MrSMW

Personally I define 'professional' as in, 'sole or greater source of income', ie, nothing to do with quality of output or level of service.
A good amateur will generally always 'beat' a poor professional.
I have been watching a few lighting videos on the Tube recently and they are all over the place. There are some lesser known people producing some really nice stuff and then there are some labeled 'Masters of Light' demonstrating some simply hideous results. The latter may be professionals in respect of earning a living, but amateurish in regard to results!
I don't think there is anything wrong with charging low to get a foot in the door, - we all had to start somewhere and all did it.
I have no issue either with quoting low for an out of season job, mid-week or short notice when the difference is some welcome extra income vs nothing but retaining a pretentious elitist attitude. Nope, I will sometimes look at a job and say, "you know what, it's lower than I'd normally take, but in return for a few days work, I could buy that new expensive lens, a new mountain bike, take the family away for a week".

I am in the wedding business, photography & video and have mixed views on this.
First of all, there is a lot more competition. a LOT more. Since I started out close to 20 years ago, there are at least as 10x as many offering a service.
Also, the competition is a LOT better than it ever has been, both in quality of output and in regard to marketing it.
Video is less crowded than photography however as the learning curve is steeper and the production times longer, - less appeal for many ie, less see it as a fast buck, whereas with photography, everyone with a camera thinks they can do it.
Bollocks, it takes years and dozens of different scenarios to get really good at it. I came from 5 years of college and uni photography and reckon it took me nearly 8 years until I felt I really knew what i was doing without having to really think about it.
Then there is this 'race to the bottom'. It's been talked about for years and to an extent, it is true...but at the same time, not completely.
The trick of it is twofold.
First, you need to be offering something that is on another level to 'the rest'. I am not saying you need to be the best in the world, but better than anyone else they will probably look at. Ideally, you need to have a number of 'points of difference' and deliver this message with clarity. People have increasingly shorter attention spans.
Second, you need to be found by the type of people that are your clients. This may only be 1% of the entire market. Or less. If you are trying to appeal to all and catch fish with a massive net, you might actually be better off with a rod and fishing for one species only.
In regard to the latter, you can try and have a broad appeal and try to snag that 1% through the sheer volume approach or target your marketing and have a much smaller volume of contact, but a much higher booking rate.
I've found the latter works for me and prefer the 'larger fish in the smaller pond' approach works better.
Over the years, I have seen so many 'young bucks' come into the industry.
First of all they are full of enthusiasm and it drives them for a while and all that energy helps compensate for the relatively low prices most charge, fully intending to put them up once established.
They then try to do that and the work begins to dry up. Most then give up and go back to their 9-5 day job with all it's securities when they realise the reality is not swanning around the world at their clients expense and editing on a laptop in coffee shops.
One other thing I have found is that 'good enough' is not good enough and you need to go above and beyond simply to maintain your position. It's extremely easy to get sucked downstream and incredibly hard to swim upstream/against the current.
The latter can be done, but to get that extra 10%, often requires another 100% effort. Is it worth it? Maybe...
But yes, I 'lose' out sometimes to the sub 500 photographer who either promises the moon on a stick, or more often than not, don't and they (the clients) know they won't be getting much...but that exists in all kinds of services. Or the client deludes themselves that the cheaper option will work out for them only to regret it. Doesn't help us if they do however as folks rarely pay twice and in weddings, never.
To conclude, another couple of attributes any small creative business needs are a thick skin and a lot of drive/determination.
I would not want to be starting out in photography/video today knowing what I know and would persuade my daughter against it.
The bottom line though is that there IS a market still and a very good one but it's a case of finding the right one for you and working it. Continually. Just like an athlete, there are some people who are naturally gifted, but they can and will be beaten by someone with not so far off genetics that grafts harder then the rest.
Oh and one other thought, I have tried several times unsuccessfully to get into the commercial market and in the end gave up concluding I could just not make it work for whatever reason, so I plod along with weddings which I genuinely enjoy shooting. Not overly keen on the whole industry and what goes on behind the scenes, but that is another story...

