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Nikon High End DSLR/Mirrorless Rumors


Dustin
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I think their "goose is cooked" as they say. They are not going to come out with some amazing new camera. It will only be catch up. OK it has 42mp or 50mp sensor, so what, they come out with a FF Mirrorless, so what, all been done already. They are not going to be some video camera leader either. So I think they are screwed. They have waited Way to long. Too bad.

I always associated them with having the best 35mm DSLR's years ago. Now I am not buying anything they have, or will have. You are going to be behind with them no matter what. Even their QC has taken a hit as late. I would be afraid to even buy a D750, or a D800 used figuring someone was trying to dump it. That is pretty sad when you think about it. Even the new D5 I think is worse DR wise than the old D4s. Whats up with that!

And their newest lens, you have to win the Lotto to buy one! They are tring to save their ass with lens profits. Yeah, that ought to work out well in the long run.  :grimace:

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12 minutes ago, webrunner5 said:

I think their "goose is cooked" as they say. They are not going to come out with some amazing new camera. It will only be catch up. OK it has 42mp or 50mp sensor, so what, they come out with a FF Mirrorless, so what, all been done already. They are not going to be some video camera leader either. So I think they are screwed. They have waited Way to long. Too bad.

I always associated them with having the best 35mm DSLR's years ago. Now I am not buying anything they have, or will have. You are going to be behind with them no matter what. Even their QC has taken a hit as late. I would be afraid to even buy a D750, or a D800 used figuring someone was trying to dump it. That is pretty sad when you think about it. Even the new D5 I think is worse DR wise than the old D4s. Whats up with that!

And their newest lens, you have to win the Lotto to buy one! They are tring to save their ass with lens profits. Yeah, that ought to work out well in the long run.  :grimace:

Fair points! Just thought I'd share in case someone hadn't seen it. I tend to be an optimist so I would hope that Nikon comes out with an attractive solution to rival Sony/Panasonic/Olympus latest offerings. Sure you are probably right given Nikon's latest history it will be "catch up" and probably has a high likelihood of just being average. But the optimist in me hopes for the best here-given that after their last report, their options were pretty much: ignore the trends, catch up, or fold. We shall see.

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Idk, the D500 has been named the best camera of 2016 by numerous sites and magazines. The 4K video out of that camera, although cropped, looks like the most pristine 4K image of anything in that price range.

If they put out a thousand dollar mirrorless, by definition alone it will be more video centric than their dslrs. Since they only seem to react to what Canon does, their next DSLR or mirrorless should have focus peaking, they already have zebras, mic input and headphone out... what more would they need?

About once a year I do a spring cleaning of equipment... cameras and lenses I acquire while I'm bored during my work's busy season. I shoot and correct, to decide which, if any to keep. This year I had quite a few to clean out, but I just cannot let go of the D5500. Every time I use the camera, I want to pull some hair out because it is so frustrating to use sometimes, but then I get those images into the computer and tweak that Flat Profile a touch or two and goddamn if it isn't the most cinematic image at that price range. If I could only afford one camera at $500 or less, the D5500 would be it... without question.

I just returned my a6500, and I was planning on getting the BMPCC as a replacement and although I still am planning to, after using the D5500 yesterday, the 4K from the D500 is calling me. I'm pretty sure I will stick with the BMPCC, but that Nikon Flat in 4K keeps whispering in my ear. If it were a few hundred cheaper, I would have ordered it by now.

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I would say its the time to voice your needs cause Nikon might be at their peak "listening to consumers" state. 

But would I go too far to say that most would like a mini D5 that shoots 24fps RAW with class leading CAF? That should cover both photographers and cinematographers :)

By the way A9 is coming as well so things will get very interesting (wallet unfriendly) soon. 

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So did Nikon ever absorb Samsung's NX line technology? I would think now would be the time to learn from that. If that wasn't the case then they certainly need to study the current crop of cameras that are killing it and then beat that.

3 minutes ago, Don Kotlos said:

But would I got too far to say that most would like a mini D5 that shoots 24fps RAW with class leading CAF? That should cover both photographers and cinematographers :).

As both a photographer and cinematographer that would be perfect. Give me a professional body that isn't ginormous, has good IQ, nice 4k Nikon Image w/ flat profile, doesn't have overheating issues (cough sony), at least 4k 60p and 120fps 1080p, IBIS and nice stills and we have a deal! IMO anyway. Also I'm curious as to when Nikon will unleash said new cameras.

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Well I am not saying the D500 is bad, it is a hell of a birder camera. The D5 is being outsold by the Canon 1dx mkII because of the video and the base DR is worse than the D4s. And also, it is a Canon. Trouble is Nikon had a chance to add killer video to both the D500, D5 and neither one is class leading, yeah they are great, but Not class leading. You have to hang your ass out in this day and age, and go for top dog, not second, to survive now. Nikon took the easy, safe way out. And they are paying the price.

