these Graph in that linked review ways the GH4 has the lowest.

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The point about Erik being subjective and how it doesn't fit his particular criteria is valid and I agree.  However, it is still informative in the general sense of those who are on a budget and have to consider all options such as switching form Canon to Sony, and the costs to be incurred.

 

Gh4:

 

>

 Mokbel is phenomenal at capturing cinematic images with the GH4 color, DR, etc.

 

 

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As far as Erik sounding like "another narrow-sighted gadget nerd" ...aren't we the great judge?...it must be nice to be so perfect as you seem to think you are

 

I have no idea about being so perfect, because that's something or someone that only exists in your own imagination. It's your straw man.

 

Same goes for "judging" people. That's not what I'm interested in doing. Each to their own.

I only commented on what this guy named Erik actually said in his blog post. There was nothing personal. Feel free to agree or disagree on the actual matters, but personal attacks are unnecessary. It just makes it look like you either don't understand or don't care about the actual matters discussed.

 

So get over it, you dont know what people here are like or what they do...or anything else.

People have different opinions, get over it, it doesn't mean they are gadjet nerds, button pressors, and therefore need to be instructed or corrected by you.

 

Well boo hoo, Sherlock. Your opinion has been noted. 

 

 

Someone needs to come out with a battery grip add-on for the A7s but instead of it just being for an extra battery it would also be a 4k recorder....essentially giving you 4k that you can hold in one hand like the gh4.

 

Wouldn't that make it a brick á la the Panasonic YAGH (or whetaver)? 

Not a bad idea in general, though. A Ninja Star with 4K recording capabilities would be much nicer than a big brick. Be it with or without a screen.

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