I am in the wedding business, photography & video and have mixed views on this.
First of all, there is a lot more competition. a LOT more. Since I started out close to 20 years ago, there are at least as 10x as many offering a service.
Also, the competition is a LOT better than it ever has been, both in quality of output and in regard to marketing it.
Video is less crowded than photography however as the learning curve is steeper and the production times longer, - less appeal for many ie, less see it as a fast buck, whereas with photography, everyone with a camera thinks they can do it.
Bollocks, it takes years and dozens of different scenarios to get really good at it. I came from 5 years of college and uni photography and reckon it took me nearly 8 years until I felt I really knew what i was doing without having to really think about it.
Then there is this 'race to the bottom'. It's been talked about for years and to an extent, it is true...but at the same time, not completely.
The trick of it is twofold.
First, you need to be offering something that is on another level to 'the rest'. I am not saying you need to be the best in the world, but better than anyone else they will probably look at. Ideally, you need to have a number of 'points of difference' and deliver this message with clarity. People have increasingly shorter attention spans.
Second, you need to be found by the type of people that are your clients. This may only be 1% of the entire market. Or less. If you are trying to appeal to all and catch fish with a massive net, you might actually be better off with a rod and fishing for one species only.
In regard to the latter, you can try and have a broad appeal and try to snag that 1% through the sheer volume approach or target your marketing and have a much smaller volume of contact, but a much higher booking rate.
I've found the latter works for me and prefer the 'larger fish in the smaller pond' approach works better.
Over the years, I have seen so many 'young bucks' come into the industry.
First of all they are full of enthusiasm and it drives them for a while and all that energy helps compensate for the relatively low prices most charge, fully intending to put them up once established.
They then try to do that and the work begins to dry up. Most then give up and go back to their 9-5 day job with all it's securities when they realise the reality is not swanning around the world at their clients expense and editing on a laptop in coffee shops.
One other thing I have found is that 'good enough' is not good enough and you need to go above and beyond simply to maintain your position. It's extremely easy to get sucked downstream and incredibly hard to swim upstream/against the current.
The latter can be done, but to get that extra 10%, often requires another 100% effort. Is it worth it? Maybe...
But yes, I 'lose' out sometimes to the sub 500 photographer who either promises the moon on a stick, or more often than not, don't and they (the clients) know they won't be getting much...but that exists in all kinds of services. Or the client deludes themselves that the cheaper option will work out for them only to regret it. Doesn't help us if they do however as folks rarely pay twice and in weddings, never.
To conclude, another couple of attributes any small creative business needs are a thick skin and a lot of drive/determination.
I would not want to be starting out in photography/video today knowing what I know and would persuade my daughter against it.
The bottom line though is that there IS a market still and a very good one but it's a case of finding the right one for you and working it. Continually. Just like an athlete, there are some people who are naturally gifted, but they can and will be beaten by someone with not so far off genetics that grafts harder then the rest.
Oh and one other thought, I have tried several times unsuccessfully to get into the commercial market and in the end gave up concluding I could just not make it work for whatever reason, so I plod along with weddings which I genuinely enjoy shooting. Not overly keen on the whole industry and what goes on behind the scenes, but that is another story...

Actually Bob, yes and no...
Ruining the market? No, I don't think so, - there has always been 'Uncle Bob's' (or 'Friend Jane Who Does Photography and loves to top focus her kit lens based camera chimping religiously) and if anything, I have seen less of them in the last few years.
Maybe it's my market, (moderately high end but rarely the highest end) but I think it's more the case that the amateurs used to use a DSLR or decent bridge/compact but these days a phone takes such decent pictures but has more limitations, but whatever the reason, they seem less arsed than they used to be!
5 -10 years ago in the UK, there would typically be anything from 1-3 at every wedding trying to shoot the shit out of it and saying things like, "if I get in your way, just shout!". By the time I have to shout...as if I even would, it's too late mate and you already f*cked what might have been a key unrepeatable moment that I'm being paid for, earn a living from and feed my family with, but whatever.
I could tell you dozens of stories, but won't...
But anyway, does it ruin the market? Not really because generally if you have a client with a decent spend, the choice is rarely going to be pro tog at 3k or Uncle Bob at 0k, same as someone who can afford...and desires a new Audi/BMW/Merc is also not considering a used Hyundai in the same mix. Simply different markets...
The yes bit applies only to the fact that if you get one guest trying to shoot the shit out of a wedding, it only sets a precedent for others to have a go when they otherwise would probably not and it can all get out of hand very quickly. Video or photography and both are as bad as each other as the amateur videographer usually shoots far too close and is far too slow but the tog is bobbing up and down left right and centre and again, usually far too close.
I could show you a video from last Summer where one guy decided to step out into the aisle during the ceremony when there was a video camera on a tripod recording the entire ceremony from start to finish.
If you watched the whole thing (like I had to), you can see he looks back, spots the camera, hesitates, makes a conscious decision to do it anyway.
Short period of time, he does it again. A lady a couple of rows back watches him do this a couple of times and decides to do the same, also glancing back, spotting the camera but decides her snap is more important than the production that the couple who invited them and paid for them to be at their wedding have paid for.
By the time we got to vows and ring exchanges, we had a huddle stood completely obscuring the rest of the ceremony for the remaining 20 minutes or so. One small ripple became a tidal wave.
The only 'positive' I can think of is at least the couple can easily identify who completely f*cked their wedding video. Me,- well I am covered by contract as I have zero responsibility in regard to guest behaviour but the B&G were beyond incensed!
The bottom line for me is one of respect and etiquette. The few times I have been invited to a wedding as a guest, phone or compact only and I would not dream of getting out of my seat, or hanging around outside church waiting for the bride and her father to turn up, same as I would not turn up at someone's place of work on a Monday morning and start using their work computer or attending a board meeting.
But none of that has anything really in regard to losing a job to some low-ball quote!