Look what a chance they had with Canon F-ing up the crop factor on the 5D mkIV. If they don't strike right now they are an idiot on that mistake, well it was not a mistake on Canon's part, they wanted to protect their high end asses. BIG mistake! Nikon's move, but I bet they will take the easy, stupid way out.

If they screw up this year, they are done. They are way behind now, another notch down, and they are down alright, down for good I am afraid.

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We're in a strange time in the video market. A lot of these consumer cameras can be used for most segments of the video production market, but most camera below $2000 are in a neither here nor there position. They cater a little to everybody and not enough to anybody. 

I am only interested in these cameras for narratives. One of these days, sooner than later, I will start making one of the short or feature screenplays I've been writing and although there are plenty of options for cameras for NO BUDGET narratives, there are only a few that do not have an inherent video quality. In my opinion BlackMagic makes two of them, Nikon makes two (that I can speak for) and Canon (with the help of ML) has a couple on the used market.

Right now, BlackMagic is the only company that is making cameras, at an inexpensive price point, for the indie, no to low budget filmmaker. I would love to see Nikon, or one of the majors jump in on it and crush them... give me a Nikon with BlackMagic specs, a tilting LCD, Nikon Flat in prores and maybe some 5-axis IBIS for $1500 or less and I will sell off everything but my Nikkors. 

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4 minutes ago, mercer said:

give me a Nikon with BlackMagic specs, a tilting LCD, Nikon Flat in prores and maybe some 5-axis IBIS for $1500 or less and I will sell off everything but my Nikkors. 

I would say: Give me any camera with BlackMagic specs, a tilting LCD, Nikon Flat in prores and maybe some 5-axis IBIS for $1500 or less and I will sell off everything but my Fuji :) 

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But they won't do it, they must continue to make generic cameras that appeal to the masses. If video is as important a segment as most people on this forum believe ( I don't think it is to Nikon and Canon) they will evolve or die. But they have a hundred year legacy and lack of video functions won't kill off that legacy any time soon.

I was working in NYC a couple weeks ago. At the hotel, I was staying at, I spoke with a photographer who was covering the fashion show. One of my first questions was... Canon or Nikon? His reply... who cares about cameras... glass sells bodies.

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20 minutes ago, mercer said:

But they won't do it, they must continue to make generic cameras that appeal to the masses. If video is as important a segment as most people on this forum believe ( I don't think it is to Nikon and Canon) they will evolve or die. But they have a hundred year legacy and lack of video functions won't kill off that legacy any time soon.

I was working in NYC a couple weeks ago. At the hotel, I was staying at, I spoke with a photographer who was covering the fashion show. One of my first questions was... Canon or Nikon? His reply... who cares about cameras... glass sells bodies.

The masses??? huhm, didn't they stop buying dslrs/cameras and started using their phones?  Why is Nikon trying to appeal to the masses when the masses are perfectly happy with the Iphones, and android phones????

You spoke to a "photographer"??  A real, employed "photographer"?  I thought those things were extinct.  Didn't they all get laid off because of the digital camera revolution???  Hhahahha.. j/k...

Nikon has to compete in the same market place as Sony - the prosumer market.  If they continue trying to rely on sales of their low end digital camera, they are (as people are saying) "toast".  Canon is  trying this strategy and it's definitely causing them to lose money.  The difference is canon is bigger and has a bigger purse so they can continue to pursue this strategy for  a while.  Nikon on the other hand ---- not so much.

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6 minutes ago, Mattias Burling said:

So was the NX1 :)

Not saying they are going to close shop or go under just yet. But getting awards doesn't always help.

Very true, but in the market Nikon is concerned with, the idea that they aren't producing a great, competitive product isn't an accurate narrative either.

Btw, while I have your ear... so to speak... when you had the 750, did you test the HDMI out to a Ninja Star? Am curious what that ProRes image would look like.

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Just now, mercer said:

Very true, but in the market Nikon is concerned with, the idea that they aren't producing a great, competitive product isn't an accurate narrative either.

Btw, while I have your ear... so to speak... when you had the 750, did you test the HDMI out to a Ninja Star? Am curious what that ProRes image would look like.

True.

No I only recorded internally. All the reviewers I found who had used a Nika or similar said it wasnt much of a difference.

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3 minutes ago, eleison said:

The masses??? huhm, didn't they stop buying dslrs/cameras and started using their phones?  Why is Nikon trying to appeal to the masses when the masses are perfectly happy with the Iphones, and android phones????