I am in the wedding business, photography & video and have mixed views on this.
First of all, there is a lot more competition. a LOT more. Since I started out close to 20 years ago, there are at least as 10x as many offering a service.
Also, the competition is a LOT better than it ever has been, both in quality of output and in regard to marketing it.
Video is less crowded than photography however as the learning curve is steeper and the production times longer, - less appeal for many ie, less see it as a fast buck, whereas with photography, everyone with a camera thinks they can do it.
Bollocks, it takes years and dozens of different scenarios to get really good at it. I came from 5 years of college and uni photography and reckon it took me nearly 8 years until I felt I really knew what i was doing without having to really think about it.
Then there is this 'race to the bottom'. It's been talked about for years and to an extent, it is true...but at the same time, not completely.
The trick of it is twofold.
First, you need to be offering something that is on another level to 'the rest'. I am not saying you need to be the best in the world, but better than anyone else they will probably look at. Ideally, you need to have a number of 'points of difference' and deliver this message with clarity. People have increasingly shorter attention spans.
Second, you need to be found by the type of people that are your clients. This may only be 1% of the entire market. Or less. If you are trying to appeal to all and catch fish with a massive net, you might actually be better off with a rod and fishing for one species only.
In regard to the latter, you can try and have a broad appeal and try to snag that 1% through the sheer volume approach or target your marketing and have a much smaller volume of contact, but a much higher booking rate.
I've found the latter works for me and prefer the 'larger fish in the smaller pond' approach works better.
Over the years, I have seen so many 'young bucks' come into the industry.
First of all they are full of enthusiasm and it drives them for a while and all that energy helps compensate for the relatively low prices most charge, fully intending to put them up once established.
They then try to do that and the work begins to dry up. Most then give up and go back to their 9-5 day job with all it's securities when they realise the reality is not swanning around the world at their clients expense and editing on a laptop in coffee shops.
One other thing I have found is that 'good enough' is not good enough and you need to go above and beyond simply to maintain your position. It's extremely easy to get sucked downstream and incredibly hard to swim upstream/against the current.
The latter can be done, but to get that extra 10%, often requires another 100% effort. Is it worth it? Maybe...
But yes, I 'lose' out sometimes to the sub 500 photographer who either promises the moon on a stick, or more often than not, don't and they (the clients) know they won't be getting much...but that exists in all kinds of services. Or the client deludes themselves that the cheaper option will work out for them only to regret it. Doesn't help us if they do however as folks rarely pay twice and in weddings, never.
To conclude, another couple of attributes any small creative business needs are a thick skin and a lot of drive/determination.
I would not want to be starting out in photography/video today knowing what I know and would persuade my daughter against it.
The bottom line though is that there IS a market still and a very good one but it's a case of finding the right one for you and working it. Continually. Just like an athlete, there are some people who are naturally gifted, but they can and will be beaten by someone with not so far off genetics that grafts harder then the rest.
Oh and one other thought, I have tried several times unsuccessfully to get into the commercial market and in the end gave up concluding I could just not make it work for whatever reason, so I plod along with weddings which I genuinely enjoy shooting. Not overly keen on the whole industry and what goes on behind the scenes, but that is another story...

I am in the wedding business, photography & video and have mixed views on this.
First of all, there is a lot more competition. a LOT more. Since I started out close to 20 years ago, there are at least as 10x as many offering a service.
Also, the competition is a LOT better than it ever has been, both in quality of output and in regard to marketing it.
Video is less crowded than photography however as the learning curve is steeper and the production times longer, - less appeal for many ie, less see it as a fast buck, whereas with photography, everyone with a camera thinks they can do it.
Bollocks, it takes years and dozens of different scenarios to get really good at it. I came from 5 years of college and uni photography and reckon it took me nearly 8 years until I felt I really knew what i was doing without having to really think about it.
Then there is this 'race to the bottom'. It's been talked about for years and to an extent, it is true...but at the same time, not completely.
The trick of it is twofold.
First, you need to be offering something that is on another level to 'the rest'. I am not saying you need to be the best in the world, but better than anyone else they will probably look at. Ideally, you need to have a number of 'points of difference' and deliver this message with clarity. People have increasingly shorter attention spans.
Second, you need to be found by the type of people that are your clients. This may only be 1% of the entire market. Or less. If you are trying to appeal to all and catch fish with a massive net, you might actually be better off with a rod and fishing for one species only.
In regard to the latter, you can try and have a broad appeal and try to snag that 1% through the sheer volume approach or target your marketing and have a much smaller volume of contact, but a much higher booking rate.
I've found the latter works for me and prefer the 'larger fish in the smaller pond' approach works better.
Over the years, I have seen so many 'young bucks' come into the industry.
First of all they are full of enthusiasm and it drives them for a while and all that energy helps compensate for the relatively low prices most charge, fully intending to put them up once established.
They then try to do that and the work begins to dry up. Most then give up and go back to their 9-5 day job with all it's securities when they realise the reality is not swanning around the world at their clients expense and editing on a laptop in coffee shops.
One other thing I have found is that 'good enough' is not good enough and you need to go above and beyond simply to maintain your position. It's extremely easy to get sucked downstream and incredibly hard to swim upstream/against the current.
The latter can be done, but to get that extra 10%, often requires another 100% effort. Is it worth it? Maybe...
But yes, I 'lose' out sometimes to the sub 500 photographer who either promises the moon on a stick, or more often than not, don't and they (the clients) know they won't be getting much...but that exists in all kinds of services. Or the client deludes themselves that the cheaper option will work out for them only to regret it. Doesn't help us if they do however as folks rarely pay twice and in weddings, never.
To conclude, another couple of attributes any small creative business needs are a thick skin and a lot of drive/determination.
I would not want to be starting out in photography/video today knowing what I know and would persuade my daughter against it.
The bottom line though is that there IS a market still and a very good one but it's a case of finding the right one for you and working it. Continually. Just like an athlete, there are some people who are naturally gifted, but they can and will be beaten by someone with not so far off genetics that grafts harder then the rest.
Oh and one other thought, I have tried several times unsuccessfully to get into the commercial market and in the end gave up concluding I could just not make it work for whatever reason, so I plod along with weddings which I genuinely enjoy shooting. Not overly keen on the whole industry and what goes on behind the scenes, but that is another story...

I find that ebay generally works quite well for me.
I ignore virtually all questions as the folks that ask all the questions rarely purchase.
I also just set a buy it now price as I've burned myself on auctions with stuff going for a ridiculously low price.
Just make sure you set your restrictions which for me is anyone not in the UK or EU.
Generally, if it's a fairly mainstream item, it should sell quite quickly, - I find it's the stuff I found tricky to find to purchase that doesn't sell so well.
As an example, I bought a Ninja V but it didn't work out for me and as I was outside the 30 day return period, I stuck it on ebay with a BIN price very close to purchase and it sold within 24 hours. Which always makes me wish I'd asked a bit more, but there you go!

OK, slept on it and decided it's either going back because I can't get it to work, or possibly just going on eBay along with the SSD and docking port.
It's not just the issue I have had getting it to work, - that is more a case of 'the straw that broke the camel's back', but the battery chewing issue and other minor niggles that all add up to, "is it worth it to me?" and the answer on balance is not.
I think it's a superb bit of kit, build is exceptional etc, but not all things work for all people.
Hey ho, I tried!

Charlton Heston would have backed it had he still been around.