You spoke to a "photographer"??  A real, employed "photographer"?  I thought those things were extinct.  Didn't they all get laid off because of the digital camera revolution???  Hhahahha.. j/k...

 

I guess not... he had a press pass and everything. Lol. 

I think Nikon is making the right move. They do not need the D3xxx line and probably not one of the D5xxx or D7xxx line either. They also can combine the D7xx and D8xx line as well. With the extra money, they can invest in a solid mirrorless line with 4K aps-c video. 

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11 minutes ago, mercer said:

Very true, but in the market Nikon is concerned with, the idea that they aren't producing a great, competitive product isn't an accurate narrative either.

Btw, while I have your ear... so to speak... when you had the 750, did you test the HDMI out to a Ninja Star? Am curious what that ProRes image would look like.

Most prosumer people are not interested in big bulky cameras...  or the perception of big, bulky cameras.  Most prosumer people are not going to war zones.  They are basically taking pictures/videos of their kids soccer game or their wife's portrait.  That is where the money is at.  Prosumer people want pictures/videos that are better than what an Iphone can create, but they dont' want the hassle of carrying a 7d, 750, 5d, cinema eos, d500, etc..etc.

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Sony was smart when they started making and referring to their sensors as Super 35mm. IMO, it was a nod to their video users, if Nikon makes a similar move with their supposed upcoming mirrorless line, it may mean they are going to start taking video a little more serious. If that's enough to save them in the long run... who knows. If it has the bells and whistles I want in a Nikon mirrorless... I'll be a customer. 

4 minutes ago, eleison said:

Most prosumer people are not interested in big bulky cameras...  or the perception of big, bulky cameras.  Most prosumer people are not going to war zones.  They are basically taking pictures/videos of their kids soccer game or their wife's portrait.  That is where the money is at.  Prosumer people want pictures/videos that are better than what an Iphone can create, but they dont' want the hassle of carrying a 7d, 750, 5d, cinema eos, d500, etc..etc.

Without a doubt, but most consumers don't want any camera, so since Canon and Nikon make the bulk of their money from their lenses, they make cameras for those lenses and who those lenses appeal to. Nikon isn't making a constant aperture 24-70mm zoom lens and charging over a grand for it arbitrarily. It's designed for the professional photographer or high end enthusiast. Potential iPhone consumers who want a camera isn't changing that. 

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If anything, I'd expect some Super! Exciting! New! 1-inch sensor! mirrorless cam announcements from Nikon that nobody wants and nobody will buy. Then again, Nikon has revealed time and time again that they only really care about what Canon is doing, so maybe they go all out and try to rival the marvelous *cough* EOS M, since Canon is doing so well with those, right? I'm afraid they're not going to make it, which, sadly, will let Canon become even more dinosaur with their pricing and innovation without a direct DSLR competitor on the market.

Don't get me wrong, I would love to see an awesome video-centric mirrorless Nikon just like the rest of you would, but I just don't think the video enthousiast market is big enough for these companies to bother with--or turn much of a profit on. We would all buy it, yes, but us camera/video/hybrid/mirrorless nerds are definitely not the most common demographic. Look at Canon, who happily ignores our pleas and survives and thrives with the intro-DSLR market, soccer moms and high school kids who go into Sam's Club or Best Buy and want to buy a "real camera". Most of the time the 18-55mm kit lens is the only one they ever use, and eventually it collects dust. Canon doesn't care, because that's their bread and butter! If Nikon is really planning to axe their lower-end camera lines, I just don't see that being a good move business-wise. Sure, there is higher mark-up and higher return on prosumer bodies, but also way less sales. Too little, too late, I'm afraid. 

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1 hour ago, Parker said:

Most of the time the 18-55mm kit lens is the only one they ever use, and eventually it collects dust. 

Isn't that the truth? It's amazing how many friends and friends of friends I've seen brag about "my new baby", only to see they are still just using the kit lens and using Photoshop to get that "blur effect". The masses don't care about specs they just want to take good pictures and see their favorite YouTubers using canons so they buy the Canon Video kit and think that's all there is to it.

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D500 was way overpriced for what it was (1) a B camera to the big Nikons, or 2) A camera for bird-ers), I do not think that ,except Mercer and 1) and 2), anyone else was interested in this camera and the crop is unbelievable it isn't a slight x1.1 crop, it is a X2.25 crop and no DCI 4K on a 20mgpxls sensor (smallest in APS-C land). Samsung camera does full sensor read out since 2014 on a 28mgpxls sensor and it's (I think) slightly less cropped NX500 costed 600euros kit new back then.

Fuji did the video leap in just one generation, I can't understand why Nikon do not go all in in video, they do not even have any other cameras to protect on video features! 

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