Charlton Heston was the spokesman for the NRA for years is the reason I think he mentioned him.

penis camera look like a serious product now

30? Still a child!
I have THE BIG 5 OH looming in less than 2 years...
But then I am a child myself to my mother (born 1945) as she is to her father (still with us) born 1916!
A lot of age (other than ultimate limitations due to age) is in the mind.
One of my brothers, not even 40, thinks his life is over because he does not have a successful career. Only another 30 working years to sort that one out!
I myself physically feel around 30, but then I do workout 6 days a week so a bit of a nutter in that department. A lady I was talking to recently did not believe I was older than 37. Yes dear, I actually am nearly 50.
Mentally, I feel around 30 also? Act like I'm 6 sometimes though...
Oh and dogs instinctively do want to chase cats, but they can be trained quite easily. We have 2 large rescue hunting dogs (terrible to train for most things other than sitting for food!) and one of them especially wanted to eat the already resident tiny cat, but now it's the 2kg kitty that rules the roost over the 30+kg dogs and they love her, even sleeping in the same bed sometimes.

I'm testing it on a XE3 this afternoon so I can report back tonight about the AF.

After 2 hours 59 minutes, I couldn't find any otters. So gave up.
Would have been fun and may still have a go, but currently my XT3 is with Fujifilm UK being fixed which is a very legit reason to be a loser.

So sounds like IBIS will be coming to the XT4...
The 33mm f1.0 though. This is one lens that on paper at least, I thought wow, but having seen the mock up of the thing, by gawd it's a bit too massive for my tastes!
Nailing focus at f1.0 is a tough enough gig as it is and how often would I really use it? I shoot my 56mm f1.2 wide open quite often and that's a near limit and I think if I wanted something wider for photo or video, I'd go Mitakon and manual focus. Plus a lot lot cheaper!

Google it! It's all over YouTube etc.
I'm not particularly interested in slating the guy, but he brings so much on his own head.
Ah well, he will probably have to take up being a photographer after all and start shooting weddings...

The man seems to be on something of a mission at the moment to sow the seeds of the destruction of his YouTube channel and therefore business. (Afghan Girl saga). Muppetry.

I agree, the Ninja V (or any quality external monitor, even something like the Feelworld) is a must for filmmaking.
At least to these 48 year old eyes. Especially in low light, I really struggle to see the LCD and if I don't have my glasses on, blurry mess at that!
I also rely heavily on AF as a 'hybrid' shooter sometimes needing to do both at the same time such as a bride & groom walking out of church down a confetti aisle etc. 
The XH1 was 'good enough' in this regard last year, but the XT3 for the one wedding I had it for and tried it out at the end of last season, was better. With the firmware upgrade in April, it should be excellent.
The fact that it also allows 10 bit 4.2.2 externally and a 500GB SSD so making the internal SD card a backup (and no Fuji has dual writing capability for video) is almost a 'bonus'!

Sounds like they're in full on troll / click bait / Canon shrill mode. 
 
Well as one of the youtube commentators said.... 

"They have already build a 500$ mirrorless full frame camera. And then they overpriced it to 1300$, because that's what they do."

Not in my experience...
I use the Sigma 18-35mm f1.8 with the Fringer Pro adapter on my XT3 and the face & eye autofocus is pretty zippy and accurate...and that's before the firmware update in I think April that makes it even more sprightly.
I don't use it for stills only video and think it's a great combo. Used it most of last year with an XH1 which was OK, but the XT3 has better AF.

Yeah I try to keep my gimbal as light as possible. Just the bare bones XT3 with 18-55 or a the 23mm f2 or 50 f2. I don't even use a monitor, though in some cases you'd need one. 

Everything gets so heavy when you do manual lenses plus follow focus and all that. Necessary for some work though.

Right now I have an XT3, XT2, and BM pocket camera. I do weddings so I need three cameras and its nice to have back ups for paid work. 

I went with Fuji as I like their color, means less work in post, sometimes no color work in post. Canon is great for color too but Fuji products offer a lot more for a lot less. Low light performance is a big plus as well as auto focus. 

The XT3 with a used kit lens 18-55, is the best bang for your buck right now I think. The 18-55 has OIS so you can do some handheld work too. If you don't need 10bit the Fuji XT30 with kit lens would be a good deal. You'd save $400.

I almost went with an XH1 as a second camera, but I really don't need IBIS. Especially because the Fuji IBIS is not as good as panasonic. Good as a tripod replacement but I don't mind just using a tripod. I may have gone with a Z6 but the color science isn't as pleasing and I couldn't afford buying two of them. I am very happy with the XT3.

Along with Fro, Northrup does my head in.

"You show me the perfect camera!!"
If they'd just but the internal organs of the XT3 into the body of the XH1 with a bigger battery et voila!
Maybe next year eh...?